Take out HV batt pack / cut out bad cell? (S P85+)

[Husky-tessla]

Hi Guys!

12 days after my warranty my Tesla Model S P85+ standing here with HV failure. It has get all service during life, even Battery service 8th of march 2022. and running well.But suddenly on morning it won't start. So i get a repair offer from tessla because they just say sorry out off warranty. Hey come on Tessla 12 days? I have got things on goodwill from both VW, BMW, Mercedes that been out off warranty.

Anyhow now to how i will do to fix it.

I will go to take out my HV battery to do like Grubber motors, Locate the broken cell and cut it off.
However, I can not find a diagram of the battery cells or blocks. Think each "pack" of a total of the 30 must have a "name" in a schedule?

Then the next question. If I use Scan my tessla? Is it possible to use it to find the right battery pack and pre-manually meet each individual cell to stt locate the broken one and cut it off?

Do the car needs to reprogrammed after these procedures?

All help and answers will be helpful! And i will post all things here incl picture of the operation!

Thanks from Sweden!

 

[Tam]

...Hey come on Tessla 12 days?...

That's the purpose of the time limit. If I bring in a grocery coupon that only expired 1 day, the grocery won't accept it. It would be nice if they can accept it but they are not obligated to.

 

[NewbyMaybe]

You are going to need the help of an experienced professional in your area.

 

[Husky-tessla]

That's the purpose of the time limit. If I bring in a grocery coupon that only expired 1 day, the grocery won't accept it. It would be nice if they can accept it but they are not obligated to.

Yes but 12 days must be some record

 

[Husky-tessla]

You are going to need the help of an experienced professional in your area.

Why's that? To get it out no problem, open it up no problem.

And if i just find a drawing over the bat pack i think i can manage to measuring out the bad cell or cells. (Is a educated construction engineer in HV- systems) and also a high voltage electrician. The question is whether you need to recode the car after? That will be some more tricky part offcourse. I don't know if it work to empty all error codes with Scan my tesla?

 

[Tam]

...To get it out no problem, open it up no problem...

I am not an expert but I heard that although some people claim that they can repair the pack by taking the bad module out and putting in a good one but that won't last long (like 2 months). Thus, you need to replace the whole pack.

Sell 2014 Model S before 8 Year warranty expires?

. I was told yesterday, because I am asking for very specific details, that the warranty is 1yr on a part they install. Specifically this is for a 75kwh pack. Customer pay high voltage battery replacements have a 4 year 50k warranty. The parts warranty doc is very clear about that. Trust...

teslamotorsclub.com

I have no idea about any firmware requirements if you get a whole pack replacement.

 

[Husky-tessla]

I am not an expert but I heard that although some people claim that they can repair the pack by taking the bad module out and putting in a good one but that won't last long (like 2 months). Thus, you need to replace the whole pack.

Sell 2014 Model S before 8 Year warranty expires?

. I was told yesterday, because I am asking for very specific details, that the warranty is 1yr on a part they install. Specifically this is for a 75kwh pack. Customer pay high voltage battery replacements have a 4 year 50k warranty. The parts warranty doc is very clear about that. Trust...

teslamotorsclub.com

I have no idea about any firmware requirements if you get a whole pack replacement.

My idea is not to replace due to like you say it will collapse. I will just cut off like Grubbers the bad idependent cell (battery) and then re install whole pack into the car again. Grubbers claim this is the way you should do to not get any more issues.

Grubbers Tesla HV repair

 

[Tam]

...empty all error codes with Scan my tesla?

I don't have Scan My Tesla but I don’t think you can issue a command to clear a Tesla code.

If you only replace a cell, logically you don't need to push a firmware to prevent a rejection of a new hardware.

...If I use Scan my tessla? Is it possible to use it to find the right battery pack and pre-manually meet each individual cell to stt locate the broken one and cut it off?

On its demo picture on Google Play, it does show the voltage for each module. Thus, if you see which one is bad like module 4, you can take that it out and do additional testing to pinpoint which cells are bad. There might be a problem to figure out which is module 4. How is a module counted from front to back on the left then the right? Or from front left first then front right next then so on...?

 

[DerbyDave]

This guy says don't do it, for what it is worth. He tried, and says Gruber's fix is problematic.

