Whatever architect dreamed up the gaps between the concrete blocks is someone spending too much time drawing rectangles in AutoCAD and not enough time driving over gravel bits in a Model S (or any vehicle for that matter). I wish they'd cool it with the capital-D "Design" at Hawthorne and just let form follow function rather than the opposite.
Supercharger - Hawthorne, CA (8 V2 + 2 V3 stalls)
- Thread starter highedu
- Start date
NoCO
Member
The gaps are great in that the wheel rests in one when you are in the correct postition so there is positive feed back. Now the gravel...I guess a 4K# car is going to knock them loose. Fake turf might be better in the gaps and get back to the original look they had.
The marvel of bringing this massive amount of electricity in a safe and orderly manner to so many high tech automobiles in the middle of a major urban area, and folks are complaining about cement shapes and pebbles.
gg_got_a_tesla
Model S: VIN 65513, Model 3: VIN 1913
Good point
Probably small fry though compared to the electricity going to the SpaceX production facility next door.
Yep, industrial complexes, sports arenas, and large office buildings likely all dwarf the consumption of a SpC.
callmesam
Member
They were doing a big electrical upgrade down the middle of Crenshaw Blvd from Rocket Rd. past Jack Northrop Ave. Can't say for sure that it is related to the Supercharger, but it would be an incredible coincidence
David99
Active Member
I doubt in such an industrial area there are any issues with power. Those storage batteries are most probably there to do a real world test on them and how they help smoothing out power consumption on the grid. Not that Hawthorne would need it, but for building Superchargers in remote locations where the grid isn't able to provide enough power to charge 8 or more cars at the same time.
Cottonwood
Roadster#433, Model S#S37
Although they may be useful in a few remote locations for dealing with a small power feed, I think that the primary reason for the energy storage development is for reducing the peak load electrical expense. Given peak draw rates on commercial accounts, the batteries can pay for themselves pretty quickly.
David99
Active Member
Very true. I remember a friend of mine who saved his company thousands by installing 'soft starters' for their large production facility. They had to pay a high fee for needing a very high amount of power when they started their production in the morning. It was literally just a few seconds of the motors starting where they would draw a huge amount of power. SCE charged them an extra fee for providing that amount even if it was just for a second a day. Those 'soft starters' took the peak off and reduced their power bill significantly.
Demand charges (maximum demand on a meter for a 15 minute period) can approach $30/kW in California (SCE). Look at page 36 on this report: http://avt.inl.gov/pdf/prog_info/IEA_DCFCImpactStudySept2014.pdf
A large install like this one at Hawthorne with 10 stalls and over 1.2 MW of peak demand would mean a demand charge of around $35,000 / month.
Let's say they can shave that peak demand by a third or 360 kW saving $10,000 / month.
So the question is - how much storage is needed and how much do those storage units cost? You can be sure that Tesla is using Hawthorne as a location to work out the bugs and how to best optimize grid storage.
Cottonwood
Roadster#433, Model S#S37
Tesla also installed Energy Storage batteries in the Barstow upgrade, more California demand charges.
Superchargers are the perfect use to produce peak demand charges. Most Teslas use a Supercharger for 20-60 minutes. If you believe in random arrivals, then the number of cars using a Supercharger is a Poisson distribution (Wikipedia) that has a very long, low-probability tail. Any 15 minute interval that hits the peak usage in a month determines the demand charge. All Tesla has to do with it's energy storage is clip those tails a little to save on demand charges.
The key issue with using battery storage technology to mitigate demand charges is that the batteries have to function each and every single time in the month when cars are charging (and supply energy to reduce peak load) in order to reduce or avoid the demand charge. If even one round of charging occurred while the batteries were depleted, then a new maximum demand would be set for the month and the demand charge adjusted accordingly.
Owner
Active Member
David99
Active Member
Or Tesla could just slightly limit the total power of the entire Supercharger station to avoid going over a certain level. The batteries would really only need to kick in when the entire station is at max load.
Alexander
P# 8,878
Yeah, the pebbles were nice looking and my 4 year old liked to throw them in the pond haha. But there gone now and the new expansion is up and running! 12 Supercharger stations and 8 HPWC's. looks good!
4SUPER9
Active Member
Beautiful! Thanks for the pics.
I wonder who will be using the SC's and who will be using the HPWC's. With twin chargers on board, the best one can hope for is 60 mph on the HPWC's. My guess is that Tesla has a plan to use those for people either waiting for a SC (which should be very unlikely for the time being given that there are now 12, SJC has been open for some time, and Culver City is opening soon), or for "locals" (limos??) who have the time to spare and can leave there car for several hours. It would be nice if there was some signage at the SC's saying "60 minute limit".
I wonder who will be using the SC's and who will be using the HPWC's. With twin chargers on board, the best one can hope for is 60 mph on the HPWC's. My guess is that Tesla has a plan to use those for people either waiting for a SC (which should be very unlikely for the time being given that there are now 12, SJC has been open for some time, and Culver City is opening soon), or for "locals" (limos??) who have the time to spare and can leave there car for several hours. It would be nice if there was some signage at the SC's saying "60 minute limit".
ecarfan
Well-Known Member
Wow that is a massive expansion! I was at Hawthorne for the first time a few months ago. What a difference, and also all the HPWCs. Great for those who work at SpaceX and the Tesla Design Center there and drive Model S's.
Seeing this reminds me of another issue that most "analysts" and Tesla critics don't understand when they say that there are "only" 139 Superchargers in the US: in fact there are probably over 1,000 Supercharger stations in the US because each SC site contains multiple stations. That's a lot of stations for a few tens of thousands of Tesla's, and most of those sites are expandable.
Seeing this reminds me of another issue that most "analysts" and Tesla critics don't understand when they say that there are "only" 139 Superchargers in the US: in fact there are probably over 1,000 Supercharger stations in the US because each SC site contains multiple stations. That's a lot of stations for a few tens of thousands of Tesla's, and most of those sites are expandable.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
Similar threads
