Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

[Chaserr]

Well I’m sure I’m over 50. As I posted before, wonder if ANY A batteries affected, or is it possible that, ironically, the SC cap we were so worked up about has immunized us from this malady?

This is an interesting question. If there are zero A packs affected, it might indicate charge speeds - slowed immensely with chargegate - caused these problems in the first place. Or the cooling they added for faster charging wasn't sufficient and allowed battery damage? Something hardware at least.


Since the best way to get an answer on the internet isn't asking a question, but saying something wrong and being corrected:

Not a single 85-A pack has been impacted by chargegate or batterygate!

 

[Droschke]

Hypothetical here:

Lets say tomorrow Tesla uncaps all of our cars and we're back to good range.

Is the super slow not-so-supercharging network still viable? Are our cars no longer capable of making decent time on road trips? Is this part of the situation ever going to be resolved?

I was thinking of a summer trip next year from VA to Wisconsin, but if I'm not getting faster charging it wouldn't be possible.

Just wondering what others think. Time to sell the car and find something more reliable for long distance drives?

My opinion, if they uncap tomorrow they will leave the supercharging speed reduction in place.

 

[DJRas]

Also from Teslafi data:
Pre-batterygate/chargegate from 10% to 95%
View attachment 471461
Rescent 1% to 95%
View attachment 471460

I am confused about how various cars are charge limited.
As you can see from this post my times have NOT been that significantly slowed.
To add 209.8 miles on May 15 (before Batterygate and Chargegate installed) it took 1 hour 12 minutes (from 10% to 95%)
To add 210.3 miles on Oct 28 it took 1 hour 31 minutes (from 1% to 95%)
That is a 19 minute change (26% longer).
Charging to only 90% there is much less delta from before.
But I hear people saying that they now take 100% longer (over 2 hours). THAT would do it for me.

 

[First EV]

I am confused about how various cars are charge limited.
As you can see from this post my times have NOT been that significantly slowed.
To add 209.8 miles on May 15 (before Batterygate and Chargegate installed) it took 1 hour 12 minutes (from 10% to 95%)
To add 210.3 miles on Oct 28 it took 1 hour 31 minutes (from 1% to 95%)
That is a 19 minute change (26% longer).
Charging to only 90% there is much less delta from before.
But I hear people saying that they now take 100% longer (over 2 hours). THAT would do it for me.

It seems the charge speed reduction varies car to car.

 

[T.R.T.e.s.l.a.]

I am confused about how various cars are charge limited.
As you can see from this post my times have NOT been that significantly slowed.
To add 209.8 miles on May 15 (before Batterygate and Chargegate installed) it took 1 hour 12 minutes (from 10% to 95%)
To add 210.3 miles on Oct 28 it took 1 hour 31 minutes (from 1% to 95%)
That is a 19 minute change (26% longer).
Charging to only 90% there is much less delta from before.
But I hear people saying that they now take 100% longer (over 2 hours). THAT would do it for me.

I haven't lost a huge amount of range since June 2019, but on the other hand my charging rate at SuC's was drastically reduced.
I have a late Nov 2014 S85.

 

[tomas]

It seems the charge speed reduction varies car to car.

Right. Which to me says it is not charge rate they are capping. It is probably some other metric, like temperature. The effect is variable reduced charge rate.

 

[APD1080]

Oh dearie, dearie me...I think I know the difference between Range and Capped. What I am seeing is I have NOT been CAPPED and the range that I am experiencing with my 3 year old 90D is well within the expected range and therefore not capped by Tesla. Anyone who thinks they will get the advertised range of any vehicle, all electric, hybrid-ICE or ICE is fooling themselves. Based on my data I must be the only one that Tesla has not "downgraded the capacity" of my 90D.

 

[Zextraterrestrial]

Right. Which to me says it is not charge rate they are capping. It is probably some other metric, like temperature. The effect is variable reduced charge rate.

this is what I see

good hot battery temperature(105-115F) I still get 110-115 Kw + SOC rate
lower temps it is way slow

 

[Jkr85]

Does anyone in this forum state that they have a Model S from 2012 to 2015 and not have either charging restrictions or capping?

2015 85D, no cap but slow supercharging. I believe this is quite common, unfortunately.

 

[Droschke]

I am confused about how various cars are charge limited.
As you can see from this post my times have NOT been that significantly slowed.
To add 209.8 miles on May 15 (before Batterygate and Chargegate installed) it took 1 hour 12 minutes (from 10% to 95%)
To add 210.3 miles on Oct 28 it took 1 hour 31 minutes (from 1% to 95%)
That is a 19 minute change (26% longer).
Charging to only 90% there is much less delta from before.
But I hear people saying that they now take 100% longer (over 2 hours). THAT would do it for me.

It took me 50 minutes to charge from 40% to 90% at a deserted supercharger.

 

[Droschke]

Oh dearie, dearie me...I think I know the difference between Range and Capped. What I am seeing is I have NOT been CAPPED and the range that I am experiencing with my 3 year old 90D is well within the expected range and therefore not capped by Tesla. Anyone who thinks they will get the advertised range of any vehicle, all electric, hybrid-ICE or ICE is fooling themselves. Based on my data I must be the only one that Tesla has not "downgraded the capacity" of my 90D.

You are missing the whole issue here.

Yes, 90's are not capped, FYI. The rest of us (60, 70, 85's) are capped.

