Suspension upgrade recommendation for 2021 MY LR AWD comfortable ride

[tangible1]

I don't think you want to be messing with the sway bars particularly if the concern is with getting the ride more comfortable. I would recommend the Comfort Adjustable coilovers from MPP. I would also recommend getting the lightest forged wheel you can afford in a 19 inch size. And when the stock tires get worn I would look under the high-performance all-season category on Tire Rack to find the tire that gets top ratings for ride and comfort. Combination of these three things are likely to be transformative in terms of your ride quality. Reducing unsprung weight is oftentimes neglected in discussions about ride and tuning for a ride.

I do not believe that folks who have driven both the Ohlins and KW coilover kits would agree that the Ohlins is superior. Both camps have their fans. There is no objective evidence on that question and anyone suggesting that there is is just advertising. If the advertising is persuasive enough for you to spend the extra thousand bucks, by all means. MPP has by far the bigger installation base both in Model Y and in the Model 3.

If ride height is a consideration, be aware that the MPP and UPP kits design assumes a 1/2" or more drop in ride height.
MYLR stock 6.6" dropped to 6.0" may not sound like much but it can affect the damper characteristics and bump stop range if you go lower or higher.

One advantage of the Redwood kit is dual height adjustment, without loss of dynamic range.
While potentially more complex to set up properly (get a good shop), you get a result that can work both higher or lower than stock ride height.
And, the Redwood dampers do not require removal from the car to make ride height adjustments, which is a big cost/time factor for initial install/setup.
So they're easier to install, and set up really isn't that much different. It's just many shops don't do much beyond slap in parts.

As usual, you get what you pay for. YMMV

 

[Sunvalleylaw]

the OP regarding dual-height adjustable dampers is correct. you must make sure the installer knows what / how to do the adjustments / install.
the flip side is that you can use the Redwood setup to KEEP THE OEM RIDE HEIGHT (or even very slightly higher).
the MPP and UPP kits assume a 1/2" or more drop in ride height.
The MYLR stock height is 6.6 inches. Already not much leeway for real world bumps.
Dropping to 6.0 inches is the MPP / UPP default design assumption, and bump stops and damper characteristics are affected that's if changed.

Hmm. Ok, MPP, and UPP might not be the right thing for my needs after all. And my primary aim with improving suspensino is to calm any rear end instability over rough roads, particularly on curves. Adjustability season to season might be nice too. Track days and auto cross is not really in the cards or the goal. But good summer handling on dry roads, and adjustability for limited dirt road is.

A well designed aftermarket product that added adjustability on the fly like the more expensive cars, that could be made to work somehow with the screen in the car, or even some separate little screen that could be tucked away, would be really a nice option.

I may be sounding like an idiot here, as i have not really thought about aftermarket suspension since I had old Alfa’s and was looking at Koni’s and Bilsteins. And all this air stuff, and adjustability seems pretty new to me.

 

[tangible1]

I don't think you want to be messing with the sway bars particularly if the concern is with getting the ride more comfortable. I would recommend the Comfort Adjustable coilovers from MPP. I would also recommend getting the lightest forged wheel you can afford in a 19 inch size. And when the stock tires get worn I would look under the high-performance all-season category on Tire Rack to find the tire that gets top ratings for ride and comfort. Combination of these three things are likely to be transformative in terms of your ride quality. Reducing unsprung weight is oftentimes neglected in discussions about ride and tuning for a ride.

I do not believe that folks who have driven both the Ohlins and KW coilover kits would agree that the Ohlins is superior. Both camps have their fans. There is no objective evidence on that question and anyone suggesting that there is is just advertising. If the advertising is persuasive enough for you to spend the extra thousand bucks, by all means. MPP has by far the bigger installation base both in Model Y and in the Model 3.

If ride height is a consideration, be aware that the MPP and UPP kits design assumes a 1/2" or more drop in ride height.
MYLR stock 6.6" dropped to 6.0" may not sound like much but it can affect the damper characteristics and bump stop range if you go lower or higher.

