EboMike- I agree and understand the part about the publicly traded company. Totally get that- Im referring to once the car is at the service center- why the secrecy? I was at my DS to take my model s in for service. They had a Model X in the bay and were prepping. I asked if I could see it- they said not- that they were under strict orders not to let anyone see the car. why? Im a reservation holder that has been patiently waiting for years. Im not allowed to see a car that at the service center? makes no sense.
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Someone's X prepping for delivery at Denver "secret location"
- Thread starter jsollender
- Start date
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
When I went to pick up my Roadster many years ago in Menlo Park, it had a huge sign on it that said 'Customer-owned car, do not touch'. Most of the X that we're talking about in service bays that are being prepped are also customer-owned vehicles.
If they were demo cars or CPO cars, I'd agree with you. But those cars will go to customers. They are not demos for reservation holders to examine - unless, of course, the owner is gracious enough to share.
Krugerrand
Meow
Makes all kinds of sense. Bonnie explained it wonderfully. Being a reservation holder doesn't give you special privileges to examine someone else's car. When there's a floor model/cpo X available at that location, then you'll be allowed to see it/examine it/touch it/smell it/whatever you need to do to help make your decision.
MichealW
Member
If one of these was my VIN and you reported it here I for one would be very excited and appreciative. Not angry I found out this way... My two cents.
Thanks for posting
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
If one of these was my VIN and you reported it here I for one would be very excited and appreciative. Not angry I found out this way... My two cents.
Thanks for posting
A lot of folks here would agree with you - but most of us would also agree that it is up to the owner, not popular opinion.
No-one is asking for special privileges. After the blackout and having ordered a car sight unseen its not too much to ask to walk up to a car and check it out. Not asking to sit in in and drive it. Just wanted to see it. Makes no sense.
Krugerrand
Meow
Yes, it does make sense. You just don't like the answer. It's not your vehicle to see, period, end of story. That's the decision of the owner, who is not you. Maybe ordering a car sight unseen doesn't fit your personality type.
If one of these was my VIN and you reported it here I for one would be very excited and appreciative. Not angry I found out this way... My two cents.
Thanks for posting
A lot of folks here would agree with you - but most of us would also agree that it is up to the owner, not popular opinion.
Back in December 2014 when my P85D was in the "early P85D delivery black hole," I personally was thrilled someone here on TMC spotted my car and my VIN with window sticker and all at the Devon service center.
So, I guess to each their own on the whole VIN thing. If you're mad that someone sees your car before you, you should be mad at every Tesla factory worker, truck driver making the vehicle shipments (and everyone who sees the cars on that truck along its route), service center staff, etc. Seems like a waste of madness to me. I mean, are you really worried that other people are going to see your car? I mean this is a car, right? You're going to drive it on public roads? Park it in public places occasionally? Is it invisible? (That'd be interesting...)
You can put a period, end of story but you still haven't given a rational reason why this is the case, why someone who is waiting for their car is not allowed to walk up and look at a car sitting in the delivery center. How is my viewing a car going to impact the ownership of the individual whose car it is. Im not arguing, just asking for an explanation that involves something other than because I say so.
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the only reason they do this is that they don't want people who are reservation holders to see the car and change their mind. They have sold the car on the mystique and many people have put blind faith in the car. Tesla is worried that if people actually see the car before they buy, they may not like the seats, may not like the lack of space, may see the flaws that have been coming off the line and cancel their order.
other than that- like I said- makes no sense.
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the only reason they do this is that they don't want people who are reservation holders to see the car and change their mind. They have sold the car on the mystique and many people have put blind faith in the car. Tesla is worried that if people actually see the car before they buy, they may not like the seats, may not like the lack of space, may see the flaws that have been coming off the line and cancel their order.
other than that- like I said- makes no sense.
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
I don't think anyone said 'because I said so'.
I can tell you from personal experience of showing my X (and I've heard similar from some other early X owners) that folks would say 'I just want to look at it' and the next thing I know, they are literally crawling OVER seats to see how hard it would be for their dog to do it or whatever. (And I'm freaking out a little - that's MY new car!!) I don't blame Tesla for having a consistent policy on this - my experience is that not everyone respects boundaries. That's not personal to you. That's a comment on how a large group of people behave. So you are trustworthy, but what about the other folks that 'just want to check headroom' and then leave a scratch mark in the car? And they hopped in before someone could stop them? They can say 'but you let this other guy do it'. And they'd be right. It's easier just to have a consistent policy to say customer cars are off limits.
I wish Tesla had the demo cars out on the floor for everyone. They should, no argument whatsoever. And yay to all the X owners who have been tirelessly showing their cars day after day to people waiting.
Bonnie- I can appreciate your comment. But considering that they don't have demo cars, don't have cars in the showroom, wouldnt it be a compromise to say hey- you can look at it but we cant open the door or allow you to look inside. To not even let someone look at the car....I mean, Ill say it again, makes no sense.
If you want to have that kind of strict policy- get some demo cars out there.
If you want to have that kind of strict policy- get some demo cars out there.
Krugerrand
Meow
Again, Bonnie explained this wonderfully. It's not your car and you have no idea how the owner of that car would feel. Respect that.
