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Tesla BEV Competition Developments

Discussion in 'TSLA Investor Discussions' started by uselesslogin, May 25, 2014.

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  1. renim

    renim Active Member

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    Thats design effort, just like how Tesla shrunk the RWD frunk to be the same size as AWD frunk. That was intentional and took effort too.

    For better or worse, the car companies who sell to the demographic that includes people with difficult parking (school parents and most of world's mega cities) prefer the car look of a short box nose, and no tail.
     
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  2. mtndrew1

    mtndrew1 Active Member

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    The Ariya is based on a brand new architecture developed between Mitsubishi, Nissan, and Renault. The Ariya is the first product on this platform and it is not based on an existing vehicle.
     
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  3. renim

    renim Active Member

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    It shares at least partial design consistency with Renault/Nissan C/D class sedans, most obviously the Maxima.

    Nissan has always let it teams have more than industry average design freedom with its pressed metal and less than industry averge with drivetrain components, but under the skin Ariya is a jacked up, AWD Maxima with a shrunken bonnet and boot. And of course a bespoke electric floorpan. It is the floorpan that is the key defining modern vehicle structure. So yes it a new platform, but its also very maxima/altima
     
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  4. mtndrew1

    mtndrew1 Active Member

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    Source for this claim?

    Nissan/Mitsubishi/Renault have been working on the new CMF-EV toolkit for years now and there has been no evidence that it shares any structures with any existing products from any of those automakers. All mention of CMF-EV refers to the entire platform as a clean sheet design.

    If Nissan wanted a “jacked up Maxima” they would have used the Pathfinder because, you know, that’s what it is. They also could have used any of the number of existing crossovers in their portfolio.

    I think you may be confusing styling with platforms here or perhaps are not well-versed in automotive terminology.

    The Ariya is unrelated to any other Nissans, inside or out. It is a new product on a new platform shared with two other automakers.

    Nissan EVs will share platform with Infiniti, Renault, Mitsubishi

    Nissan, Infiniti, Renault And Mitsubishi To Share EV Platform

    New Nissan Ariya EV — Promoted From Concept To Promise

    2022 Nissan Ariya: 300-mile electric SUV priced to start around $40,000
     
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  5. renim

    renim Active Member

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    Its a matter of semantics, so I'm happy to accept that renault nissan's definition is the industry correct definition.

    But it still shares the same wheelbase as MaximaA36/ AltimaL33.

    Depending on wheels we will see if it also shares the same footprint as Maxima/Altima also?

    Ariya is not a LEAF, its not a Rogue or Qashqai or Xtrail or Infiniti or Pathfinder but the Maxima, now there you will find common hardpoints with Ariya.
     
  6. mtndrew1

    mtndrew1 Active Member

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    The 2020 Cadillac CT4, 2018 Acura TLX, and 2003 Dodge Ram Van also have the same 109.3” wheelbase as the Maxima.

    Just like the Ariya, those cars are unrelated to the Nissan Maxima. That rough wheelbase is common in all kinds of vehicles.

    The Ariya is on a new platform developed between Mitsubishi and Nissan-Renault. It is unrelated to the Maxima, Altima, CT4, TLX, or Dodge Ram Van.
     
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  7. renim

    renim Active Member

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    Those vehicles don't share DNA with the Ariya.

    Anyway, the volumes planned are not great, and the detail seems to in the cabin interior, not the body stamping. So its logical to assembly the Ariya at Nissan's Tochigi plant
    tems produced:For Japan:
    CIMA Hybrid, FUGA Hybrid, FUGA, SKYLINE, NISSAN GT-R, FAIRLADY Z

    For overseas:
    Various Infiniti models (Q70L, Q70, Q50, Q60), 370Z, Cast parts, aluminum parts, axle parts.
     
  8. wdolson

    wdolson Supporting Member

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    News is out today that there is an upgrade for the Model S/X coming called Palladium. Among the changes are a new battery pack. The new version could quite possibly have much more than the ~400 mile range today. The WLTP range is also the less accurate than the EPA range compared to real world.

    Even if Tesla looses the range crown to Mercedes, it will almost certainly be much more expensive.
     
  9. Watts_Up

    Watts_Up Active Member

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  10. ammulder

    ammulder '98 GS400 -> P3D+

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    Audi expects pre-pandemic car sales levels by 2022/2023: paper

    Several things here:
    1. Tesla Q-on-Q sales are up, Audi expects to get there by... 2023
    2. Audi says Tesla uses larger batteries. Huh? Compare e-Tron 95 kWh to Model Y 75 kWh?
    3. Audi estimating Tesla has a 2-year lead in software. Maybe they're expecting to substantially outperform the rest of VW on software development, while expecting Tesla to substantially blackslide?
    4. Whole bunch of executive reshuffling... surprise, surprise
     
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  11. adiggs

    adiggs Active Member

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    Sounds to me like Audi's assessment of the size of Tesla's lead (and by extension speed) is wishful thinking rather than real.

    But the estimate of post pandemic car sales - I can see that. Except their markets are going to be stolen by Tesla in the meanwhile, so there's a reasonable hypothesis that the only way Audi gets back to pre-pandemic car sales is for them to be electric.

    And 50k/year is barely a development program / down payment on THAT challenge.
     
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  12. renim

    renim Active Member

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    Ariya is not a Tesla competitor, but BYD Han will be (if you are in China, and your boss owns a Tesla)
    upload_2020-7-23_21-16-50.png
    also known as return of the LiFePO4
     
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  13. renim

    renim Active Member

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  14. renim

    renim Active Member

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    and the all important
    Chinese rear seat
    upload_2020-7-23_21-25-47.png
     
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  15. Doggydogworld

    Doggydogworld Active Member

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    Prices in Yuan after subsidy, ranges are NEDC:
    219,800 - 81 km PHEV
    229,800 - 506 km 65 kWh RWD
    255,800 - 605 km 77 kWh RWD
    279,500 - 550 km 77 kWh AWD (3.9 sec 0-100km/h)

    Model 3 is:
    271,550 - 445 km/56 kWh RWD
    344,050 - 668 km/78 kWh RWD
    419,800 - 635(?) km/78 kWh AWD (3.4 sec 0-100km/h)

    Han is bigger than Model 3 (closer to S) and offers more bang for the buck. Entry level is ~10% more range for lower price, long range versions have ~10% less range/accel but much lower prices. BYD plans to sell the Han in Europe, but so far not in the US.
     
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  16. MXLRplus

    MXLRplus Active Member

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    The first Chinese import EV was the Cota which was LiFePO4. Sort of like a Corolla but EV. It failed badly. It wasn't a bad car though.
     
  17. JRP3

    JRP3 Hyperactive Member

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    Bobby Lew loves the Polestar, might be the best car he's ever driven. Only real shortfall compared to Tesla is the charging network.

     
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  18. JRP3

    JRP3 Hyperactive Member

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    Another positive review, a bit more detailed

     
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  19. RobStark

    RobStark Well-Known Member

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  20. RobStark

    RobStark Well-Known Member

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