Tesla Hacker Says Replacing Battery Pack Modules in Model S Doesn’t Work

Tesla always chooses the easiest path for repair in its cars despite the cost for its customers. That said, it will give them a $16,000 estimate for a repair that could cost $700, as we have already told you. It also provided a customer with a $22,500 estimate (without taxes) for something that...

www.autoevolution.com

 

[Husky-tessla]

This guy says don't do it, for what it is worth. He tried, and says Gruber's fix is problematic.

Tesla Hacker Says Replacing Battery Pack Modules in Model S Doesn’t Work

Tesla always chooses the easiest path for repair in its cars despite the cost for its customers. That said, it will give them a $16,000 estimate for a repair that could cost $700, as we have already told you. It also provided a customer with a $22,500 estimate (without taxes) for something that...

www.autoevolution.com

Yes, but he change a Bat-pack. That is not what i will do. If you check Grabbers video i post they say the way you should do it. Is just to cut away the dead cell the replace the total HV battery in the car. They have this integrated system from the beginning with this silver tread that is supposed to burn off if just one cell (battery) is going down to zero. It is there to prevent a fire. but it doesn't work that good. so when just one cell (a 1,5V battery) is going down, the motherboard feeling that and switch off the whole system to percent a fire. And tesla say you must switch the total HV bat pack.

 

[Husky-tessla]

I don't have Scan My Tesla but I don’t think you can issue a command to clear a Tesla code.

If you only replace a cell, logically you don't need to push a firmware to prevent a rejection of a new hardware.



On its demo picture on Google Play, it does show the voltage for each module. Thus, if you see which one is bad like module 4, you can take that it out and do additional testing to pinpoint which cells are bad. There might be a problem to figure out which is module 4. How is a module counted from front to back on the left then the right? Or from front left first then front right next then so on...?

Thanks.

I will buy one end se. It seams like that could handle this kind of performance.

Like you say, the problem will be if there is no schedul on the pack witch one is 1,2,3 etc. but i think that can be solved with some searching or calling to a third part service company like Grubber. I live in Sweden so not that many third part service here.

Right know i standing between, pay 15k $ and get a switching Bat-pack from Teala. or try to do this performance but my self (maybe it will work) otherwise i think i will pay like 22k $ for a new pack. Who will die curious

 

[Daveb25]

Before you do anything check your states laws. Most likely you are still in warranty. If the car has spent more than 12 days in the shop during the last 8 years for warranty work the car’s warranty should be extended a day for each day it was in the shop.

 

[Crutonius]

Hi Guys!

12 days after my warranty my Tesla Model S P85+ standing here with HV failure. It has get all service during life, even Battery service 8th of march 2022. and running well.But suddenly on morning it won't start. So i get a repair offer from tessla because they just say sorry out off warranty. Hey come on Tessla 12 days? I have got things on goodwill from both VW, BMW, Mercedes that been out off warranty.

Anyhow now to how i will do to fix it.

I will go to take out my HV battery to do like Grubber motors, Locate the broken cell and cut it off.
However, I can not find a diagram of the battery cells or blocks. Think each "pack" of a total of the 30 must have a "name" in a schedule?

Then the next question. If I use Scan my tessla? Is it possible to use it to find the right battery pack and pre-manually meet each individual cell to stt locate the broken one and cut it off?

Do the car needs to reprogrammed after these procedures?

All help and answers will be helpful! And i will post all things here incl picture of the operation!

Thanks from Sweden!

I don't know if they have an equivalent to Gruber Motors in Sweden but if you can find one that offers a similar deal then definitely go that route.

I'm not trying to be one of those people that tells everyone to never work on a battery pack but from what I can tell it is perilous. I've put some effort into looking into this in the event I have to try it. I haven't done it but here's a few things I've learned from youtube etc.

Removing the pack isn't that hard. But you do need a lift that can lower it safely.

From what I hear the most obnoxious part is the top cover. It's glued on and takes some time to remove. I've seen people use a heat gun and a knife. You're also going to have to be very careful to not damage the battery modules in the process. If someone is just trying to get at the modules I've seen them use a fork lift to remove it fast. This top cover is something Tesla will not sell to anyone.

When it comes to the individual modules and the individual cells the tricky part is that they need to be balanced to a certain degree. So you can't just cut out a bad individual cell and put in a new one. The bms software will show the imbalance as a fault. You also can't easily swap out a module for the same reason. Places like Gruber will just cut out the bad cell since that usually doesn't cause enough of an imbalance to be a problem.

