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Supercharger locations - who picks these spots??

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Maybe it is an east coast problem, but all the supercharger locations I have visited in North and South Carolina are in really strange spots. If you think about the demographic of the people driving these cars and the general use case (going to be in a spot for 8-15 minutes, probably need a restroom, and would be open to buying something to drink and/or eat), why are they in the back of dark, out of the way parking lots? Out of the 5 that I have visited none had an obvious place to go to the restroom (although we set off by foot and found places, but required walking in the dark and hoping). Seems like a big missed opportunity - prior to ownership, I just assumed they would all be adjacent to Starbucks or something... Plus some of these were places I wouldn’t necessarily want my daughter to be stopped at by herself at odd hours (with no streetlights, and no business very close). Who is picking these spots?
 
Not my experience. The new Lexington, NC supercharger off I-85 is in a Sheetz parking lot continuing a partnership between the two companies. Burlington NC supercharger is indeed at the back end of a Dillard’s department store parking lot, but lots of stores nearby. Two supercharger in the Charlotte area are at malls, the third one is located on a hotel property. Greenville, SC has a supercharger off I-85 at a hotel. The supercharger in Durham (Cary) NC is at a huge mall. Greensboro NC is at another Sheetz, and it is located next to a large mall.

As you can tell most of my experience is along the I-85 corridor between Greenville SC and Raleigh-Durham NC but almost all of those sites offer potty and food breaks on-site or a short walk, Burlington being the exception. That said, if you have to stop during the wee hours when most stores are closed, then yeah, it will be lonely, dark, and uninviting. But you should have no competition for charging stalls.
 
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Being involved in commercial real estate and development I can only imagine what Tesla's site selection matrix looks like. The SC stalls are not a $$ maker (yet). So part of their selection process is probably heavily weighted towards power availability #1, ground lease rates/terms #2. Land close to freeways and major interchanges = $$$.

They probably also have brokers that look at sites in growth areas with the mantra of "if you build it, they will come". i.e. There is a chance of growth and development in the next decade where these stalls are being built, so we want to be there, lock in and let people build around us, and partially because of us.

Lastly, the partnership with Target, focusing on sites that are directly off of a freeway was a brilliant move, and a model that Tesla should continue to explore with other big-box retailers who own their own land.
 
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Being involved in commercial real estate and development I can only imagine what Tesla's site selection matrix looks like. The SC stalls are not a $$ maker (yet). So part of their selection process is probably heavily weighted towards power availability #1, ground lease rates/terms #2. Land close to freeways and major interchanges = $$$.

They probably also have brokers that look at sites in growth areas with the mantra of "if you build it, they will come". i.e. There is a chance of growth and development in the next decade where these stalls are being built, so we want to be there, lock in and let people build around us, and partially because of us.

Lastly, the partnership with Target, focusing on sites that are directly off of a freeway was a brilliant move, and a model that Tesla should continue to explore with other big-box retailers who own their own land.

Your guess seems logical but therein lies the fallacy as Tesla does stuff at times that seems to fly directly in the face of all logic. A prime example that comes to mind is the stretch of I25 in Colorado between the Southern Denver area and the Pueblo area Superchargers in Colorado Springs. This is a very important Supercharger for those traveling the I25 corridor as you likely won't be able to skip it with most every Tesla made. So why they decided to have you not only exit and drive further into downtown Colorado Springs but then have to pay to pull into a parking garage is beyond me. Logic would have said that if they desired to make these more for those traveling long distances and NOT for those who live locally (the stated use for them) they would have gone with the easier access of right off of I25 somewhere near town and further away from the city center point where the cost of land is highest.

I've seen others that were similar during our trips all over the country but this is the first example that pops into mind when I think of the stupidest location for a Supercharger. Don't get me wrong, if I had never been there I might appreciate being able to walk around downtown while my slow 85kWh pack charged but that's not the idea of these things. The idea is to get you in and out as quickly/easily as possible and on to your destination. The needlessly meandering around downtown Colorado Springs while you wait is the only logic I can assign to that site selection.

Agreed on the Target agreement. They've also reached a similar agreement with Kum & Go which has lead to what has been a fairly rapid (nowhere near as fast as the "doubling" he promised us for 2019 at the beginning though) increase in them around the greater Denver area and around Colorado. Hopefully these sort of agreements happen at a faster rate and help them and others around the country where the number of Superchargers is still pretty limited.
 
I think that in the early days, any supercharger installation was in the perfect spot. Maybe developers saw the future and decided to ask Tesla about installing chargers or maybe Tesla reached out themselves but if the location filled a gap on a major travel route it was installed.

A hotel, is to me, a strange location for a supercharger, better then a downtown parking garage.. CO springs, but still most people aren’t going to buy a room and stay the night, but they use the bathrooms and fill up the trash cans. Hotels don’t seem to benefit much because you typically only spend 20-30mins charging. Next on the list is large retail locations, yes you might stop and shop for a few mins but with V3 installations you spend even less time shopping. Not to mention with idle fees folks won’t want to just plug their car in and go shopping for a few hours.

IMHO Truck stops, and travel centers make the most sense for supercharger locations. They’re usually just off the freeway, there are bathrooms 24/7, and there’s fast food close by. These sites are well suited for a quick 5-30min stop. Then you could install 11kw L2 chargers everywhere else where business would benefit from a captive audience for a few hours with no idle fees.
 
