TACC “vision only” on radar equipped Model 3 … phantom braking getting scary

[texas_star_TM3]

This weekend was the first road-trip since May and oh boy is TACC vision only different than the older radar enabled versions for my 2019 Model 3.
We were driving back from Llano Texas after a fun weekend in Fredericksburg and the roads from Llano to Fort Worth are primarily small country roads, undivided but with relatively generous speed limits (70 or even 75mph). Between San Saba and Hico we had 3 pretty drastic phantom braking events where the vehicle would hit the brakes for no apparent reason …
1) going from 75 mph to 60 mph within seconds … road wide open but some shadows from trees ahead
2) the same … but this time some small roadkill ahead which I was about to avoid by adjusting the steering slightly
3) the most bizarre… straight road. No roadkill or trees,,, but the car went from 78 mph to just about 55 mph and stayed at 55 mph for seconds before speeding up again …

At this rate I’d rather have dumb cruise control as an option versus getting rear ended by someone or triggering a road rage event… utterly unacceptable performance for TACC

 

[Twiglett]

This weekend was the first road-trip since May and oh boy is TACC vision only different than the older radar enabled versions for my 2019 Model 3.
We were driving back from Llano Texas after a fun weekend in Fredericksburg and the roads from Llano to Fort Worth are primarily small country roads, undivided but with relatively generous speed limits (70 or even 75mph). Between San Saba and Hico we had 3 pretty drastic phantom braking events where the vehicle would hit the brakes for no apparent reason …
1) going from 75 mph to 60 mph within seconds … road wide open but some shadows from trees ahead
2) the same … but this time some small roadkill ahead which I was about to avoid by adjusting the steering slightly
3) the most bizarre… straight road. No roadkill or trees,,, but the car went from 78 mph to just about 55 mph and stayed at 55 mph for seconds before speeding up again …

At this rate I’d rather have dumb cruise control as an option versus getting rear ended by someone or triggering a road rage event… utterly unacceptable performance for TACC

You don’t mention what release your car is on.
I’ve just driven 281 north to Hico on 10.69.2.3 and it was one one of the best drives I’ve had on FSD.
The slowdowns were kind of there but more unsure than full on braking like previous versions.
Using the previous versions it was pretty dire though.

 

[texas_star_TM3]

You don’t mention what release your car is on.
I’ve just driven 281 north to Hico on 10.69.2.3 and it was one one of the best drives I’ve had on FSD.
The slowdowns were kind of there but more unsure than full on braking like previous versions.
Using the previous versions it was pretty dire though.

2022.28.2

Whatever version that is… it’s crazy that this is deemed good enough so they could delete the radar input from older vehicles and go vision only for those legacy cars.

 

[2101Guy]

Wow. Sorry to hear that. Seems like phantom braking reports are growing more, not less…numerous with “the “superior” “vision only” technology.

 

[texas_star_TM3]

Wow. Sorry to hear that. Seems like phantom braking reports are growing more, not less…numerous with “the “superior” “vision only” technology.

Yeah… my wife got super annoyed and our biggest fear was that someone might rear end us or we trigger some serious road rage with someone assuming we are check braking them …. Interestingly on my daily driving around DFW metroplex where I do use TACC occasionally I haven’t had many instances (typically multi lane toll roads with separations). But something between rural roads and high speed limits really upsets “vision only”…

 

[johnm]

"went from 78 mph to just about 55 mph and stayed at 55 mph for seconds before speeding up again"

I can't remember anymore, but does non-FSDBeta TACC slow down and speed up for speed limit changes? (Or does it now?) On FSDBeta TACC, a wrong speed limit would be my most common cause for a speed reduction that lasts several seconds. It doesn't help, but it might be fun to glance at what the car thinks the speed limit is next time this happens.

 

[Twiglett]

2022.28.2

Whatever version that is… it’s crazy that this is deemed good enough so they could delete the radar input from older vehicles and go vision only for those legacy cars.

I can understand that, it was really bad, it used to be pretty good, but as they added more stuff that it recognized the braking for no reason got worse and worse.
I can honestly say the the latest FSD beta has made noticeable improvements to that.
When I last drove 281 to Hico it was appalling, but this weekend on the latest release was significantly better.
A bit further north on Hwy51, it was able to drive that road almost like a human, previously it was no where near that.
My arbiter has always been my wife, the latest release is good enough for her, which is an achievement on its own

 

[EVRider-FL]

I’ve been on a road trip with my now vision-only 2018 Model S, and haven’t noticed much of a difference in phantom braking (wasn’t much of an issue before or now). It seems Model 3/Y owners have seen more impact from the transition to vision. I’ve used AP on both interstates and back roads, build 2022.28.2 (not FSD Beta).