One advantage of the Redwood kit is dual height adjustment, without loss of dynamic range.
While potentially more complex to set up properly (get a good shop), you get a result that can work both higher or lower than stock ride height.
And, the Redwood dampers do not require removal from the car to make ride height adjustments, which is a big cost/time factor for initial install/setup.
So they're easier to install, and set up really isn

As usual, you get what you pay for. YMMV

Hmm. Ok, MPP, and UPP might not be the right thing for my needs after all. And my primary aim with improving suspensino is to calm any rear end instability over rough roads, particularly on curves. Adjustability season to season might be nice too. Track days and auto cross is not really in the cards or the goal. But good summer handling on dry roads, and adjustability for limited dirt road is.

A well designed aftermarket product that added adjustability on the fly like the more expensive cars, that could be made to work somehow with the screen in the car, or even some separate little screen that could be tucked away, would be really a nice option.

I may be sounding like an idiot here, as i have not really thought about aftermarket suspension since I had old Alfa’s and was looking at Koni’s and Bilsteins. And all this air stuff, and adjustability seems pretty new to me.

these setups for Tesla, while offering some adjustability assume those adjustments are done during installation. Mostly.
You can make some minor changes but the front coilovers for example have a lot of spring preload, making changes a challenge with the springs under tension.
The Redwood kit allows the BODY of the damper to be moved up/down, so it's slightly easier, but....YMMV.

There is one vendor selling air kits but for $$$$$ and really for lowering, not really raising.
And forget integration to the Tesla control screen. They provide a whole separate control surface.

The Tesla suspension isn't rudimentary but it's basic - double wishbone coilovers front and multi-link rear.
The nature of a hatchback also means you'll get some buffeting in the rear open area. I don't think anything but better spring/damper is needed.
All can be mitigated but Tesla makes you do it to your taste and experience.

 

[gadgetfreaky]

I had dropped my Redwood Ohlin Grand touring by 1/2", I didn't realize they can adjust it back up in height to stock without taking it off! thank you for that. I love the ride but I want to see if I can get an even softer luxury ride back at stock height. will call the shop tomorrow.

 

[dfwatt]

the OP regarding dual-height adjustable dampers is correct. you must make sure the installer knows what / how to do the adjustments / install.
the flip side is that you can use the Redwood setup to KEEP THE OEM RIDE HEIGHT (or even very slightly higher).
the MPP and UPP kits assume a 1/2" or more drop in ride height.
The MYLR stock height is 6.6 inches. Already not much leeway for real world bumps.
Dropping to 6.0 inches is the MPP / UPP default design assumption, and bump stops and damper characteristics are affected that's if changed.

Nope. Bump stops are changed out in the MPP kit. Part of the problem with early model 3 Teslas was how much time they spent on their bump stops. This was one of the reasons why lowering springs alone were a bad idea.

 

[dfwatt]

If ride height is a consideration, be aware that the MPP and UPP kits design assumes a 1/2" or more drop in ride height.
MYLR stock 6.6" dropped to 6.0" may not sound like much but it can affect the damper characteristics and bump stop range if you go lower or higher.

One advantage of the Redwood kit is dual height adjustment, without loss of dynamic range.
While potentially more complex to set up properly (get a good shop), you get a result that can work both higher or lower than stock ride height.
And, the Redwood dampers do not require removal from the car to make ride height adjustments, which is a big cost/time factor for initial install/setup.
So they're easier to install, and set up really isn't that much different. It's just many shops don't do much beyond slap in parts.

As usual, you get what you pay for. YMMV

I think if you dig it out on one of the threads discussing Mountain Pass versus Redwood coilover kits or you email them Mountain Pass will clarify for you that what you're repeating is basically Redwood advertising and is not factual. It's fine to advertise as long as you don't cross over into disinformation.

 

[Sunvalleylaw]

There is one vendor selling air kits but for $$$$$ and really for lowering, not really raising.
And forget integration to the Tesla control screen. They provide a whole separate control surface.

The Tesla suspension isn't rudimentary but it's basic - double wishbone coilovers front and multi-link rear.
The nature of a hatchback also means you'll get some buffeting in the rear open area. I don't think anything but better spring/damper is needed.
All can be mitigated but Tesla makes you do it to your taste and experience.

Thanks. that makes sense and is helpful.

No big rush. Still a few to several months before I get my car, and then I can get to know it, and decide what i really want to do. At this point, I could receive it still during snow season, but likely the really large dumps that create a problem in my longer driveway will be past me. Also, though I will want to drive this car for most things, I will be retaining my big truck for really big days, and significant off-road other than getting down a dirt road to a trail head (probably, some camping with bikes might also happen in summer, and that could result in longer trips in). so I am not needing a huge adjustability factor. Probably the biggest thing would be the better dampers/springs to calm any of that rear end stuff with the hatch.