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Don't forget that they also have to find locations that can easily supply the needed power, which is a significant load even for a small eight station supercharger.

I think V3 uses a 1MVA trans and a v2 uses a 500 or 750kVA for a typical 8 stall location. That’s 45 amps on 22/12470y distribution so yea at full load it’s a pretty big demand if the infrastructure isn’t up to par. However, Tesla can supplement full load demand with batteries and solar if needed, all it takes is $$.
 
Not my experience. The new Lexington, NC supercharger off I-85 is in a Sheetz parking lot continuing a partnership between the two companies. Burlington NC supercharger is indeed at the back end of a Dillard’s department store parking lot, but lots of stores nearby. Two supercharger in the Charlotte area are at malls, the third one is located on a hotel property. Greenville, SC has a supercharger off I-85 at a hotel. The supercharger in Durham (Cary) NC is at a huge mall. Greensboro NC is at another Sheetz, and it is located next to a large mall.

As you can tell most of my experience is along the I-85 corridor between Greenville SC and Raleigh-Durham NC but almost all of those sites offer potty and food breaks on-site or a short walk, Burlington being the exception. That said, if you have to stop during the wee hours when most stores are closed, then yeah, it will be lonely, dark, and uninviting. But you should have no competition for charging stalls.

Unfortunately, further up I-85 in South Hill is the SC located behind a sketchy restaurant, next to the smelly dumpsters in the back, a quarter of a mile away from a Travel Center on a 2 lane road with no sidewalks. Not sure what the thinking was on that one.
 
I've seen both ends of the spectrum. From Cisco, TX at a great truck stop handy to the side of the store, well lit, etc. Then Shreveport, LA, on the edge of a dying shopping center in a very dark sketchy lonely area.
Alexandria, LA - downtown, next to a Holiday Inn staffed by very nice folks. The Dallas SC is on the edge of a shopping center trying to make it back. But delayed for at least a couple of years from announcement to operation. The list goes from "Great Idea!" to "What were they thinking?"
I'm guessing real estate costs - lease, rent, purchase, whatever is the major determinant. Power can be brought 'near anywhere. At a cost, of course.
Shopping centers want people to come in, stay long, and spend money. So they want parking convenience maxed for these customers.
Supercharger customers want a short stay - charge, probably a restroom, then snacks, maybe a fast food meal and go. Therefore, not a high profit bunch, we. So we are relegated to the fringes of a commercial area. Alone and doing the full bladder dance.
Frankly, I would be happy to pay a buck or two per visit if it meant I had handy access to a sanitary waste depository, snacks or at least vending machines, and a reasonably secure area so I wouldn't have to bring my sidearm, especially in jurisdictions where that is frowned upon.
I think the folks at Buc-Ees, the major truck stop chains, and the mega convenience store chains are missing the boat for now and the future when they will sell more coffee and snacks than petroleum products. 7-11, Racetrack, Circle K - are you listening?
Props to Sheetz, Wawa, and the other forward thinking 24hour convenience chains. I think their early adoption will pay off bigtime as the market grows.
 
We have years of experience building the right services around gas stations. A charging stop might be a bit longer but the required services are similar: restroom, snacks/food etc. drdumont has it right I think: real estate price and accessibility, electricity access etc. Tesla don't make much money off of SCs I'm sure.
 
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nfortunately, further up I-85 in South Hill is the SC located behind a sketchy restaurant, next to the smelly dumpsters in the back, a quarter of a mile away from a Travel Center on a 2 lane road with no sidewalks. Not sure what the thinking was on that one.

I have to stop at that Supercharger frequently, including yesterday. It is often gross and it smells terrible because the restaurant staff doesn't close the door to the dumpsters. Also, Kahill's is a mediocre restaurant on it's best days -- both the food and the service.

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However, that Supercharger predates the Love's Travel Center that was built down the road shortly afterwards. I agree that it would make a much better choice for a Supercharger location if they were choosing one in South Hill today. There is plenty of parking, large bathrooms, and plenty of food options. More than once I've walked down there while charging, but you are right that it is sketchy since there are no sidewalks and the traffic moves quite fast around there.

Locations like Kahill's made more sense when Superchargers were far apart and charging was much slower on the S/X. If you had to sit for 1 to 1.5 hours somewhere, it may as well be at a restaurant where you could go in and eat. The situation is far different now with faster charging and many more Superchargers. I rarely stay at Superchargers more than 30-40 minutes, typically only 15-20 unless there is a large gap until the next one. I think the Sheetz/Wawa partnerships are ideal these days with V3 charging speeds.
 
While attempting to utilize the Supercharger network this holiday season I encountered several charging locations at malls which was not ideal due to the holiday shopping traffic. Easily added 1+ unnecessary hours to my trip and added stress from traffic. What's so bad about off the interstate as well, instead of miles away?
 
While attempting to utilize the Supercharger network this holiday season I encountered several charging locations at malls which was not ideal due to the holiday shopping traffic. Easily added 1+ unnecessary hours to my trip and added stress from traffic. What's so bad about off the interstate as well, instead of miles away?

I think the mall ones are early. The mall one on my town (South Bend, IN) is a stupid location. Not close to highway and crappy mall. But it was one of the very early Midwest super chargers.

new one seems to be in much smarter places. Look at the pending ones coming soon....