Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

[gmo43]

I think that is a significant exaggeration. Isn't the battery in your Model S capped? But yet you are still driving it. So the battery must not be "useless."

Are you kidding me. Let me give you a shorter belt and see how useless it is for you! Let's be real here and understand that capping a battery does make our cars useless. Gosh it was hard holding back some words.

 

[Todd Burch]

Not sure how you can conclude that. Did you see this post from earlier today?
Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

I’m not concluding anything...that’s my best guess as to what the release notes for the update mean.

 

[Guy V]

If they think this is acceptable and to be considered normal degradation, yes I know it's not, then this destroys any practicality of an electric car at this point. Meaning the resale value of the cars owned by these fanbois is in for a steep decline once people understand the true useful life is only 5 to 6 years for a $50k plus model 3.

Yes, that's exactly what I have been saying for quite awhile, and I believe that, more inevitably than anything else, will eventually force Tesla to do anything it is able to in order to rectify or at least remediate this issue because if not it is ultimately the death of Tesla.

 

[Chaserr]

I can't wait for Tesla to answer in court this simple question: "If you feel it is OK to cap people 10%, or 20%, where do you stop? Do you draw the line anywhere? Is taking away 100% OK?" I'm hoping @DJRas legal team makes them answer this with an actual number under oath. Because their capping is arbitrary and there is no limit. No matter what number they say under oath, it will be front page news because that kind of testimony terrifying to anyone considering buying a car. Forcing them to confront what they've done will eventually make them undo it. They won't be able to be this stupid forever, at some point their own lawyers will have to make Tesla stop - or maybe they'll keep quitting. How many General Counsels did they chew through in 2019 alone? Everyone that takes that job runs away fast.

 

[Geek190]

I got the new update and installed it today.
I have not been voltage capped, at least as of a month ago when I last charged to 100% (4.19v).

I have been limited with charging for sure, but it sounds like not quite as bad as some. I'm averaging 100 total SoC + charge rate (ie 30% SoC plus 70kW charge rate = 100)

I'll charge it up to 100% in the morning and report back what I'm getting at max volts.

 

[doctorwho]

That is less than I spent in fuel for a V6 ICE @ 25000 miles/year.

Perhaps, but buying a new battery with a 4-year lifespan before abnormal degradation is a different issue that choosing to spend money on fossil fuel. Being close to retirement, it's also not a desirable routine expense, nor is a good advertisement for the EV cause when the leader in battery technology can't stop Li plating in. a battery older than 4 years

 

[jplasmd]

Not such a statement in my manual or in anything given to me (I have kept everything they gave me). What model year is your car? What's the name of that manual?

Are you talking about this? This is a service manual not given to the owners, a copy can be found on the web.

Yes, I'm referring to the 2012-2016 Tesla Model S Service Manual, which contains three main sections. The first section is the actual service portion. The second section contains ten wiring diagrams along with connector references for each diagram. And the last section has the Theory of Operation Guides. The quote regarding the effect of frequent Supercharging on HV batteries came from the latter in a sub-section that discusses Supercharging. Tesla has never made this service manual available to US Tesla owners (with the exception of residents from one state).

 

[tga]

That is less than I spent in fuel for a V6 ICE @ 25000 miles/year.

So what? Add in the cost of electricity to the cost of a replacement battery, then you'd have a valid comparison to an ICE.

 

[Muffinman]

Wow.

 

[Ferrycraigs]

View attachment 489836 Based on wording for this latest version’s release notes, it seems Tesla may have originally capped all cars meeting a certain hardware criteria to be safe.

This latest version appears to perhaps be better at determining which packs are truly affected, and release the restrictions for those packs the new software deems ok. At least that’s how I read it.

A few assumptions there Todd. I have learnt to try and read between the lines on Tesla's statements. They choose their words with great care, to give an impression. Often they don’t turn out to mean what they first read as.

In this instance they talk about improving their ability to identify degradation. But as has been proven several times on here, batterygate has noting to do with degradation. To me this just means they are setting the target on a new area (degradation) that may also result in a reduction in capacity or performance. I don’t read anything in this that says we are sorting the people we have already capped.

I accept they may have turned me into a cynic, but history is hard to change.

