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Superchargers in Iceland

Discussion in 'Europe' started by KarenRei, Dec 20, 2019.

  1. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    I've heard some rumblings about rental companies. As for reliability, this comes from our local FB EV group. I don't know if any of them use Plugshare.
     
  2. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    #22 KarenRei, Dec 20, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2019

    Local owners have extensively gamed out Supercharger locations (Tesla even invited our assistance! :) ) The Ring realistically should have 7-ish Superchargers, not counting Reykjavík (the as-noted lowest priority). But then there's a lot of places off the Ring. You don't really need one in Reykjanes (the airport peninsula - it needs destination charging), but Snæfellsnes def. needs at least one, and Vestfirðir needs at least 3, for example. The south has a lot of "inland" area, including the heavily trafficked Golden Circle; you definitely need one at either Geysir or Gullfoss. And on and on. Really, a "full network" would involve something like two dozen stations. But obviously we have no delusions that we'll see that any time soon!

    We don't need a lot of chargers per stations. What we need is geographic coverage - many small stations. We're roughly tied with Australia for being the second least densely populated country in the world (Australia slightly beats is out, although Mongolia clobbers us both ;) ). And while our low speed limit reduces energy consumption, our winter storms definitely don't! ;) Neither does our terrain. People like to tow here, too.

    The only place I'd expect to see more than 4 stalls would be 1 station near the middle of Reykjavík for apartment dwellers (that's a problem here, the city has really lagged with public charging access relative to public interest and our ambitious goals... because they've been obsessed with trying to force everyone to walk, bike, or take the bus, but nobody wants to). The current location doesn't work for that - too remote from everything and nothing to do. Higher-traffic parts of the Ring Road (e.g. generally those closer to Reykjavík) would probably be best served with 4-stall stations for now. All other locations (incl. the far side of the Ring Road), two stalls should be just fine for now.
     
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  3. AudubonB

    AudubonB One can NOT induce accuracy with precision!

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    Serious Q:
    Are you familiar with vehicle rental possibilities at the ferry terminal in the east? Looking it up, it's.....Seydisfjordur. Whether or not that's correct, can you suggest the viability of a Tesla rental fleet there rather than in Rjkvk?

    We're trying to coordinate a trip from the Faeroes......
     
  4. ccdisce

    ccdisce EBISU like

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    Denmark is more politically correct, if Karen approves.
     
  5. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    Sorry, I don't live anywhere near there.

    Ugh, no, I don't want to give them any notion that we're still under their thumb.
     
  6. Chuq

    Chuq Active Member

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    It's OK, Blueshift has added the country to the list of options :)
     
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  7. AudubonB

    AudubonB One can NOT induce accuracy with precision!

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    As of morning, 28 December, supercharge.info has this as OPEN!, although it is not yet showing up on tesla.com
     
  8. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    It opened on Monday. Lots of photos of people charging on the Icelandic Tesla Facebook group. Definitely not V3; people still haven't shown close to 145kW yet (though most were charging at high SoCs, and it's a smattering of mostly older cars because new deliveries haven't started yet)
     
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  9. PLUS EV

    PLUS EV Running on Empty

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    If it's primarily intended for service center use, it may never show up in the Nav or on the website.
     
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  10. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Well-Known Member

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    How many reservations? If we say 7 x 4 stalls, and call it 3.5 Superchargers then that's, resaonably conservatively, $750k needed, which might only need about 1500 sales. So, given strong incentives, maybe no problem.

    But they also need to maintain the network. So a cost question is, how much use would the Superchargers around the island actually get?

    I figured that there'd be at least some Icelanders who don't have home charging who'd want a Tesla, hence starting with a Supercharger in Reykjavik and going from there.
     
  11. PLUS EV

    PLUS EV Running on Empty

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    Keep in mind, this is a country that purchases ~15,000 new vehicles per year. So it might take Tesla a while to sell 1500 cars.
     
  12. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    It really won't :) I wouldn't be at all surprised if the Model 3 spends much of the next year at the top of the sales list. Only threatened by the Model Y.

    Nobody expects full coverage of the island instantaneously. But total sales numbers accumulates over time.
     
