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Tesla comes to Europe (it's official!)

Discussion in 'Roadster' started by raymond, Apr 2, 2008.

  1. raymond

    raymond Member

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    #1 raymond, Apr 2, 2008
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2008
    FT.com / Home UK / UK - Tesla to sell electric cars in Europe

    Tesla Motors plans to begin selling electriccars in Europe next year, taking advantage of the weak dollar.

    Ze'ev Drori, chief executive of the US start-up, told the Financial Times that Tesla would start selling its Roadster sports car for just under €100,000 ($156,000), on the continent by the third quarter. It began production in the US last month.

    [...]

    Tesla would target "obvious" big markets such as Germany, France and the Netherlands, as well as countries such as Norway and Denmark, which offer generous tax incentives for low-emission cars. Tesla will not sell in the UK initially because it produces no right-hand-drive vehicles.


    I sure hope the 100.000 includes the 19-25% value added tax. In most places it's illegal to advertise prices excl. tax to the greater public.
     
  2. Cobos

    Cobos S60 owner since 2013

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    I also seriously hope that price is with any taxes added because a 100 000 Euro price is a serious markup from the US price. They might see a bit of grey imports then. This obviously isn't so much a problem for the Roadster but the Whitestar has to make a certain economic sense as well. Not to mention that in that car segment there is a LOT of competition. They will go directly for BMW, Audi and Mercedes customers in Germany and France, and then they need a competitive price (if not necissarily cheaper). The shortening of the timeframe on the other hand is good news :)

    Cobos
     
  3. BBHighway

    BBHighway Member

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    That's not necessarily a big markup from the US price. TM has already mentioned that they plan to raise the price for the 2009 model year.

    On the "Buy" page of the TM website it says "Prices and options quoted are for the 2008 model year Tesla Roadster and are subject to change. Pricing for the 2009 model year Tesla Roadster has not been set."

    That's almost a bit of a "bait and switch" in that they are currently taking reservations for the 2009 model, but quote the 2008 price. Still, they do provide that warning, and the reservation deposit is (mostly) refundable.

    Personally, I'm expecting the 2009 price to go to $125,000 US, but that's just my own speculation.
     
  4. Cobos

    Cobos S60 owner since 2013

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    Still even with the possible new 2009 price of $125k an increase in Europe to $156 is around 25% more. If you remember that both Germany and France has a sales tax (actually a VAT ) of almost 20% and possible some more costs associated with cars specifically you are approaching $200 000 and that might actually be too expensive? If on the other hand that price estimate is according to European standards where VAT is INCLUDED in the listed price then the markup is a lot more modest.

    Cobos

    PS: As a personal note, it took me 4 trips to the states before I learned that the prices listed on the shelves would NOT match the final bill, as I'm so used to just adding up the prices as I pick up goods. :)
     
  5. WarpedOne

    WarpedOne Supreme Premier

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    If they intend to compete on price then yes, but they do not have to. They are a novelity and can charge a premium. With 10.000 anual WhiteStar production they shouldn't have any problem selling them in USA and Europe even at such prices.
     
  6. DDB

    DDB Member

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    I consider it a matter of production. First to retail the EV wins such that there is an inventory. The thing about all of these EVs is that they're all in the pipeline it seems, Tesla's included. Pipeline = Pipe-dream. I'm not a naysayer, but I've got pennies burning a hole in my pocket but it's not enough for me sitting on a damn waiting list while competitors try to play leapfrog.
     
  7. Cobos

    Cobos S60 owner since 2013

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    I do realize that they can charge a premium and to a certain degree that is fine, but it seems many of the EV producers are saying that since we produce an EV we can demand almost double price. In many ways the Think is 60-100% the purchase price of a similar gasoline microcar. I do realise that the EV has lower running costs but I'm sure it'll be many years before it is parity in costs. I know Think is selling everything they can produce and I'm still looking which in some ways means the price is right. I just don't like the idea that I have to pay a lot more just to be enviromentally friendly, especially not in Norway where the price is heavily skewed towards EVs. I suppose it's a lack of understanding WHY they need a possible 60-70% markup just to ship the car over the atlantic? That's the part I don't like :) even though I can understand a company wants to sell as expensive as it can get away with... Of course all of this is all hypothetical at this point since I suppose the price wont be final for another year and it's the Whitestar I'm interested in not the Roadster :)

    Cobos
     
  8. AGR

    AGR Member

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    Is there an actual paying customer that has taken delivery of a Tesla yet?
     
  9. BBHighway

    BBHighway Member

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    That should happen next month. It's been a long wait, but if they deliver on time, it will still be way ahead of the Volt, Karma and Lightning, not to mention the ZAP-X.
     
  10. malcolm

    malcolm Active Member

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    With silly gas prices and pathetic mpg for existing exotics, Europe always was the logical location for a BEV-sports car.

    Pity they aren't prepared to make a right-hand drive version.......yet?

    Yes, Lotus makes the Elise in both right and left, but all of the Roadster crash tests would have to be re-done.

    *sigh*
     
  11. BBHighway

    BBHighway Member

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    I guess that's why the markup for the European version, to pay for all those extra crash tests. Plus, it's what the market will bear, or at least what TM expects it to bear.
     
  12. Kardax

    Kardax Member

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    It's all about supply and demand.

    Tesla is the only company mass producing* an electric sports car right now. That novelty is probably worth $50,000 by itself. $156,000 is bordering on insanity, though, as it's not competitive by any objective measure.

    Still, being the only one in the business means they can charge whatever people are willing to pay. Tesla needs some direct competition if prices are ever going to come down.

    Crash testing will only be expensive for Tesla if they fail something and have to do re-engineering. I don't know how European safety standards compare to U.S. ones, but passing U.S. standards is a great start...

    -Ryan

    * I wouldn't call the current one-car-a-week "mass production", but they claim to intend to increase that and should be able to do so if their suppliers can keep up.
     
  13. BBHighway

    BBHighway Member

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    In Europe, the direct competitor would be the Lightening. Isn't it priced even higher, about $300,000 US? Makes the Tesla Roadster look like a bargain, even at $156,000.
     
  14. BBHighway

    BBHighway Member

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    Sorry, that's Lightning, not Lightening.
     
  15. Kardax

    Kardax Member

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    I don't think a single Lightning has been built yet... not even a prototype.

    With Tesla stealing all of Lighting's, uh, thunder... I think that price disadvantage is fatal.

    Personally, I think Tesla's only threats are the established automakers, and none of them seem interested in an electric sports car at the moment... so I expect Tesla will reign unchallenged for at least the next 3 years.

    -Ryan
     
  16. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    #16 TEG, Apr 3, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 13, 2016
     
  17. raymond

    raymond Member

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    EUR 100.000 or 119.000?

    The youtube video also suggest a EUR 100.000 retail price. Darryl (or anyone else from Tesla), can you confirm that the 100.000 includes value added tax?
     
  18. Cobos

    Cobos S60 owner since 2013

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    Yeah as I mentioned above I'm also very curious to know if the suggested price of 100k Euro is with or without VAT. :)

    Cobos
     
  19. doug

    doug Administrator / Head Moderator

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    Darryl's post about Tesla in Europe: Tesla Motors - feel

    Does this answer the price/tax questions? I know nothing of European taxes.
     
  20. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    Shouldn't they like, um, fill the backorders here before launching a new market?!
     

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