Best of luck to you.

 

[vcor]

Others have good info. Keep in mind if a single cell is shorted or has unusually low resistance, it's going to drain all the cells in parallel and kill all those cells in parallel. Remember that a totally drained lithium-ion cell is normally destroyed and no longer usable. If the cell is open, then it would have little effect and likely wouldn't even register as any failure. In an 85 pack, each sub-group has 74 cells in parallel.

Now I wouldn't consider opening the pack. There are lethal high voltages, all exposed when you pull the pack apart, unless the entire pack is dead, in which case the pack only has some value to be recycled. Check out some of the videos of people opening the pack. It's not easy and I don't know how you could reseal it once the cover is destroyed when pulling it apart. There is a reason Tesla doesn't have service centers do battery work - it's too dangerous. Packs are shipped back to the factory for repair or recycling.

 

[FlatSix911]

Hi Guys!

12 days after my warranty my Tesla Model S P85+ standing here with HV failure. It has get all service during life, even Battery service 8th of march 2022. and running well.But suddenly on morning it won't start. So i get a repair offer from tessla because they just say sorry out off warranty. Hey come on Tessla 12 days? I have got things on goodwill from both VW, BMW, Mercedes that been out off warranty.

Anyhow now to how i will do to fix it.

I will go to take out my HV battery to do like Grubber motors, Locate the broken cell and cut it off.
However, I can not find a diagram of the battery cells or blocks. Think each "pack" of a total of the 30 must have a "name" in a schedule?

Then the next question. If I use Scan my tessla? Is it possible to use it to find the right battery pack and pre-manually meet each individual cell to stt locate the broken one and cut it off?

Do the car needs to reprogrammed after these procedures?

All help and answers will be helpful! And i will post all things here incl picture of the operation!

Thanks from Sweden!

You may want to contact Jason Hughes at 057 Technologies for expert guidance on HV failures.

057 Technology

057 Technology, LLC

057tech.com

 

[wk057]

If you want a very large and expensive paperweight instead of a drivable car, continue on and "cut" cells out of your pack.

If you want a working vehicle, replace the entire pack.

There are no exceptions to this, despite claims by people on YouTube.

 

[MP3Mike]

I will go to take out my HV battery to do like Grubber motors, Locate the broken cell and cut it off.

How do you know that is the issue? Maybe it is a bad BMB or bad solder joint. Any way, cutting a cell or is not a fix.

 

[ucmndd]

Before you do anything check your states laws. Most likely you are still in warranty. If the car has spent more than 12 days in the shop during the last 8 years for warranty work the car’s warranty should be extended a day for each day it was in the shop.

I have never heard of such a thing in any state and my admittedly incomplete searching turned up nothing. Certainly nothing like this applies in California.

Which states are you referring to?

 

[Daveb25]

I have never heard of such a thing in any state and my admittedly incomplete searching turned up nothing. Certainly nothing like this applies in California.

Which states are you referring to?

California is the state I was referring to. It may be only paused in a lemon law case though (I am not 100% sure but definitely worth calling and finding out as I believe it is paused for non lemon law cases as well).

Auto Warranty Period for Car Repairs | California Lemon Law Attorney

Get the complete details on warranty period and how California’s Lemon Law affects it. For further details on California’s Lemon Law contact @(858)-247-0050.

calemonlawattorney.com

 

[Daveb25]

(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2) warranty period relating to an implied or express warranty accompanying a sale or consignment for sale of consumer goods selling for fifty dollars ($50) or more shall automatically be tolled for the period from the date upon which the buyer either (1) delivers nonconforming goods to the manufacturer or seller for warranty repairs or service or (2), pursuant to subdivision (c) of Section 1793.2 or Section 1793.22, notifies the manufacturer or seller of the nonconformity of the goods up to, and including, the date upon which (1) the repaired or serviced goods are delivered to the buyer, (2) the buyer is notified the goods are repaired or serviced and are available for the buyer's possession or (3) the buyer is notified that repairs or service is completed, if repairs or service is made at the buyer's residence.

Fairly certain if your car has been in the shop for more than 12 whole days in the last 8 years for warranty repairs you are still under warranty. Start a new service request at a different service center and let them know that you know your rights. I bet they will “goodwill” the repair since they are likely legally obligated to complete it anyways.