So what you are telling me is that this owner will never park their car in a parking lot because then other people would see it right? Again- other than saying its not my car and parroting the party line, there is no good reason to do this other than Tesla doesnt want people canceling their orders because they finally get to see the car in person and don't like it.
Krugerrand
Meow
No, it would not be a good idea to 'compromise' because people notoriously don't follow instruction, don't respect other's property and like to push the boundaries. Tesla has no way of knowing if you're that kind of a person and it would negligent of them to take that chance.
Tesla is working toward getting demo cars out there, but there are people waiting for their cars who don't need or want to see a demo, and might be of the thought process, 'stop building demo cars, just build me my car'. Everyone does not see the world as you do..
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For all you know the owner of that X might be a collector and that vehicle is going in their storage facility.
Im not expecting everyone to see the world as I do. Im having a casual rational discussion of which something you obviously are not capable of doing. Are you always this hostile? did you have a bad cup of coffee this morning? Or did someone pee in your cheerios?
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Right- a collector who doesnt own a founders or a signature car, but a random middle of the road vin number on a car whose value will be 25% of what it is in a few years is going to store the car. Makes perfect sense.
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Right- a collector who doesnt own a founders or a signature car, but a random middle of the road vin number on a car whose value will be 25% of what it is in a few years is going to store the car. Makes perfect sense.
I'm sure Tesla's reasons are even more nuanced than what Bonnie has so eloquently already explained. Yes, totally agree that some customers would not want others to be getting a first look at their new car (this should be reason enough). But more importantly, Tesla is going through some growing pains right now, and they don't want their customer's to go through a roller-coaster ride until they know when their vehicle will be ready.
Some vehicles require many weeks of QC, and having customers accidently learn that their vehicle is "almost" ready, then find out it is sitting in limbo for an indeterminate amount of time, is not a good experience. Plus, their delivery specialists are probably already busy enough without having to deal with hundreds of customer calls asking about the state of their vehicle (is it ready yet?).
Finally, I can't imagine that Tesla wants the world to get a glimpse of their internal issues and make an incorrect assessment from it. I totally understand the reason Tesla needs to improve their secrecy.
Some vehicles require many weeks of QC, and having customers accidently learn that their vehicle is "almost" ready, then find out it is sitting in limbo for an indeterminate amount of time, is not a good experience. Plus, their delivery specialists are probably already busy enough without having to deal with hundreds of customer calls asking about the state of their vehicle (is it ready yet?).
Finally, I can't imagine that Tesla wants the world to get a glimpse of their internal issues and make an incorrect assessment from it. I totally understand the reason Tesla needs to improve their secrecy.
That's different. When you order food in a nice restaurant, you don't want all customers to storm into the kitchen and leer over your food (even if the cook asks them not to touch it). Once it's served and on your plate, it's okay if people take a peek.
There's a special thing about getting your car fresh from the factory, it's like having a nice meal served in front of you. You don't want anyone to spoil that for you.
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
No, I didn't say anything even remotely like 'the owner will never park their car in a parking lot'. I have no idea how you interpreted my words that way. Nor am I parroting some party line. Some people like to wait to open their presents on Christmas morning. Others don't care. Neither is wrong. But I wouldn't tell either to change.
Not my car, so I won't tell the owner how they should feel. That's all I'm saying. I totally understand that YOU want to see an X. I don't blame you. But demanding to see someone else's car before they take delivery, not Tesla's car, is not something that you or I have a right to do (imo, clearly many disagree with that). That's up to the owner to decide. That is all I'm saying. Their right to decide. It has nothing to do with if you'd mind or not.
Hmmm... I agree with you in principle, in practice I would side with Tesla. The delivery team at the service center is in charge of getting that car into the hands of its new owner in the best shape it possibly can be. I know if I were tasked with that job, I would not let anyone other than my team/ employees or the car's rightful owner within 50 feet of it. Even if you know they just want to look at it and not touch. Behind closed doors in a service area, where customers typically are not allowed anyway, or behind a fence in a holding lot, even better. Having spent time around a lot of car dealerships myself, I can say this is common practice anyway. As soon as a car is pulled for a customer, it's a total hands-off situation for everyone else. Some dealerships don't subscribe to that theory and it sucks.
I'm pretty sure it has nothing to do with not wanting to let people see the car. It's about liability and and maintaining a consistent policy for delivery and the handling of new vehicles. If they didn't want people to see the cars, they wouldn't be offering the Meet the X tour. Even with that, they're not even taking the time to address damaged seats and FWD sensor issues.
Of course once a customer takes delivery, it's going to be out in the wild with people touching it, peeking into windows, trying to inspect the inside. It's going to be a problem actually, at least until the car becomes more common. My wife is stressing out about the FWDs and opening them in public. In a way I am too, I'm not really a people person. I have no trouble showing it to friends or other like-minded people on these forums or such, if something is arranged. However, that's the worst thing about driving flashy cars or collectors cars or whatever -- the crowds they attract and everyone wants to just look and the next thing you know, they're climbing in and pushing all the buttons and adjusting seats. Tesla is avoiding that, they're just not going to budge on this policy, not while the car is in their charge. Once the car is delivered, that is up to the new owner and how they handle it. When the car is still in Tesla's care and on their property, they're going to dictate who can see it and why. FWIW, they don't let people go up and look at other peoples' roadsters or Model S's that are in for service, either.
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