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Suspicous Listing

Discussion in 'Model S: Ordering, Production, Delivery' started by wcfinvader, Jul 16, 2014.

  1. wcfinvader

    wcfinvader Member

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    Location:
    Aurora, NE
    Tesla Model S Performance 85 $62,900 Portland, OR
    I've been talking with the seller and things seem really suspicious. I've already decided to not deal with that seller as I believe it's a scam. I've talked to the guy over the phone and he was very rude and had a heavy accent. There is no listing for the Dealer online other than http://www.KnDautodealers.com. Below is a email conversation I've had with him. Tesla service center in Portland stated it was a policy of theirs not to do inspections on used cars (They can but said anything found cannot be disclosed to new (potential) owner. So I've got a few questions for you all. For someone like me who would rather buy used how can I protect myself when an inspection through Tesla is worthless? How can I protect myself when buying out-of-state. I plan on flying to inspect before payment. I obviously cancelled plane tickets for Portland already due to MAJOR suspicion.

    Hi ------,

    The VIN number is 5YJSA1CN0DFP06153. An out of state sale won’t be a problem.

    I’m going to explain how the process usually works for a client who is not able to come pick an item up straight from our lot.

    First of all you will have to email me your details (name, address, preferred contact phone number and a fax number if you have one). Once we receive your info we will start processing your order and email or fax it over to you. If you agree the terms and have the funds ready to buy you will have to sign the order document and email/fax it back to us. After this you will be sent the payment invoice with our banking info for you to wire the funds towards our company's bank account. Once the bank confirms your payment the shipping procedure will be started. From the moment the Tesla is delivered you will have a 5 business days inspection period, time in which you can drive test it, take it to a service, to a mechanic. Everything you consider to make sure it fits your needs.

    If you decide to keep it you will call and let us know and that’s it, done deal. If you decide against the purchase you will have to call us and let us know. We will send you a full refund including delivery charges and send someone over to pick it up once you receive the refund.

    I look forward to hearing from you.

    Thanks
    Jeff


    Jeffrey Stevens
    Sales Manager
    K & D Auto
    4155 SW Cedar Hills Blvd
    Beaverton, OR 97005
    Phone: (503) 928-7908
    Fax: (503) 206-0924
    www.kndautodealers.com

    [email protected]







    From: -----
    Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 8:04 PM
    To: K & D Auto
    Subject: RE: 2013 Tesla S85


    cleardot.gif





    Btw can you send me the vin number? Thanks
    On Jul 14, 2014 8:29 PM, "--------wrote:
    I'm from omaha Nebraska. Would out of state sale be any problem?
    On Jul 14, 2014 5:44 PM, "K & D Auto" <[email protected]> wrote:
    Thank you for your inquiry on our 2013 Tesla S85. My name is Jeffrey Stevens, and I will be assisting you while shopping with us!
    As of right now, the Tesla is still available at $62,900.

    In reference to our 2013 Tesla S85 VIN #5YJSA1CN0DFP06153. I would rate the overall condition a 10 out of 10. There is no sign of current or previous damage to the car. It is exceptionally nice inside and out. It comes with a clear title.

    Where are you located?

    I look forward to hearing from you soon!

    Sincerely,
    Jeffrey Stevens
    Internet Manager
    K & D Auto










    http://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/detail/610920414/overview/
     
  2. pgiralt

    pgiralt Active Member

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    Well, for one thing it's not a P85 based on that VIN but their ad says "Performance" in the title.
     
  3. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Active Member

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    If you're suspicious, trying search Oregon's DB.

    Oregon DMV -- Dealer Licensing Lookup

    You can also contact the DMV's complaints department where they might be able to give you a quick hint about the business.
     
  4. GoBlue88

    GoBlue88 Member

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    #4 GoBlue88, Jul 16, 2014
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2014
    Yep. 8th digit = "N" which is the base motor. If it was a P85, that digit would be a "P". Interesting that on all the photos of it on cars.com, not one shows the rear badging.

    Also, does 06513 seem like a low VIN for 2013 manufacture (10th digit = "D" which indicates 2013)? Not sure what VIN they were on by the end of 2012.

    Also, how come the car doesn't show up on the inventory list on their website but is only on cars.com? Agree that it all seems suspicious.
     
  5. bonaire

    bonaire Active Member

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    Report it to the Beaverton, OR local police and be done with it. I am sure they can either do a local verification or write them up on attempted wire fraud.
     
  6. GoBlue88

    GoBlue88 Member

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    The cars.com listing also says that it has an 8-cylinder engine. LOL.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, don't all performance models come with the red brake calipers?
     
  7. timf

    timf Member

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    Other items may be suspicious but that VIN looks legit for 2013. My dad's is in the mid-6000s and was built in February 2013.
     
  8. GoBlue88

    GoBlue88 Member

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    The "sellers notes" on cars.com says it is an S85, even though the headline says it is a "performance" model.
     
  9. daxz

    daxz Member

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  10. GoBlue88

    GoBlue88 Member

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    OK, so right at the beginning of 2013.

    I suspect that "performance" got in there by mistake after seeing the seller's notes. This could be legit, but I would not send money without seeing it in person. A new one configured the same way as an S85 would run about 89K before taxes (includes the wall connector according to the seller's notes). Seems like a steep discount for having < 10,000 miles on it.
     
