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System 6.7 kWh + 2 PowerWalls - Will It Cover 100% of my Usage?

h2ofun

Active Member
Aug 11, 2020
2,684
492
auburn, ca
I think he kind of answered your question already... he built a box that elevates the fan away from the joists and adds some more reinforcement. Maybe he even put some EPDM or bushing stuff under his box to further create some dampening between the big azzz fan and the ceiling.
Just trying to get my head around that as the solution for noise.
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
8,170
5,946
Merced, CA
I think there was a post a while back about Quietcool whole house fans. I'm not schilling that vendor, but they use variable speed ECM motors instead of what appears to be a PSC style motor on the Triangle whole house fan. I think you should check out ECM for the flexibility to run at lower speeds. For disclosure, I don't have a whole house fan, and I don't like them because of my allergies.

Based on the spec sheet of Triangle's PMTR-CC3623 (motor used in the fan that sorka linked), says it is 8.2A at 115v on high ... so it's around 950w. The low setting isn't described, but since PSC motors aren't linear, I'd expect low to pull over 600w.

The largest Quietcool ES7000 ranges from 276w up to 1,100w. But I really don't think you get much bang for your buck with these attic fans on their high setting. So it's likely you'll just use this thing on medium for a few hours around sunrise and sunset to move some cooler air from outside inside to get some cooling that is more efficient than an AC.

My 2 stage Lennox + internal air handler takes 1.7 kW. IMO, I'd rather just run my ACs if the trade off is a 1kW whole house fan running on high trying to blow air around.


These are very different fans with very different performance.

The Quietcool is 276 whats for 1434 CFM or 5.2 CFM / watt.
The Triangle is 303 watts for 9700 CFM or 32 CFM / watt.

The Triangle is 6.2 times more efficient but it's also a lot larger. The low setting requires 3 windows open to not create a vacuum. The fast setting requires about half the windows in the house be open.

Low setting which is what we pretty much always use. With this size fan it's CFM is enough to cycle the entire volume of air of the house in about 4 minute.

Screenshot_20210528-111235.jpg

High speed occasionally used like if we don't leave the fan on all night but turn it on at 5 am and need to cool the house as fast as possible before the heat kicks in.
Screenshot_20210528-123046.jpg
 
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holeydonut

Supporting Member
Jun 27, 2020
1,868
1,251
East Bay NorCal
These are very different fans with very different performance.

The Quietcool is 276 whats for 1434 CFM or 5.2 CFM / watt.
The Triangle is 303 watts for 9700 CFM or 32 CFM / watt.

The Triangle is 6.2 times more efficient but it's also a lot larger. The low setting requires 3 windows open to not create a vacuum. The fast setting requires about half the windows in the house be open.

Low setting which is what we pretty much always use. With this size fan it's CFM is enough to cycle the entire volume of air of the house in about 4 minute.

View attachment 667320

High speed occasionally used like if we don't leave the fan on all night but turn it on at 5 am and need to cool the house as fast as possible before the heat kicks in.
View attachment 667321

9,700 CFM is the equivalent of what like a 24 ton HVAC system air handler. That seems like a ridiculous volume of air to move in 60 seconds with a fan that size. Something doesn't seem right lol.

When this thing is on, do you just feel air gushing out of your house? I can't imagine that type of pressure being created by only 300 watts. I remember the office having an air handler doing 10,000 CFM and it was a huge contraption with a lot of fans.
 

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Nov 28, 2018
9,654
10,899
Riverside Co. CA
I think there was a post a while back about Quietcool whole house fans. I'm not schilling that vendor, but they use variable speed ECM motors instead of what appears to be a PSC style motor on the Triangle whole house fan. I think you should check out ECM for the flexibility to run at lower speeds. For disclosure, I don't have a whole house fan, and I don't like them because of my allergies.

Based on the spec sheet of Triangle's PMTR-CC3623 (motor used in the fan that sorka linked), says it is 8.2A at 115v on high ... so it's around 950w. The low setting isn't described, but since PSC motors aren't linear, I'd expect low to pull over 600w.

The largest Quietcool ES7000 ranges from 276w up to 1,100w. But I really don't think you get much bang for your buck with these attic fans on their high setting. So it's likely you'll just use this thing on medium for a few hours around sunrise and sunset to move some cooler air from outside inside to get some cooling that is more efficient than an AC.

My 2 stage Lennox + internal air handler takes 1.7 kW. IMO, I'd rather just run my ACs if the trade off is a 1kW whole house fan running on high trying to blow air around.

I have a quietcool stealth series 7000 which, on high, uses 700w I think. You have to be ok with the amount of outside air they bring in, but I got it last year this time, and it cut my summer AC use by like 90%. Where I live, however, is characterized by hot days during the summer, but in general cool evenings with the exception of late august into september or so.