Capping is not normal range loss like gradual degradation of batteries. This is the part which seems to escape your attention.

Let's say your 3 year old 90D battery has gone through a normal/gradual (expected) degradation. You are happy with it since it's expected, like you say with all EV's. Now, assume today Tesla abruptly caps your battery capacity by 12% (on top of that 3% normal degradation). Now, you have lost 15% of your capacity, and Tesla by a software update is doing it to you, not the battery itself by going through the normal/gradual degradation. Are you OK with 15% loss of your 90D in 3 years, 12% of which occurred just today?

A "Yes" or "No" answer would be sufficient.

 

[AdamInFlag]

It took me 50 minutes to charge from 40% to 90% at a deserted supercharger.

Sounds about right. I'm also around SOC + kW = 110 to 115 through the "meat" of the charge curve. At 50% I'm hitting about 60 kW now vs 75 kW previously. I've charged in everything from about 55F to 115F ambient temp since chargegate hit and get about the same. Hopefully winter weather doesn't further affect the rate on road trips (please let the battery warming feature actually be effective at least...).

Above 80% SOC it's now getting painfully slow. On a trip back from LA earlier this month we stopped at a hotel in Barstow at the supercharger. I charged to 87% that night, pulling 22 kW at the end. I plugged it in the next morning setting it to 100% and started charging at 15 kW. 80 minutes later it still hadn't finished...so pretty on par with AC charging that last 10%. (Then we got caught in a 30 min line to charge with one broken stall at Kingman...which is like a 65 min charge time for me now to get back to Flagstaff). We're talking about a December trip to Breckenridge, and my wife is already asking if we can't take her FWD Hyundai hatchback instead...Between the new traffic at some of the superchargers and chargegate, I'm starting think about getting some good winters and rocket box for that car and just taking the gasser

Non-capped '15 85D

 

[DJRas]

Lookie what I found!

 

[bijan]

Sounds about right. I'm also around SOC + kW = 110 to 115 through the "meat" of the charge curve. At 50% I'm hitting about 60 kW now vs 75 kW previously. I've charged in everything from about 55F to 115F ambient temp since chargegate hit and get about the same. Hopefully winter weather doesn't further affect the rate on road trips (please let the battery warming feature actually be effective at least...).

Above 80% SOC it's now getting painfully slow. On a trip back from LA earlier this month we stopped at a hotel in Barstow at the supercharger. I charged to 87% that night, pulling 22 kW at the end. I plugged it in the next morning setting it to 100% and started charging at 15 kW. 80 minutes later it still hadn't finished...so pretty on par with AC charging that last 10%. (Then we got caught in a 30 min line to charge with one broken stall at Kingman...which is like a 65 min charge time for me now to get back to Flagstaff). We're talking about a December trip to Breckenridge, and my wife is already asking if we can't take her FWD Hyundai hatchback instead...Between the new traffic at some of the superchargers and chargegate, I'm starting think about getting some good winters and rocket box for that car and just taking the gasser

Non-capped '15 85D

I have a model 3 but charging to 100% is really slow. Past 97-98% my charge rate on AC drops below 32 amps and by 100% it starts at 14amps and drops all the way to 5. And takes 35 minutes to finish the 100% itself while adding virtually no miles.

I supercharged to 100% once. It took longer to go from 90-100 than it did to go from 0-90.

 

[tomas]

I have a model 3 but charging to 100% is really slow. Past 97-98% my charge rate on AC drops below 32 amps and by 100% it starts at 14amps and drops all the way to 5. And takes 35 minutes to finish the 100% itself while adding virtually no miles.

I supercharged to 100% once. It took longer to go from 90-100 than it did to go from 0-90.

This is NORMAL!!!!!’ Read up on charging. You are not affected by subject of this thread! Think of it as filling a glass with water and not being allowed to spill. You’ll start out fast, end verrryyyy sssllloooowww. Normal!

 

[bijan]

This is NORMAL!!!!!’ Read up on charging. You are not affected by subject of this thread! Think of it as filling a glass with water and not being allowed to spill. You’ll start out fast, end verrryyyy sssllloooowww. Normal!

Yes I know but the OP was complaining about it taking 80 minutes to go from 87 to 100% and it was as slow as AC charging. That is the case for me too.

 

[gmo43]

Lookie what I found!
View attachment 471902

Great investigation skills! I wonder how you found this.

Edit: Send to all the news media! Maybe then Tesla will take your lawyer serious. Since it's such a joke to Elon.

 

[Droschke]

Lookie what I found!
View attachment 471902

DP19005. That's it.

 

[tomas]

Yes I know but the OP was complaining about it taking 80 minutes to go from 87 to 100% and it was as slow as AC charging. That is the case for me too.

Sure, but this thread has progressed miles since then. Wish someone would summarize and publish in first post.

 

[Keshk]

A simple Question

I have followed this thread for very long, but I am confused. Need just simple brief answer, if possible

I have an S70. bought it new April 2016. I was getting 249 max miles until June 2019. The max. I can get now is 230 miles. The miles have been capped and the supercharge time almost doubled. Forget about normal degradation for a second. The question is: Did I actually loose 19 miles (249 minus 230) after V9, or I actually lost more than that because the Mile measure is also manipulated in such a way that the current mile is less than the mile measure before the V9?