 

[texas_star_TM3]

"went from 78 mph to just about 55 mph and stayed at 55 mph for seconds before speeding up again"

I can't remember anymore, but does non-FSDBeta TACC slow down and speed up for speed limit changes? (Or does it now?) On FSDBeta TACC, a wrong speed limit would be my most common cause for a speed reduction that lasts several seconds. It doesn't help, but it might be fun to glance at what the car thinks the speed limit is next time this happens.

negative. no speed limit signs posted when it happened... the main slow down from 78 mph to 55 mph was literally in middle of nowhere...

 

[Bprdwa]

I'm in a similar boat; on small, windy country roads near my house my car slams on its brakes all the time after I moved to vision-only software. It's super scary; I've received a ticket from a cop who was behind me and though I brake-checked him when my car slowed down from 55 (the posted speed limit) to about 30 for nothing in front of it, and have also had the car nearly lose control when it did this when the road was wet another time (traction control quickly regained control of the car, but holy crap was it scary to just be going down the road then the car started sliding).

I've basically had to stop using cruise control at all; despite the promise of my car improving and getting more features over time, it's actually lost features over time not due to wear-and-tear, but due to poor software.

 

[texas_star_TM3]

I'm in a similar boat; on small, windy country roads near my house my car slams on its brakes all the time after I moved to vision-only software. It's super scary; I've received a ticket from a cop who was behind me and though I brake-checked him when my car slowed down from 55 (the posted speed limit) to about 30 for nothing in front of it, and have also had the car nearly lose control when it did this when the road was wet another time (traction control quickly regained control of the car, but holy crap was it scary to just be going down the road then the car started sliding).

I've basically had to stop using cruise control at all; despite the promise of my car improving and getting more features over time, it's actually lost features over time not due to wear-and-tear, but due to poor software.

My next big road trip isn’t until spring next year… but I really can’t drive for 7+ hours without using something as basic as cruise control. The current implementation of TACC just plain sucks and it didn’t before with radar for me. I drove from North Texas all the way to Northern Idaho near the Canadian border and had AP or TACC engaged most of the time. Maybe one or two minor phantom braking incidents in 3 days on the road. That was it. But then again … it was with radar and back in 2020…

 

[_Redshift_]

Like I’ve mentioned here before, phantom braking has definitely increased for me in the last 2 months. However, I confirmed my radar is still active. (1 car follow, 2 cars ahead visualized, etc)

 

[EVRider-FL]

Like I’ve mentioned here before, phantom braking has definitely increased for me in the last 2 months. However, I confirmed my radar is still active. (1 car follow, 2 cars ahead visualized, etc)

Which build and which car?

 

[_Redshift_]

Which build and which car?

2018 Sept Build, LR, EAP.

 

[ElectricIAC]

2022.28.2

Whatever version that is… it’s crazy that this is deemed good enough so they could delete the radar input from older vehicles and go vision only for those legacy cars.

Yeah 28.2 is freaking awful.

 

[EVRider-FL]

2018 Sept Build, LR, EAP.

I meant which software build. I didn’t notice the car info in your signature before I asked which car you had.

 

[_Redshift_]

I meant which software build. I didn’t notice the car info in your signature before I asked which car you had.

2022.28.2

 

[strider]

TACC on my MX Plaid is horrible on undivided roads. Any time you are in a right sweeping curve and there is an oncoming car it thinks that car is in your lane and slows dramatically. It's absolutely freaking useless. I too wish we could have a "dumb" hold a speed no matter what cruise control. I will sign whatever liability releases you want....

 

[EVRider-FL]

Like I’ve mentioned here before, phantom braking has definitely increased for me in the last 2 months. However, I confirmed my radar is still active. (1 car follow, 2 cars ahead visualized, etc)

Do you have HW2.5? I‘ve read elsewhere in this forum that radar is only disabled if you have HW3.

 

[_Redshift_]

Do you have HW2.5? I‘ve read elsewhere in this forum that radar is only disabled if you have HW3.

That’s correct.

EDIT: I did not know prior to seeing the forum posts re. HW 2.5. I was not even sure what I had. However, I am thankful that I have a unique car. Not just from 2.5 perspective. Mine was one of the last few 1000s made with LR and RWD. I don’t much care for AWD as it adds weight.