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  13. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    #33 KarenRei, Dec 31, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2019
    Pricing is 40 ISK/kWh ($0,33/kWh, €0,29/kWh, 2,90 NOK/kWh). Annoyingly and inexplicably high. Part of that is taxes (24% VAT), but even the pre-tax rate is high (32,25 ISK/kWh pretax - $0,27/kWh, €0,24/kWh, 2,34 NOK/kWh). For example, Norway's rates (post-tax) are 1,70 NOK/kWh (23 ISK/kWh, $0,19/kWh, €0,17/kWh), so even if Norway has a tax exemption on EV charging and we don't (I don't know whether that's the case), that wouldn't explain it. And our base raw electricity prices are cheaper than Norway's. Electricity is produced so cheaply here that companies run alumium smelters here, despite there being no alumium ore in the country - they ship in the bauxite and ship out the refined product, basically using the energy-intensive alumium refining process to export our cheap electricity.

    I have no explanation for this pricing. Maybe Tesla has their Supercharger station on the wrong electricity rate plan or something. Hopefully this rate changes, because it's not a good look charging us so much when our power is so cheap. Our Supercharging costs are nearly as high as in Germany (€0,33/kWh after tax), which has the highest electricity costs in Europe.

    [​IMG]

    Note that in the above they're talking about household rates. But industrial rates are much cheaper; half our household bills are distribution costs. Industrial consumers in Reykjavík can get power for a little over half the price of residential consumers, and it's even cheaper for large consumers in the countryside closer to direct feeds from the power plants.

    (Superchargers have to pay (significant) demand charges since they're surge consumers rather than being a steady load... but that applies to Tesla in every market, not just Iceland)
     
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  14. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    I kind of wonder if the answer is simply "because they can get away with it". The only "competition" is ON, which isn't any competition at all (overpriced, frequently unreliable or overoccupied "50kW" stations).
     
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  15. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Well-Known Member

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    Maybe demand charges v energy used?

    Look at it as a positive sign: high pricing increases the chance that Tesla will be able to have more Superchargers.
     
  16. mongo

    mongo Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps because the equipment (Tesla's and the power provider) itself has both an installation and maintenance cost that they need to recoup? It also serves as an incentive to install home charging which frees Supercharger capacity for longer distance travelers.

    Just so I'm clear, it looks like a 0.10 Euro surcharge pre tax over the electric rate in the graph. So on a 50 kWh charge, Tesla recoups 5.00, and Iceland pockets 2.50 in VAT on a total charge cost of 14.50.

    There is also the potential for a difference between a demand rate versus household rate. From one link, the rate goes down the more you use, so this may just be an interim issue.
     
  17. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    Any answer given that applies equally or worse to other countries (such as demand charges or paying for the equipment) is not an answer. Demand charges here are not abnormally expensive (I've actually worked with industrial rate figures here before, for an unrelated project).

    VAT is 24% on electricity here.

    I'm hoping for the "they're charging more in order to justify a larger buildout relative to the number of sales here" theory. I'd find that to be a price worth paying.
     
  18. mongo

    mongo Well-Known Member

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    @Beltsbear
    Iceland is only now becoming an officially supported Tesla zone. Starting out high on charging costs is a reasonable course of action to encourage the adoption of home charging and destination charging at businesses. If they started low, then other charge methods would not be cost competitive (in the near term).

    It also allows Tesla to adjust price downward to match demand/ usage as opposed to starting low and getting complaints if they needed to increase the rate to cover equipment and wear.

    I think to use comparative data, you would need to limit scope either to countries when Tesla is newly introduced, or wait for Iceland to have a large number of on the road Teslas. Also need to adjust based on previously established EVs in that region.
     
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  19. Matt L

    Matt L Active Member

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    Well, if they are charging too much, it would seem the market would be ripe for someone to build out a competitive alternative. If nobody does, I guess they aren’t charging too much.
     
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  20. samppa

    samppa Member

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    Also if you compare that to price of gasoline, it's still cheap.. And iceland is a very small market.

    Suc should be priced so that you only use it when traveling, so that it's not blocked by local cars.

    They've been lately installing those dual units here too (Finland). Makes sense, this is still also a small market, and at first they installed superchargers that have 8-10 stalls.. these are pretty much almost always empty.
     

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