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Supercharger - Bowling Green, KY

Discussion in 'Southeast' started by Thinkje, May 17, 2016.

  1. Thinkje

    Thinkje Member

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  2. ElectricTundra

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    Very welcomed news! Looks like the only food within a reasonably safe walk is Chik-fill-A and Panera? There's a Whitt's BBQ but getting there might be a bit scary.

    Now if we can just get something between Nashville and B'ham.
     
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  3. N4HHE

    N4HHE Member

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    ... And Birmingham.
     
  4. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Active Member

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    #4 ItsNotAboutTheMoney, May 18, 2016
    Last edited: May 18, 2016
    It says "An application for a building permit seeks to install four Tesla Motors Electric Car Charging Stations at Meijer at a cost of $188,000." I expect that it's 4 Superchargers, and 8 stalls.

    And thank you for the informative post. :)

    Interstates: I-65
    US Numbered Highways (<= 5 miles): US-231, US-31W, US-68.

    I-65:
    From: Nashville, TN - 77.3 miles
    To: Louisville, KY - 113 miles
    Diversion: 2.3 miles

    Good split between Nashville and Lexington, so will obviously complete that section of I-65.
     
  5. Rocky_H

    Rocky_H Member

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    Whoa, there's a Meijer in Bowling Green now? They didn't when I lived there, and that's pretty far South for them. Tesla seems to have a pretty good partnership going with Meijer in Michigan and Ohio. I used to live there from 1st grade through 11th grade and moved away in 1994. I wouldn't have really thought they needed one between Louisville/Lexington and Nashville, but I keep forgetting about the 60's.
     
  6. Rifleman

    Rifleman Now owns 2 Model S's!!!

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    Please dont forget about us 60's! Plus, the base model 3 is going to have range and supercharging speeds that are almost identical to a 60.
     
  7. ElectricTundra

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    #7 ElectricTundra, May 19, 2016
    Last edited: May 19, 2016
    :)

    I only owe you a beer for Decatur though.
     
  8. ElectricTundra

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    Not just 60's. Cargo weight, wind, cold, and try'n to outrun the revenuer's can all take a toll on range. When we were driving to Florida in our P85D with a bit of cargo we'd have likely made it to Nashville but it would have been anxiously close. We went east through Lexington, London, Knox, and Chattanooga instead (and found a great B&B in Chattanooga Chanticleer Inn Bed & Breakfast, a Select Registry Property | Chargerville). Made it to B'ham with less than 10 miles soc.
     
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  9. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Active Member

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    Also worth remembering that:
    - Although we'd hope and expect that destination charging would increase over time, larger gaps can force detours for people who are traveling to destinations between two Superchargers
    - Splitting the gap helps spread out the Supercharging. With the current 188 mile gap you can guarantee that people traveling I-55 would have to charge at both Nashville and Lexington. And, if people don't have to top up before a big gap it makes it less likely that they'll have to Supercharge with a SoC that's already pretty high.
     
  10. ElectricTundra

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    Good points. More frequent charging also reduces the total amount of time you spend charging (and taking up charging space) since charging is much faster at the lower end of the range than the upper. Those range charges to make long gaps take considerable time.
     
  11. TomServo

    TomServo Member

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    And we must consider the M3. In base trim It'll essentially have the same range as the MS60. Tesla may have to start halving the distances between current SC stations to deal with M3's as they continue to build out the SC network.
     
  12. Rocky_H

    Rocky_H Member

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    I think people are thinking about the Model 3 range the wrong way. They talk about it as if they are all going to be low range. That's not the case. They were saying that the LOWEST battery model version would have an EPA range of at least 215 miles. They said there WILL be other, bigger, battery sizes. And, as we saw with Model S, most people do want the extra range and buy the bigger battery. Yes, I know that there is the price difference, where more people would could not do a Model S will be stretching some to get a Model 3, but I think given the dollars tradeoff, most people will prioritize extra range over fancy wheels, air suspension, and fancy stereos.
     
  13. ElectricTundra

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    I believe Tesla's target is 150 miles between chargers. In only rare circumstances like extreme cold and lots of cargo should that be much of a problem for a base 3. That said, anyone who lives where 20f or below is common and expects to travel should likely consider a larger battery.
     
  14. Rifleman

    Rifleman Now owns 2 Model S's!!!

