sudden acceleration

[MXWing]

Am I too simple minded in thinking a combination of software updates, better utilization of sensors, and aeb improvements should have/will eliminate these type of issues?

If a problem has been fixed, it's not a big deal from Tesla's part to take care of prior situations "in doubt"?

 

[Carl]

Anyone remember when Tesla (sometime between 2013 and 2016) inverted the locations of the TACC-stalk and the lights-stalk? When my 2016 MS replaced my 2013 one, I must have been for some weeks a very irritating driver, giving a "high-beams-warning" to drivers in front of me when I actually wanted to engage AP, and inadvertently turning on AP when I needed high beams

Unrelated to the OP's story of course.

 

[pdxrajiv]

Anyone remember when Tesla (sometime between 2013 and 2016) inverted the locations of the TACC-stalk and the lights-stalk? When my 2016 MS replaced my 2013 one, I must have been for some weeks a very irritating driver, giving a "high-beams-warning" to drivers in front of me when I actually wanted to engage AP, and inadvertently turning on AP when I needed high beams

Unrelated to the OP's story of course.

This was happening to me Monday and Tuesday while my car was in for service.
Similar confusion between turn signals and windshield wipers occurs when I drive my wife's car.

 

[Epymian]

The stalks are close enough that sometimes I flash my high beams when meaning to turn on autopilot. It is a minor issue and no one has beat me up over it yet. I do not like the placement. It might be lack of dexterity or the fact I am taller than average and the ergonomics of everything favour those under 6'.

When i make a right turn on autopilot, especially on a curved right turning lane, the auto steer comes off as I grab the wheel to make the turn but the cruise control does not. The car will slow as i come up behind the car ahead of me waiting to turn, but when they make the turn and are no longer straight in front, the cruise re-engages and the car has often lurched forward. This only happens obviously if I have not tapped the brakes to disengage cruise, but sometimes I simply forget that step. The acceleration is always very quick (P90DL) and still takes me by surprise. I realize it is my fault this happens and the car is working as intended. I wonder it it would not be useful for noobs like me to have the car automatically disable the cruise at the same time as the auto steer is disengaged when I slow down below 10 mph with the steering wheel cranked right and the Tesla braking automatically behind the car in front of me. This is a very specific scenario but we have a lot of these curved right turn lanes in my city and I have been caught a few times.

 

[David29]

You can turn off cruise control completely. Tap the end of the stalk. With it off you can't engage it by accidentally lifting the stalk.

This is not accurate, so I want to try to correct it.

For those cars (like mine) that do have the button on the end of the stalk, pressing the button does not turn it absolutely off and does not prevent you from actuating it the same way as cars without the button. I did some testing this afternoon and verified that the system operates as described in the user manual: Even after pushing the button, pulling the lever toward you (known as "resume" on some cars such as older Mercedes) turns the cruise control back on and sets the speed to what it was the last time it was used. If you hold it a bit longer, it sets the speed using the Speed Assist setting.

If the system is off and you flick the lever up or down, the system sets the speed to what you are driving now, unless your speed is below the 18 mph minimum. If you are driving in traffic and a vehicle is detected ahead of you, the system turns on even at speeds below 18. The manual is a bit vague on this, but I found that it will set the speed to 18 miles/hour if you are in traffic and traveling at less than 18. So if someone hits it accidentally while making a turn, and a vehicle is detected ahead, it could set the cruising speed to 18 mph. Holding the lever (which I suppose one might do accidentally if one hit the cruise lever by accident) accelerates or decelerates the car, depending upon which direction you push it. Of course, it should not accelerate the car into a detected vehicle, but the momentary acceleration could be startling.

I can't speak to cars without the push button, but i suspect they all work the same as described in the manual, except that the push button will cancel cruise control temporarily in those cars that have it.

I hope I have described this clearly. It is all in the manual but in a much longer form.

 

[BinWing]

I am trying to understand why this happened, not to advocate and root for some driving style.

If we need to recommend people to avoid blinking while turning on Teslas, so be it, but I would like to first know the reason.

Thus confirming if this is the reason seems important to me. @BinWing can comment if this could apply to them.

Thanks.

My typical turn habit is slow speed (under 20 mph) no blinker and close to the curb, I turn on blinker when I need a wider turn, or a break or if the speed is around 35 mph. My commuter is a BMW which has the low center of gravity, and narrow turning angle. Before Tesla, I frequently drove VW camper in the weekend, which I always use turn signals before the action, because I need a wider angle, and cars behind me can't see that well. I believe I behave similarly when I drive Tesla since they are bigger and taller cars.