I just don’t want it to get too unsettled over unevenness on sweeping mountain roads, as i recall distinctly watching a swing axle Fiat I was following on the track, (my Alfa had de Dion suspension which came stock, but with Bilstein shocks added. Was a firm ride!) with that Fiat getting the rear end dancy, and losing rear end traction over the hump in the final turns back to the straight on SIR (Pacific Raceways) when I was in my old Alfetta GT in an Alfa track day years and years ago. That did not work out well for the Fiat. And that sort of turn could be part of my regular driving up here in the mountains. Not that I think I will be doing any track driving, but I might get inspired and spirited on some mountain curves, and Idaho’s roads are not perfect.

 

[Sudsington]

I think if you dig it out on one of the threads discussing Mountain Pass versus Redwood coilover kits or you email them Mountain Pass will clarify for you that what you're repeating is basically Redwood advertising and is not factual. It's fine to advertise as long as you don't cross over into disinformation.

Yup, I think this was MPP's response to the same user about their misunderstanding (or disinformation?) of how height affects damper characteristics: MountainPass Performance Comfort Coilovers

 

[GeezerSquid]

People using the word "disinformation" makes me nervous.

 

[MasterC17]

I think if you dig it out on one of the threads discussing Mountain Pass versus Redwood coilover kits or you email them Mountain Pass will clarify for you that what you're repeating is basically Redwood advertising and is not factual. It's fine to advertise as long as you don't cross over into disinformation.

You also definitely do not need to remove the MPP suspension to make adjustments lol

 

[dfwatt]

I had dropped my Redwood Ohlin Grand touring by 1/2", I didn't realize they can adjust it back up in height to stock without taking it off! thank you for that. I love the ride but I want to see if I can get an even softer luxury ride back at stock height. will call the shop tomorrow.

Unless you're routinely engaging the bump stops because of the roads you drive on raising your ride height will make no difference. It changes nothing about shock or spring kinetics as long as you hit neither full droop nor Bump Stop. It does however give you an unsightly wheel Gap but I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. About the only reason I can think of that someone would want to run their car at a stock ride height is if they routinely like everyday drive with four people on board.

 

[tangible1]

Thanks. that makes sense and is helpful.

No big rush. Still a few to several months before I get my car, and then I can get to know it, and decide what i really want to do. At this point, I could receive it still during snow season, but likely the really large dumps that create a problem in my longer driveway will be past me. Also, though I will want to drive this car for most things, I will be retaining my big truck for really big days, and significant off-road other than getting down a dirt road to a trail head (probably, some camping with bikes might also happen in summer, and that could result in longer trips in). so I am not needing a huge adjustability factor. Probably the biggest thing would be the better dampers/springs to calm any of that rear end stuff with the hatch.

I just don’t want it to get too unsettled over unevenness on sweeping mountain roads, as i recall distinctly watching a swing axle Fiat I was following on the track, (my Alfa had de Dion suspension which came stock, but with Bilstein shocks added. Was a firm ride!) with that Fiat getting the rear end dancy, and losing rear end traction over the hump in the final turns back to the straight on SIR (Pacific Raceways) when I was in my old Alfetta GT in an Alfa track day years and years ago. That did not work out well for the Fiat. And that sort of turn could be part of my regular driving up here in the mountains. Not that I think I will be doing any track driving, but I might get inspired and spirited on some mountain curves, and Idaho’s roads are not perfect.

1. good choice to retain the truck. I should do the same with mine but after 15 years, I'm ready for it to change hands anyway.
2. the rear multilink on the MY won't behave quite like the Fiat
3. I think you'd be fine with most any of the solutions out there; keep to 1/2' drop or less.
You might also consider larger diameter tires. The MY should fit 275/45/19, diameter of 28.7 (MY will go 29 or 29.5, must check front turning rub)
There is of course a very minor speedo and odo difference, and Tesla UI can't adjust for it.
All assumes you do not use snow chains on it.
4. There's a new suspension kit specifically for the MY now available directly from KW. It may be more performance oriented, but it suggests still more are coming.