 

[Ferrycraigs]

Are you kidding me. Let me give you a shorter belt and see how useless it is for you! Let's be real here and understand that capping a battery does make our cars useless. Gosh it was hard holding back some words.

I bought my car, with a larger battery, because I needed it to be capable of long, sometimes international, journeys. It used to be. Now it’s not. As a long distance car I would say it’s pretty useless. It’s certainly more than unsuitable if it can’t now get between some Superchargers on some international journeys I make. As a car to drive down to the shops to get some milk, it’s pretty great. But I could have bought cars at a quarter of the price if I just wanted something that could get me to the shops.

Technically I agree with @MP3Mike's statement, the car isn’t useless. But I also think that statement could also be described as a 'significant exaggeration' as specifically, in relation to what I need it to do, it is useless. As always each person’s perspective is different.

 

[Todd Burch]

Received the update...installing now and will report back.

 

[liamharry]

Agree.

From the "Charging" section of the "Theory of Operation Guides" found in the early MS service manual:

" 1. Tesla Supercharger

The Tesla Supercharger recharges Model S quickly on road trips that exceed the range of a single charge. Superchargers are not intended for everyday use. Frequent use can result in minor reduction of the HV Battery's life."

I have NEVER seen this before. It is not in my 2016 manual, battery warranty or any other literature I have ever seen. More importantly if you go on their supercharging web page, even now there is still no suggestion that supercharging will SHORTEN the battery life.

In fact the Tesla and its website promotes supercharging as one of the main selling points. What I have seen and is a change from the Supercharging literature that was available in 2015/16 is that frequent Supercharging MAY affect your supercharging SPEEDS, although only by a FEW minutes.

I am happy to stand corrected and in fact would be really interested to see this documentation. If possible, I would be grateful if you are able to screen grab/scan the literature and post it on here.

 

[T.R.T.e.s.l.a.]

That was not in my 2014 manual or any literature I received from Tesla when I bought my car in 2014. If my battery proves to be incapable of handling regular supercharging during the warranty period, I expect a replacement, not a retroactive warning not to supercharge so much.

Is that 2014 manual a hard copy or a pdf?

 

[Todd Burch]

Update installed. My 90% charge is the same (209/210), although I installed the update when I was around 88% charge and I might need a few days to see any differences.

 

[Ferrycraigs]

Received the update...installing now and will report back.

Good luck!!

 

[Lukez]

So I havent been pushed an update Ota (I stay off wifi) for a few months and yesterday I got the software is ready to install notification. I'm still on 16.2 and I have no Supercharging issues and would like to keep it that way. If I schedule a service appointment and put in writing that I want them to unstage the update as I do not want any more software updates from them would they do it? Or at least I would have something in writing? Or will they just reply that they can't?

 

[BigNick]

Perhaps, but buying a new battery with a 4-year lifespan before abnormal degradation is a different issue that choosing to spend money on fossil fuel. Being close to retirement, it's also not a desirable routine expense, nor is a good advertisement for the EV cause when the leader in battery technology can't stop Li plating in. a battery older than 4 years

So what? Add in the cost of electricity to the cost of a replacement battery, then you'd have a valid comparison to an ICE.

Just trying to put the amount in perspective. Not saying I would want to shell that kind of cash out every four years. Saving roughly $200 per month on fuel is useless if the battery must be replaced that often.

Where I used to spend roughly $300 per month in gasoline, I am spending about $100 per month to charge. So that would add $4800 to the $12K if a battery replacement were required every four years.

 

[BigNick]

AP1 ONLY Please -- life after 2018.50.6
DO NOT INSTALL 2019.40.2.3 at this time. I think it contains something evil.

 

[KidDoc]

This is my dash yesterday with pretty severe limitations worse than I have ever seen. You can see it is a "cold" 50 degrees in Texas and even after driving > 10 miles @ 75 mph it has my regen and max limited.

Just awful.

I charged to max today and reads 245 (new 265- a month ago 255). This may be the first time my round trip to meet my dad for dinner for his Birthday from College Station to Katy may have to be done in my wife's giant pickup instead of the Model S. (I have to drive 25ish miles @ lunch as well for a meeting)

Sad day for me a former Tesla superfan.