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Tesla Business office has forgotten about customer service and safety

Discussion in 'Model S: Driving Dynamics' started by User4life, May 13, 2018.

  1. User4life

    User4life Member

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    upload_2018-5-13_20-40-6.png IMG_1228.jpg IMG_1306.jpeg IMG_1312.jpeg IMG_1455.jpeg IMG_1460.jpeg IMG_1462.jpeg IMG_1551.jpeg IMG_1581.jpeg I have been a Tesla enthusiast for years and did not think that there was a better car out there for myself and my family. I am still shocked at how the business office has handled its ongoing malfunctioning vehicles. I took delivery of my new MS on 10/19/17 and I could not have been happier at the time. I noticed that the backup camera was intermittently acting up, but I am not quick to complain until I understand the issue. Once I did (12/16/17), I let the tesla service center know and they have not been able to resolve the issue since. It has been about 5 months and the car has been in the service center 4 times for the same issue. After the third service visit the service manager tried to work with the business office to replace the vehicle, but they were not interested. The most recent service visit (4/10/18) they have had my vehicle for over 1 month and still have not been able to fix the issue.


    I have heard them say that they think that this is a firmware issue as they have replaced hardware components with no resolution of the problem, but the business office has no regard for safety. They know that the car continues to malfunction, but they are okay with my family taking it back on the road. My concern is if there is a firmware issue and that the autopilot uses cameras, is the autopilot compromised as well? These are some of the top selling points & key features of the vehicle– the back up camera, autopilot and being one of the safest cars.


    I had messaged the executive team a while back and I tried to speak with district manager, but both did not change the lack of action toward the situation. I am hearing that the engineers in California have been working on this for months, but still no resolution. I have tried to be patient and work with them, but after this much time. I do feel that they do not value their customers or their safety. After 5 months of attempted repair, it would be very difficult to trust a supposed repair at this point as we would be the ones at risk for any malfunction. I am truly surprised at how poorly the situation has been handled; any other high-end car manufacturer would take care of these types of situations in a timely manner. Especially when we talk about safety, this completely violates the Tesla/Elon Musk Mission statement.


    I have tried to minimize the post to keep it simple. I am lost as to what to do. I could seek legal action, but I would like to avoid this route. Please let me know if you have any thoughts/suggestions that could help. I would have never imagined that this could happen to a Tesla and that this is how they would treat their customers.
     
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  2. brkaus

    brkaus Well-Known Member

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    What hardware have they replaced?

    Is it AP2 or AP 2.5?
     
  3. User4life

    User4life Member

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    Thanks for quick reply AP2.5. They replaced the entire center computer/screen & the back up camera.
     
  4. jelloslug

    jelloslug Active Member

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    Have they replaced the camera signal wires between the center computer and the camera? It looks to me like one of them could be nicked or otherwise damaged.
     
  5. cwerdna

    cwerdna Active Member

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    I'd look into the lemon law for your state. Last page of http://www.flhsmv.gov/safetytips/PDFs/BuyingVehicle.pdf has a dead link but from digging around on myfloridalegal.com (seems to be the right page), Florida Attorney General - How to Protect Yourself: Chronic and Persistent Car Trouble might help.

    You may wish to also file a safety complaint with Home | Safercar -- National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), since several attempts have already been made to fix the issue and you feel this is safety issue. Unfortunately, it may not help your case, at least not quickly nor directly. It'll just be another known data point to NHTSA.
     
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  6. User4life

    User4life Member

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    Thanks. I agree about the wire. They have decided not to do it since the beginning. They have not given a reason why. It has been the engineers in Californias(or business office) decision not to do it. I am thinking since it is intermittent.

    Thanks for posting info on Lemon Law. I looked into it and I will have to go that route if no other options come up.
     
  7. Electroman

    Electroman Well-Known Member

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    #7 Electroman, May 13, 2018
    Last edited: May 13, 2018
    What is backup camera anything to do with AP? Answer: nothing. Not in the current version.

    Not resolving any issue for months is unacceptable especially on something that can be easily reproduced. But categorizing this as a safety issue, I am not sure.
     
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  8. jelloslug

    jelloslug Active Member

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    I find that they would not check the wire first very odd considering how easy (and cheap) it is to check it. The main wire that goes from the center computer to the drivers side kick panel retails for $25 and the one from the kick panel to the hatch harness is $28. Both of those parts are orders of magnitude cheaper than the parts they have replaced.
     