 

[tangible1]

I think if you dig it out on one of the threads discussing Mountain Pass versus Redwood coilover kits or you email them Mountain Pass will clarify for you that what you're repeating is basically Redwood advertising and is not factual. It's fine to advertise as long as you don't cross over into disinformation.

I have dug into that, and MPP clarifies that they've accounted for the 1/2" drop in their design characteristics. All good. Full respect to MPP.
But since the User was looking NOT to drop the ride height, and potentially RAISE IT, the post I put up is accurate.

However, it's worthwhile to clarify that anyone doing a suspension change needs to make sure they understand as much as possible.
It's not necessarily a 'drop in' for any situation.

 

[dfwatt]

I have dug into that, and MPP clarifies that they've accounted for the 1/2" drop in their design characteristics. All good. Full respect to MPP.
But since the User was looking NOT to drop the ride height, and potentially RAISE IT, the post I put up is accurate.

However, it's worthwhile to clarify that anyone doing a suspension change needs to make sure they understand as much as possible.
It's not necessarily a 'drop in' for any situation.

Further proof that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. You're claiming that the MPP kit shows problems with "dynamic range" relative to the Redwood kit. Where is your evidence of that? Additionally MPP does not suggest one of their coilover kits for somebody who wants to raise the stock ride height but one of their lift kits. You keep moving the goalposts. And in terms of utility, almost everybody wants to lower a stock model y or model 3 not raise the ride height. Most people see the exaggerated wheel Gap as unsightly. Obviously some people don't care. But that's a small minority.

 

[thesmokingman]

If ride height is a consideration, be aware that the MPP and UPP kits design assumes a 1/2" or more drop in ride height.
MYLR stock 6.6" dropped to 6.0" may not sound like much but it can affect the damper characteristics and bump stop range if you go lower or higher.

One advantage of the Redwood kit is dual height adjustment, without loss of dynamic range.
While potentially more complex to set up properly (get a good shop), you get a result that can work both higher or lower than stock ride height.
And, the Redwood dampers do not require removal from the car to make ride height adjustments, which is a big cost/time factor for initial install/setup.
So they're easier to install, and set up really isn

As usual, you get what you pay for. YMMV

these setups for Tesla, while offering some adjustability assume those adjustments are done during installation. Mostly.
You can make some minor changes but the front coilovers for example have a lot of spring preload, making changes a challenge with the springs under tension.
The Redwood kit allows the BODY of the damper to be moved up/down, so it's slightly easier, but....YMMV.

There is one vendor selling air kits but for $$$$$ and really for lowering, not really raising.
And forget integration to the Tesla control screen. They provide a whole separate control surface.

The Tesla suspension isn't rudimentary but it's basic - double wishbone coilovers front and multi-link rear.
The nature of a hatchback also means you'll get some buffeting in the rear open area. I don't think anything but better spring/damper is needed.
All can be mitigated but Tesla makes you do it to your taste and experience.

There's some misconceptions about the Ohlins. The dual height or adjustable perch is mainly good for raising height, not necessarily for lowering. When lowering it essentially becomes a fixed perch coilover due to safety reasons. Redwood confirms this by stating that you should not adjust to a lowered height by the perch after a certain amount, check their instructions and their warning. If you go too low on an adjustable perch coil, you'll end up not only maxing out the suspension but putting your HV battery in danger due to too low of a height. Thus the warning not to use the body lowering and instead use the perch essentially making it a fixed perch just like the MPP when lowering.

The advantage of the Ohlins over a fixed perch is being able to raise height and ofc the DFV valve. Besides that both setups are very comparable. The fixed high speed compression limitation of the KW kinda sucks but eh it's only a pita for .005% of users.

 

[tangible1]

Further proof that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. You're claiming that the MPP kit shows problems with "dynamic range" relative to the Redwood kit. Where is your evidence of that? Additionally MPP does not suggest one of their coilover kits for somebody who wants to raise the stock ride height but one of their lift kits. You keep moving the goalposts. And in terms of utility, almost everybody wants to lower a stock model y or model 3 not raise the ride height. Most people see the exaggerated wheel Gap as unsightly. Obviously some people don't care. But that's a small minority.

'Everybody' isn't every use case.
In the particular thread in question, the user was expressing a desire to keep stock ride height, or potentially go higher. Reasons were listed.