The corporate headquarters of quietcool is in my town, so its no surprise that they function extremely well here.
 

getakey

Active Member
Jan 28, 2020
1,325
429
95762
I have a quietcool stealth series 7000 which, on high, uses 700w I think. You have to be ok with the amount of outside air they bring in, but I got it last year this time, and it cut my summer AC use by like 90%. Where I live, however, is characterized by hot days during the summer, but in general cool evenings with the exception of late august into september or so.

The corporate headquarters of quietcool is in my town, so its no surprise that they function extremely well here.
We have that one as well. I believe it moves 7000 CFM
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
8,170
5,946
Merced, CA
Looking at the actual spec for the ES7000 it says 64 watts for 1434 so that's actually 22 CFM / watt which a lot better...a little over half of the efficiency of the huge fan.
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
8,170
5,946
Merced, CA
9,700 CFM is the equivalent of what like a 24 ton HVAC system air handler. That seems like a ridiculous volume of air to move in 60 seconds with a fan that size. Something doesn't seem right lol.

When this thing is on, do you just feel air gushing out of your house? I can't imagine that type of pressure being created by only 300 watts. I remember the office having an air handler doing 10,000 CFM and it was a huge contraption with a lot of fans.

The air is a strong wind at any window or in the hallway on either side of the fan where it's concentrated. In big open spaces like the living room, it's a light breeze almost anywhere you are becoming stronger and stronger as you move either towards the central hallway or an open window. It's many times the flow of my larger 4 ton HVAC.
 

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Nov 28, 2018
9,654
10,899
Riverside Co. CA
Looking at the actual spec for the ES7000 it says 64 watts for 1434 so that's actually 22 CFM / watt which a lot better...a little over half of the efficiency of the huge fan.

They have 3 lines of fans. the ES line is the cheapest (and least efficient I believe). I have this one:

Screen Shot 2021-05-28 at 1.43.35 PM.png
 

holeydonut

Supporting Member
Jun 27, 2020
1,868
1,251
East Bay NorCal
Hmmm weird I was going off the amps; not the watts. 8.61 amps at 120v should be 1 kW.

I wonder if they'll ever make automatic windows that open when the attic fan switch is turned on. Would be cool (literally?).
 

tomuo

Member
Mar 15, 2021
35
10
Los Angeles, CA
Hmmm weird I was going off the amps; not the watts. 8.61 amps at 120v should be 1 kW.

I wonder if they'll ever make automatic windows that open when the attic fan switch is turned on. Would be cool (literally?).
I have QuietCool fans, and I'm planning on doing almost exactly this with my Home Automation - whenever the outside temp is cooler, it would send me a message, then when I open any downstairs window, it would turn the fan on and HVAC off. And reverse, if I close all windows, stop the fan.
One wrinkle I have with this plan currently is there are active Skunks in the vicinity, so I need to detect that smell and not be pulling it into the house.

The QC fans are awesome in my climate.
 

holeydonut

Supporting Member
Jun 27, 2020
1,868
1,251
East Bay NorCal
I have QuietCool fans, and I'm planning on doing almost exactly this with my Home Automation - whenever the outside temp is cooler, it would send me a message, then when I open any downstairs window, it would turn the fan on and HVAC off. And reverse, if I close all windows, stop the fan.
One wrinkle I have with this plan currently is there are active Skunks in the vicinity, so I need to detect that smell and not be pulling it into the house.

The QC fans are awesome in my climate.

Yeah, but can the system open and close the windows automatically? Like are there any integrated smart-home solutions for double or triple pane windows to slide open with some high-torque stepper motor or something? Like this thing... but you know... something that doesn't look like a hack.


If they make drive-through windows that can open/close when the person steps on a foot-switch... and they make skylights that can prop open and close... you figure somebody would sell a smart-double-hung window to integrate with a Quietcool to make sure people don't have to open a window manually in the morning and evening.

Yes, I am this lazy haha. I have automatic shutters so I don't have to walk around the morning and evening to adjust light. I am also able to avoid using that labor intensive remote control, so I just yell at Google to turn on my TV and change the channel. Yes, I set my AC to 75F yesterday when it got 101F outside because solar is glorious. Technology is awesomes.
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
8,170
5,946
Merced, CA
My whole house fan is automated based on the difference in temperature inside and outside and how many windows are open.

Actively opened/closed window options are going to be more prevalent with casement windows that can have motors added to the hand cranks.
 

BGbreeder

Member
Jun 19, 2020
297
190
Bay Area
I believe that a really simple way for this is to use a solar hot water controller; whenever there is the specified temperature difference between the "cold" outside and the "hot" inside, the relays close. What you have on the relays is all up to you power windows, vents, fan...