  9. brkaus

    brkaus Well-Known Member

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    I'm also suspicious of a broken wire.

    I don't recall if the backup camera also goes to the AP computer first? I do believe that AP does NOT use the camera input at this time. So safety is backing up, nothing else. Not belittling it, but it isn't AP problem. I'm not sure NTSB report makes any sense here.

    But I would suggest that they consider the wire if they have replaced the MCU and the camera.

    Mine has matched the bottom picture once in the last 6 months. Reboot resolved it and it didn't come back.

    Did you reboot? Does that fix it?

    I would suggest getting the lemon law paperwork together. Give them some deadline (30 days??) and let them know you will file the lemon law. Once filed, they do have additional time to actually repair the issue. But I have heard some auto dealers have become unresponsive once lemon law has been discussed... so I would try everything else first. If reboot fixes it, I'd even sit on it for a while, after understanding the lemon laws in your state.
     
  10. User4life

    User4life Member

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    Good afternoon,

    Thank you for suggestions. I will look into NTHSA. The camera does work after reboot. For the first few months, they did not want to do the wire fix. I heard a few weeks ago that they were planning on it and then it got canceled. They said it was goin to be a 2-3 day repair. They are the ones that have suggested that it is a firmware issue which may be why they still have chose not to replace the wire. Since they have said it is a firmware issue, it is hard for me to know what is compromised and what is not. How far does the firmware issue go? If it is a hardware issue, then it would be easier to understand what is and is not compromised. I have just asked that they put it all in writing when a supposed fix has been completed.

    Regarding safety and not driving, a back-up camera is advertised as a safety feature. This is not a new concept.
     
  11. bmah

    bmah Moderator, Model S/X, California Forums

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    Moved a post to snippiness. Regardless of whether or not you agree with someone's description of his or her problem, please keep the discussion civil.

    Thank you,

    Bruce.
     
  12. AmpedRealtor

    AmpedRealtor Well-Known Member

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    Backup camera is a CONVENIENCE feature, not a safety feature. Your concern is misplaced and you need to relax. If you are within original warranty, service cannot resolve and the problem persists, you may be able to lemon the car under your state's lemon law.
     
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  13. alcibiades

    alcibiades Member

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    All new cars in US now required to have backup cameras (one link among a gazoodle)

    Whether we old folk believe it is convenience and not a safety feature, the law -- just nigh on a fortnight old, it is! -- appears to be on the OP's side. (noting, of course, that his car was built prior to the change. still whether it is a safety feature or not seems to be a point of issue here.)
     
  14. artsci

    artsci Sponsor

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    As I have mucho experience with the rear camera and cables, I agree that the problem is probably with the cable or maybe the camera itself. If the cable was nicked or somehow broken, you probably wouldn’t see any image on the touchscreen. So my guess is that it or the camera has some kind of defect that causes the the problem you’ve been having.

    One would think that this is the first thing Tesla would replace or check. One also would think that they have a diagnostic tool that can check whether the signal is corrupt.

    But there is one easy way to check, which you might suggest to your service center (I’m amazed that they haven’t done this). Plug a spare camera and cable into the touchsceen connector (it’s under the driver’s footwell trim). You can hold the camera in your hand and move it around — you should see an image on the touchscreen. If you do, your existing rear camera and/or cable are defective and Tesla should replace them. If you don’t the problem is not with the cable or camera.
     
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  15. bro1999

    bro1999 Active Member

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    Time to lemon law your car. What you've gone through is pretty ridiculous.
     
  16. Electroman

    Electroman Well-Known Member

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    On a different note, if this is true and as easy as what arsci claims, then this could be the ticket to have a videos piped into the screen. isn't it ?
     
  17. artsci

    artsci Sponsor

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    Not the case. It’s just unplugging the existing rear camera and cable and connecting a new Tesla camera and cable. I did this when I was developing the rear camera switch. Plugged a 2nd Tesla camera into the touchscreen connector and held the camera by hand at the front of the car to see what image it would produce on the touchscreen.

    Any signal from a device that’s not a Tesla camera will not show on the touchscreen. To put it simply, the touchscreen doesn’t know where the camera and cables are it just knows it’s getting a signal from a Tesla camera and displays the image.
     
  18. User4life

    User4life Member

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    Arsci, Thank you for the suggestion. I will look into it, I am not sure if they tried that. Enjoyed looking at the mods!
     

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