While I agree that most might prefer to drop ride height, in this case the user did not.

I would disagree with you regarding initial ride height setup for the MPP.
The alignment shop I use for all my cars, including Porsche 911 racecar, went thru the install for another MY owner and it was PIA to get heights set.
Lots of spring preload makes it, umm, necessary, and, of course, you change one corner and the other corners move. Very time consuming.

Maybe that's just that shop. But they've been doing it for street and track for 35 years or more and I know (and race with) the Owner. YMMV

 

[Sunvalleylaw]

1. good choice to retain the truck. I should do the same with mine but after 15 years, I'm ready for it to change hands anyway.
2. the rear multilink on the MY won't behave quite like the Fiat
3. I think you'd be fine with most any of the solutions out there; keep to 1/2' drop or less.
You might also consider larger diameter tires. The MY should fit 275/45/19, diameter of 28.7 (MY will go 29 or 29.5, must check front turning rub)
There is of course a very minor speedo and odo difference, and Tesla UI can't adjust for it.
All assumes you do not use snow chains on it.
4. There's a new suspension kit specifically for the MY now available directly from KW. It may be more performance oriented, but it suggests still more are coming.

1. I am lucky. The 2010 diesel dodge pickup has lots of life left. Just past 100k now, and has a new tranny and suspension, and Cummins is in excellent shape. The Lighting, Rivian and the Cyber truck will not do what I want to a truck to do yet, so the plan is to use the MYLR for almost everything, and have the truck do only truck things. I do not want to put more miles on it for just basic transport, and I don’t want to be burning diesel when I don’t have to.

2. Good! That was never a good suspension. Will never forget seeing that thing drift down the banked curve and the front end catching the edge of the pavement and that little car rolling into the infield, throwing rocks and dust everywhere. Thankfully, everyone was ok.

3. Sounds good. I liked my conversation with MPP. I am sure there are pluses and minuses to any of them. As said, will wait and see after I get to know the car. As far as diameter tires, and snow tires, the plan currently will be to keep my stock wheels and tires to start, as we will be heading out of winter, and then add a winter set of wheels later on. Will decide stud-less or studs later after I do more research. I loved my old Nokian studded tires on my old steel rims (would not get steel here. Would likely get a summer set of rims, and use the stock rims for winter) on my Passat TDI wagon, FWD, and it has always done fine as long as it did not get high centered under the motor by poor choices on what piles of snow the driver took on. But there are good studless options out there now as well. I have not put on a set of chains in years. If it was that kind of day, I would use the truck and go slow, or stay home.

Thanks for the info!

 

[Sunvalleylaw]

Most people see the exaggerated wheel Gap as unsightly. Obviously some people don't care. But that's a small minority.

Umm, I can give a flying duck, about the “gap.” It looks completely normal to me in the stock pic.

 

[gadgetfreaky]

Unless you're routinely engaging the bump stops because of the roads you drive on raising your ride height will make no difference. It changes nothing about shock or spring kinetics as long as you hit neither full droop nor Bump Stop. It does however give you an unsightly wheel Gap but I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. About the only reason I can think of that someone would want to run their car at a stock ride height is if they routinely like everyday drive with four people on board.

I ended up calling @RedwoodMotors they said that the Y particular suspension is built different in the rear than the front, and thus slightly lowering the rear does impact ride quality. I went ahead and dropped off the car today to take back to stock height. I agree it looks better lower. When I get the 20" rims and see how it rides I might lower it back but am excited to see if there's a difference at stock height. I'm still a big fan of these. I'm just trying to see if I can get a lexus ride quality out of it, which just might be too much to ask.

 

[dfwatt]

I ended up calling @RedwoodMotors they said that the Y particular suspension is built different in the rear than the front, and thus slightly lowering the rear does impact ride quality. I went ahead and dropped off the car today to take back to stock height. I agree it looks better lower. When I get the 20" rims and see how it rides I might lower it back but am excited to see if there's a difference at stock height. I'm still a big fan of these. I'm just trying to see if I can get a lexus ride quality out of it, which just might be too much to ask.

Not clear what the evidence is for that assertion of course the rear suspension is different from the front! But how lowering the car in that context would deteriorate the ride is unclear. Additionally it is not been reported by other at least as experienced groups like Mountain Pass. I'd ask them for their assessment of that idea before taking it as fact.