All the best,

BG
 

tomuo

Member
Mar 15, 2021
35
10
Los Angeles, CA
Yeah, but can the system open and close the windows automatically? Like are there any integrated smart-home solutions for double or triple pane windows to slide open with some high-torque stepper motor or something? Like this thing... but you know... something that doesn't look like a hack.


If they make drive-through windows that can open/close when the person steps on a foot-switch... and they make skylights that can prop open and close... you figure somebody would sell a smart-double-hung window to integrate with a Quietcool to make sure people don't have to open a window manually in the morning and evening.

Yes, I am this lazy haha. I have automatic shutters so I don't have to walk around the morning and evening to adjust light. I am also able to avoid using that labor intensive remote control, so I just yell at Google to turn on my TV and change the channel. Yes, I set my AC to 75F yesterday when it got 101F outside because solar is glorious. Technology is awesomes.
Mechanizing sliding windows still seems like the wrong solution here. The other idea I had was to copy what is done in commercial high rise building HVAC, there's a fresh air intake somewhere in the system on the return vents that can be opened with a duct damper to combat rising CO2 concentrations, but would also work to allow the whole house fan to work, and would keep the incoming air filtered properly.
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
8,170
5,946
Merced, CA
Mechanizing sliding windows still seems like the wrong solution here. The other idea I had was to copy what is done in commercial high rise building HVAC, there's a fresh air intake somewhere in the system on the return vents that can be opened with a duct damper to combat rising CO2 concentrations, but would also work to allow the whole house fan to work, and would keep the incoming air filtered properly.

A system like that wouldn't provide enough volume or cooling where needed or cooling everywhere with select windows opened up around the house.

I have positive pressure system that uses a 400 cfm fan and pulls air from a roof vent and through a 3 stage HEPA filter and pumps it into the house via a duct that is centralized in the middle of the house. It's there to prevent CO2 build up which became an issue during covid when we were all at home all of the time working and remote schooling.

A side effect is that it also seemed to kill dust build up in the home because the slight positive pressure it creates keeps dust from coming in through other fan vents, open doors, or anywhere there is not a perfect seal around the house.

It's turned off now because we're using the whole house fan daily after the temperature goes down. If the valley air gets really bad like it did last year, then we'll keep the window closed and turn the positive pressure system back on and just use AC which will cost more but the at least the smoke won't be coming in. So far this summer, the air quality is excellent.
 

h2ofun

Active Member
Aug 11, 2020
2,684
492
auburn, ca
A system like that wouldn't provide enough volume or cooling where needed or cooling everywhere with select windows opened up around the house.

I have positive pressure system that uses a 400 cfm fan and pulls air from a roof vent and through a 3 stage HEPA filter and pumps it into the house via a duct that is centralized in the middle of the house. It's there to prevent CO2 build up which became an issue during covid when we were all at home all of the time working and remote schooling.

A side effect is that it also seemed to kill dust build up in the home because the slight positive pressure it creates keeps dust from coming in through other fan vents, open doors, or anywhere there is not a perfect seal around the house.

It's turned off now because we're using the whole house fan daily after the temperature goes down. If the valley air gets really bad like it did last year, then we'll keep the window closed and turn the positive pressure system back on and just use AC which will cost more but the at least the smoke won't be coming in. So far this summer, the air quality is excellent.
Have not been able to use my whole house fan the last couple of days since the low morning temps are low 70's. Wife said upstairs at 74 was a tad cool, so raised to 76. I have left my down stairs, with bedroom and exercise room at 74 so far. Boy has this AC made a difference in my battery use. The grid has been running the house, since my limited solar is going 100% to charge the batteries which are connected to the AC, by 3pm. So, not limited on batteries, even though I was at 38% this morning, limited by the amount of solar to recharge fast enough to not have to pull some grid energy.
 

BGbreeder

Member
Jun 19, 2020
297
190
Bay Area
A system like that wouldn't provide enough volume or cooling where needed or cooling everywhere with select windows opened up around the house.

I have positive pressure system that uses a 400 cfm fan and pulls air from a roof vent and through a 3 stage HEPA filter and pumps it into the house via a duct that is centralized in the middle of the house. It's there to prevent CO2 build up which became an issue during covid when we were all at home all of the time working and remote schooling.

A side effect is that it also seemed to kill dust build up in the home because the slight positive pressure it creates keeps dust from coming in through other fan vents, open doors, or anywhere there is not a perfect seal around the house.

It's turned off now because we're using the whole house fan daily after the temperature goes down. If the valley air gets really bad like it did last year, then we'll keep the window closed and turn the positive pressure system back on and just use AC which will cost more but the at least the smoke won't be coming in. So far this summer, the air quality is excellent.
What brand / type do you have? Just curious. I am intrigued by the dust suppression effect.

All the best,

Peter
 

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