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    As someone who has driven a 60 (essentially same range as a base model 3) on the supercharger network quite a bit, I can say that 150 miles between chargers would routinely be a problem for a base model 3, as well as for a 60 kWh model S. Not only would it require a full range charge at each station to give sufficient margin, things like a cold or hot day, higher speed limit, elevation change, passengers or cargo, or battery degradation can eat into that margin quickly. A 60 or base 3 could do a 150 mile leg, but it would require 90-120 minute supercharges, and would require the driver to be very conscious of his energy usage the entire time. I think that Tesla needs to shoot for 100-125 miles between chargers for the base model 3.
     
  15. Drucifer

    Drucifer Active Member

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    The target is 110-120 +/- miles (170-200 km). The target is adjusted significantly for mountainous areas (closer) and slightly for flatter terrain (further), and for climate variation (closer as you move away from the equator).
     
  16. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Active Member

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    The following table shows spacing along single Interstates in the USA, where Superchargers are no more than 300 miles apart, with the number in the first column being the number of miles rounded up to the higher 25.

    Code:
    Dist	Cnt			%
    25	7			2.79%
    50	14			5.58%
    75	47			18.73%
    100	60			23.90%
    125	65			25.90%
    150	33			13.15%
    175	7			2.79%
    200	3			1.20%
    225	2			0.80%
    250	1			0.40%
    275	1			0.40%
    300	1			0.40%
    
    Tesla is _already_ spacing Superchargers ready for the Model 3. Over time those gaps will continue to shrink since Tesla is very clearly targeting spacing comfortably less than 150 miles.
     
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  17. Drucifer

    Drucifer Active Member

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    Arguably, you can toss anything above 150, since that just means that there will be a supercharger put in near the midpoint between anything that comes in at 150 or more.

    The median point here looks to be about 110.
     
  18. GRA

    GRA Member

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    #18 GRA, May 22, 2016
    Last edited: May 22, 2016
    Indeed. Way back when Tesla still had the 60 listed on their range calculator, it showed the range @ 70 mph at 32 deg. with heat to be 173 miles (although it's not always the case, I assume that below freezing temps will likely have conditions that will require slowing down).

    Assuming that SCs should be spaced to minimize charging times, i.e. so that they can be reached with a charge to 80%, that's only 138 miles between SCs. Taking away another 10% for a minimal emergency reserve, that's 173 x .7 = 121 miles between SCs, and that's with no allowance for hills, wind, loads or degradation. And then there's the fact that 16 states west of a line drawn south along the eastern edge of ND to Texas inclusive (plus LA), i.e.all except California and Oregon, have rural interstate speed limits of at least 75 mph - 7 of them have 80 mph speed limits, so you can probably knock about 20 miles of range off for each extra 5 mph beyond 70 (the S60 was credited with 215 miles at 65 mph under ideal conditions, but 198 miles at 70 mph ditto.

    Ultimately, if SCs are to provide anything approaching the flexibility and convenience of gas stations, then (aside from batteries that can take much higher charge rates and have larger capacity for lower prices) they'll need to be spaced no more than 1/2 hour apart at the speed limit. The initial requirement will be to have 100-120 mile SC spacing, then halve that (which will allow S/X 85+ to do 150-180 mile legs all the time, and 200-240 mile legs in good to excellent conditions), then halve it again.
     
  19. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Active Member

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    Yes. The bias to shorter spacing could be because Tesla, for obvious reasons, likes to put Superchargers near intersections of Interstates and major US Numbered Highways, so those intersections determine spacing. But, Tesla had a couple of larger gaps on I-10 and I-95 and filled them in after dependent construction was completed.

    The must durable gaps greater than 150 miles seem to be on I-5.
    Manteca, CA to Corning, CA is 175 miles.
    Centralia, WA to Burlington, WA is 151 miles.
    There are also some bigger gaps if you consider multiple Interstates. I believe that Tesla does look at multiple Interstates and will continue to back-fill gaps. Shorter distances improve tolerance of site failures, and helps avoid congested nodes.
     
  20. N4HHE

    N4HHE Member

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    For nearly 2.5 years I had not driven more than to a Supercharger and back. The past 2 weeks I have driven 2000 miles on Superchargers. When the goal of Supercharging is to get from city to city the fastest way is about 100 miles between and battery charged to about 150 miles, arriving with 50 to spare. At 50 miles the full 120 kW charge rate applies and one can be in and out in about 20 minutes. A "deep soak" to span 190 miles of Nashville-Louisville is about an hour.
     
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