 

[BinWing]

BTW, almost a week, despite many phone calls and emails from my side, Tesla still not gives a single word given for the log. If the data is that complicated, then how would I be sure of the fidelity?

 

[Super_Popular]

BTW, almost a week, despite many phone calls and emails from my side, Tesla still not gives a single word given for the log. If the data is that complicated, then how would I be sure of the fidelity?

It takes less than 10 minutes to download the logs.

 

[Carl]

It takes less than 10 minutes to download the logs.

And less than 1 minute to start a thread here. And normally (depending on age of driver) less than 0.1-0.2 seconds to reach a brake pedal, except, of course, if you're paralysed by panic. Not saying that was the case, of course. But if Tesla did not see anything wrong except driver error, they would obviously not post it on this forum. Tesla should of course reach out to OP, if and when they are certain of their conclusion.

 

[MS16]

BTW, almost a week, despite many phone calls and emails from my side, Tesla still not gives a single word given for the log. If the data is that complicated, then how would I be sure of the fidelity?

Very disappointing to hear that Tesla is so unresponsive.

 

[BinWing]

OK, how complicated is the the data interpretation?

At this point, I truly wish Tesla can ensure me that it was all my fault, like stepping on the accelerator instead of the brake. At least the car is safe for my family members to drive.

 

[SMAlset]

Doug_G said: ↑
You can turn off cruise control completely. Tap the end of the stalk. With it off you can't engage it by accidentally lifting the stalk.

I don't know exactly when they removed it but since at least early 2016, there hasn't been a button on the end of the cruise control stalk.

OP said they have a Signature P90D MX earlier in this thread. Does that help explain what their stalk is like in their car?

BinWing, I am curious if you have anyone else driving the car who might have used the Cruise feature before. My husband uses TAAC all the time and I'm aware of the Resume to speed feature on it and personally wish when the car is turned off any set speed is cancelled. When we had a loaner recently he kept accidentally hitting the windshield wiper on it. I really don't want to accidentally hit the Resume on the MS.

I would like to add that I had a question on our MS about the Cabin Overheat Protection not coming on when I thought it should have and contacted Tesla on 5/3. I received a call back yesterday, so while your situation is different than my question it may be that it's just taking their staff time to research and get back to you especially since it involves an accident. One other time we heard a high pitched noise from our car after it had been parked for a few days and hubby called to inquire. Took them a little bit of time on that but they did get back to us to let us know at that point in time what had turned on automatically and been activated. In your case I think it's been less than a week.

 

[BinWing]

Doug_G said: ↑
You can turn off cruise control completely. Tap the end of the stalk. With it off you can't engage it by accidentally lifting the stalk.



OP said they have a Signature P90D MX earlier in this thread. Does that help explain what their stalk is like in their car?

BinWing, I am curious if you have anyone else driving the car who might have used the Cruise feature before. My husband uses TAAC all the time and I'm aware of the Resume to speed feature on it and personally wish when the car is turned off any set speed is cancelled. When we had a loaner recently he kept accidentally hitting the windshield wiper on it. I really don't want to accidentally hit the Resume on the MS.

I would like to add that I had a question on our MS about the Cabin Overheat Protection not coming on when I thought it should have and contacted Tesla on 5/3. I received a call back yesterday, so while your situation is different than my question it may be that it's just taking their staff time to research and get back to you especially since it involves an accident. One other time we heard a high pitched noise from our car after it had been parked for a few days and hubby called to inquire. Took them a little bit of time on that but they did get back to us to let us know at that point in time what had turned on automatically and been activated.

Yes, I never use TAAC while my husband loves it. So I was not familiar with the stalk, and I drive to work most time without ever bother that setting.
The most plausible explanation is indeed like it went back to a preset highway speed... which I hope to learn from the log data....It is just agonizing not getting any communications.

 

[BinWing]

I really appreciate the information you guys have provided here. Not only I learned a lot about the car and myself, I also felt better not to review the horrible movie in my mind.

 

[MS16]

@MS16 - for real? I report facts here to help clarify, without casting blame & you go and tag every single one of my posts with Disagree?

If someone posts "Facts" that are incorrect, then I feel its appropriate to use the Disagree feature provided here, unless the Disagree function is now 'throttled', or maybe I reached my counter limit?