  11. Zythryn

    Zythryn MS 70D, MX 90D

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    They do now, they didn't back then.
    2012 Vins stopped around 2500-3500 as I recall.
    I have a 2013 with VIN 3764.

    If it were a bare bones S85 that price new was about $79k. Minus the rebates and a bit of age and mid 60s would surprise me. I wouldn't buy it from a third party though.

    To the OP, check out Tesla inventory models. I know of a P85+ that recently was sold at a $22k discount.
     
  12. GoBlue88

    GoBlue88 Member

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    Weird that he's dealing with an independent auto dealer instead of the seller himself. Something strange there for sure.
     
  13. dflye

    dflye S Sig Perf 414, VIN 814

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    If they do now, they certainly didn't when I received mine back in November 2012! Ahh, how the times and default options change over time. So many options/defaults available now that weren't two years ago!
     
  14. green1

    green1 Active Member

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    Hate to be devil's advocate here, but I don't see anything suspicious in the information posted here. The email exchange sounds like a normal (if overly accommodating) dealer. As for the "performance" thing, 90% of online Tesla ads say "performance" I ignore it as it usually doesn't indicate a P85, but just that they consider the car to be a performance automobile. Always look for actual model number on the vehicle display or by checking the VIN. (I've seen a lot of S60 cars listed as "performance") Nowhere in his add does he say P85, in fact he clearly states it is an S85. The only thing out of whack in that posting is the "8 cylinder" and I bet that there was no choice for "electric" in that drop down.

    As for the suggestion to get the police involved... I hope you have a LOT more than what is in this thread or you're wasting their time.

    As a side note, that is incredibly rude of Tesla to refuse to give you the results of an inspection, I'd say they should charge for the service, and then give the results to whoever paid them, or at the least be willing to release them to you if you have a letter from the owner authorizing it. This sounds like a good way to try to kill the used market, nobody else is qualified to inspect, and the one place that can, won't!
     
  15. cgiGuy

    cgiGuy Member

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  16. GoBlue88

    GoBlue88 Member

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    So on June 4th it had 4,720 miles and now it has 9,847 miles? Hmmm....

    Was gonna agree further with green1 that this could be legit, but that looks like a red flag to me. Sure, some people probably put 5,000+ miles on their car in 5 weeks but that's gotta be pretty dang rare.
     
  17. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    #17 TEG, Jul 16, 2014
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2014
    2013 Tesla S 85 Kwh 265 Miles Charge Range Tech Package Air Suspension 4k Miles - Used Tesla S for sale in Portland, Oregon | VinAudit Autos

    2013 Tesla s 85 kWh 265 Miles Charge Range Tech Package Air Suspension 4K Miles | eBay

    917-586-5798 Phone # seems to be Brooklyn, NY...
    http://www.manta.com/c/mtgqv5t/york-enterprises

    Also showing up for a computer repair place in Battle Ground, WA:
    computer repair - Battle Ground, WA 98604

    Googling the phone # returns many other car ads like:
    http://www.postsharesell.com/product_pdf.cfm?ProductID=7547
    2011 Mercedes-Benz R-Class for sale in Portland, Oregon, Usa - UsacarAds.com
    Market Report and Valuation | 2012 toyota Prius V
    Vehicles Shipment – From Shady Spring to Buffalo

    LEAF parts here:
    http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=14992
    (Used to have Photobucket pictures under name 'Vitali B')

    917-586-5798 | Brakorenko Vitaly in New York City, New York | Everyone411
    Brakorenko, Vitaly

    Vitaly Brakorenko - Limo/Taxi Driver - Battle Ground, WA | Indeed
    Vitaly Brakorenko
    Limo/Taxi Driver
    Battle Ground, WA

    Note, pictures of the GPS map in the old eBay listing show near where I think the guy lives, so I think he may well have had possession of that vehicle recently.

    History of selling numerous vehicles over eBay:
    eBay Feedback Profile for vitaly100

    Personally, I would be very careful with this "seller".
     
  18. wcfinvader

    wcfinvader Member

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    Yea I don't at all understand why the Tesla Service Center said that. It is very idiotic. I wasn't expecting a free inspection I was more than willing to pay just like I did when I purchased my ICE car a decade ago. My thinking is I have no idea what this car has been through (any used car) so I ALWAYS want to take any used car I think about buying to an independent repair facility to protect my investment. As far as getting police involved I agree that is a bit extreme with the information I have. I will say this though if I lived in the area I would investigate it further and involve the police if it was obviously a scam.

    As far as Inventory Models how does one find out about them if he lives minimum 8 hours away from the nearest Tesla Service Center. Omaha is supposed to be getting a Service Center "Coming Soon" but they've had that listed on the Site for well over a year now.

    Thanks for the input everyone!!!!
     
  19. NigelM

    NigelM Recovering Member

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    Agree. This dealer is listed all over the place selling used cars, criminals operating scams tend to keep themselves hidden as much as possible....the fact that many dealers have made mistakes in their listings when selling Model S should not be a surprise to anyone.

    - - - Updated - - -

    The guy added a lot of miles (btw ask the TeslaRoadTrip guys how many miles they added in 5 days) but he also reduced the price.

    - - - Updated - - -

    If the guy was rude, don't buy the car. (Used) Car dealers don't have a reputation for being warm and fuzzy.

    P.S. Not sure what having an accent has to do with it though.
     

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