Uncle Paul
Well-Known Member
Biden just launched a missle attack in the Middle East. Going to need lots of $ to keep those wars going. Might not be the time to add more tax incentives for rich Tesla buyers.
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Tax credit (Green ACT)
- Thread starter sam2020
- Start date
I think it is after 1/1/22, not 1/1/21. Which if true, is also absurd. Because then they would effectively nuke all 21' sales while people wait for the 7K (20% average discount)
That bill is dead on arrival. Tesla's 5 million vehicle 2025 goal would be $35 billion in tax credits, 2030 goal of 20 million vehicles would be $140 billion in credits. Dream on!
not to mention the trillions we have spent on Iraq and Afghanistan, which we could have invested in America...
TravelFree
Active Member
TravelFree
Active Member
It helps to understand what a tax credit is. It is a reduction of the taxes owed. Therefore your extrapolation into the future while may be accurate, is based on the value of the economy today with your "dream on" concern. What will the value of $7500 be in 2030? Besides, the government always likes to put long term future dates on these bills and then a short time later simply negate that if necessary with another law. So, I never worry about laws with well into the future effect. They won't let a problem law stick. It's even less of a concern with Executive Orders. Easily repealed with the decision of one person.
More concern to me is how will the published bill be changed by the time they vote on it and does it impact me now or not. I'll worry about 2030 in 2030 for stuff like this.
SDM44
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At this point, I think the Stimulus bill has a better chance of passing before the Green Act.... and we all know how long that is taking when it was promised as a top priority once Biden was in office.
I can't benefit from either, but just an observation & trend that I'm seeing.
I can't benefit from either, but just an observation & trend that I'm seeing.
dreamwave6
Member
Yes, but you are not considering the per year cost which is much more reasonable, especially considering how important the green new deal is to Biden & the Dems
TravelFree
Active Member
Let's not confuse the Green New Deal with the recently proposals for EV tax credits and incentives to add sustainable energy.
The Green New deal is more about destroying our present economy to save the planet from total destruction in 9 years. They want to tare down more than build up. It's about closing refineries, outlawing gasoline and diesel powered transportation, shutting down oil and natural gas power plants. It wants to punish people who work in industry that does not support the GND and reward those who work on projects that they believe is necessary to save the planet. It proposes to take from those who do well in going green and give to those who have a poor carbon footprint and supports politicians world wide like the Paris Climate Agreement. From everything I have seen the GND is a political money grab for the wealthy big carbon footprint hypocrites.
The tax credits for EV rewards those who choose to switch to electric powered cars and trucks. It does not punish anyone or any business. It doesn't matter who proposes it, it's what it does that matters.
You don't have to be a GND card carrying member to enjoy a Tesla or other EV for it's benefits. In fact many Tesla owners I know think the GND political game is a scam. This is not to denigrate anyone who believes in the GND. It's your choice. Just keep your fingers out of my pocket!
I think you're mixing Tesla's global vehicle sales goals with a US-only tax credit. Unless Tesla manages to capture 130% of the US market.
A Tesla salesperson did something similar: I said I was going to wait for the tax credit to live or die before ordering. He said "but the credit is only for 400k vehicles, and Tesla may sell a million in 2021!".
TravelFree
Active Member
When I hear statements like these I know for a fact they haven't read the Bill in reference, much less the second one proposed in the Senate.
Need to explain to these people that currently these Bills are not law and will likely get modified before signed into law.
Also, the second Senate Bill does not limit the tax credit by the number of cars delivered, but rather expires by end of 2031 and begins on Jan 1, 2021. But we don't know if it will become law yet.
Also, the HR848 has Tesla limited to 400,000 cars after the bill is law and then half tax credit for the next quarter before expiration. Let's assume the bill becomes law in June this year. Will Tesla make 400,000 cars by Dec 31? You may have a half year or more before the credit expires.
But all this is proposals now, however, the Democrats do want this as part of their environmental agenda regardless of what it's called. They have the power now for 2 years if they can keep a few of their rebels in line it will pass but we don't know what will be in the final law.
Personally, I like the Senate proposal better because it eliminates the number of cars and has expiration based on a year. Therefore it does a better job of the main goal of those GREEN enthusiasts which is "greening the fleet" or it rewards the most successful companies that accomplish greening the fleet.
To those who don't want wealthy to have the tax credit, I say this- It doesn't matter if a billionaire drives an EV or a poor person. Both will help green the fleet the same when they drive the EV vs the gasser.
What needs to be done is for Tesla and GM to team up and lobby the congress to get moving on these and get a final Bill into the Oval Office. Biden will sign it even if he doesn't understand it.
oreobbq
Member
TravelFree
Active Member
If you need a car now, go ahead and take delivery. I can wait for a few months if necessary to see how this tax credit goes.
I don't think FSD will jump in price until they release the FSD city street steering out of beta.
I don't think FSD will jump in price until they release the FSD city street steering out of beta.
It could easily be 6 months or more before tax credits would be available. As TravelFree said, it depends when you need a car. If you can play the waiting game for up to a year you may be rewarded, but no guarantee.
TravelFree
Active Member
I think this will be addressed much sooner as both bills are in committee now. As soon as the COVID Relief Bill is passed, maybe by 3/12, Their focus will be the infrastructure bills and the GREEN amendments to the existing bill. The good one I have less hope for that is in the Senate committee.
The hold up will be the fact that the Congress is in recess again until the middle of April after the 12th. That's the bad news. The good news is that committees will still be in light session schedule for 2 of those weeks to hash out infrastructure and the GREEN Bills. My guess is we will see something by end of April.
Will it pass? Since it can be passed based on Reconciliation 51 vote, they might just use up another one of their 9 to pass it. If not, then I believe these bills will fail. Meaning, we should have a good answer by end of May not in the Fall or next year.
Also, by waiting, you may get more updates in the Model Y as there are several rumored changes trickling out of Fremont right now.
OCJeff
Active Member
Same here. I planned on waiting until the end of 2021 (for 2022 HOV stickers here in CA). I placed the order, but didn't provide any of the registration details, so the order is on hold pending those details (which I'll complete by September regardless). I'm fine to wait for a while.
baoconnor
Member
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