Just to be clear about what I 'disagreed' with, the OP posted this

Sterling Anderson, the self driving lead, was at the crash site (which is on his new company site). He seemed well aware of the sudden acceleration issue in the early model. He also believed sensor log report should gave valuable data.

Yet you stated quite emphatically she was "incorrect".

The OP's assertion that Sterling was aware of sudden acceleration events in early models is incorrect.

Furthermore, I disagreed with what could be perceived to be a condescending tone towards her when you claim she likely mis-remembered or misunderstood due to a stressful event.

what he said to the OP appears likely to be a misunderstanding on the OP's part during an understandably stressful event.

The OP was correct in her understanding, and she didn't mis-remember. I think we all owe the OP respect and don't need someone to be 'Bonnie-splaining' to her what she remembered or why you think she misunderstood something, especially when we weren't there.

That's my observation and that's why I used the Disagree feature provided.

 

[NikeWings]

Thanks.

My typical turn habit is slow speed (under 20 mph) no blinker and close to the curb, I turn on blinker when I need a wider turn, or a break or if the speed is around 35 mph.

Using your blinker all the time would be safer for you, pedestrians and for others following you. Not to mention the great courtesy it provides to waiting traffic at an intersection. Sorry for your crash and hope that you are able to move on beyond your fears and enjoy yourself again.

 

[BinWing]

Using your blinker all the time would be safer for you, pedestrians and for others following you. Not to mention the great courtesy it provides to waiting traffic at an intersection. Sorry for your crash and hope that you are able to move on beyond your fears and enjoy yourself again.

Yeah, I definitely agree with you!
I used to take a great deal of pride of my quick reflex, and over rated myself as an excellent driver. Last Friday was a wake up call....

 

[bonnie]

If someone posts "Facts" that are incorrect, then I feel its appropriate to use the Disagree feature provided here, unless the Disagree function is now 'throttled', or maybe I reached my counter limit?

Just to be clear about what I 'disagreed' with, the OP posted this

Yet you stated quite emphatically she was "incorrect".

Furthermore, I disagreed with what could be perceived to be a condescending tone towards her when you claim she likely mis-remembered or misunderstood due to a stressful event.

The OP was correct in her understanding, and she didn't mis-remember. I think we all owe the OP respect and don't need someone to be 'Bonnie-splaining' to her what she remembered or why you think she misunderstood something, especially when we weren't there.

That's my observation and that's why I used the Disagree feature provided.

Why are we back here again? This is ridiculous, honestly.

So assuming you're sincere in your assertion that I misstated and was condescending, this will be my last attempt to explain. I will rephrase: Instead of stating the OP was incorrect, I should have clearly stated 'the OP was incorrect in her understanding of the information that Sterling conveyed.' I thought that was clear. I also said I thought the misunderstanding was understandable, given the situation. I have no idea why you would find a sincere statement like that on my part to be said in a 'condescending tone', when I was very very carefully trying to state what happened without assigning blame.

Please note that I was posting because I wanted to support her assertion that Sterling had shown up (which many people found unbelievable).

As far as me trying to 'Bonnie-splain', I was only conveying exactly what Sterling told me he said at the time.

I will be sure to be very precise in the future and include all the information into one sentence. I was at fault for assuming that everyone reading the post understood exactly what I was saying (and plenty of people did).

I'm not going to fight with you. I accept that you were unable to understand what I posted & that you assumed I was being condescending. I know I wasn't, but -shrug- nothing I can do about that.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Thanks.

My typical turn habit is slow speed (under 20 mph) no blinker and close to the curb, I turn on blinker when I need a wider turn, or a break or if the speed is around 35 mph. My commuter is a BMW which has the low center of gravity, and narrow turning angle. Before Tesla, I frequently drove VW camper in the weekend, which I always use turn signals before the action, because I need a wider angle, and cars behind me can't see that well. I believe I behave similarly when I drive Tesla since they are bigger and taller cars.

Thank you for the info, @BinWing. Appreciate it.

Do you remember putting on blinker in the crash turn? And if so, do you remember putting the blinker on before starting to turn the wheel - or during turning the wheel?

 

[BinWing]

Thank you for the info, @BinWing. Appreciate it.

Do you remember putting on blinker in the crash turn? And if so, do you remember putting the blinker on before starting to turn the wheel - or during turning the wheel?

Honestly, AnxietyRanger, I could not remember.

The flying car crashing into two parked cars occupied all my memory space at that moment.
I did remember the noon time traffic was light, and there was no car in front of me. I believe I would turn the blinker before turning the steering wheel ... Hopefully the log registered some information?