Tesla EV Tax Credits coming back?

[PNWLeccy]

This is a great idea.

I agree. Tesla regularly used EoQ incentives to drive demand pre-2020 including Free supercharging (Unlimited, 2 years, 1 year, 6 mo.), Free option upgrades (Paint, wheels), and Free FSD (1 mo. trial).

If this tax incentive passed there would be lots of people holding off on Q4 delivery and Tesla would have to do something to prevent that. They could drop the price and raise it again in Q1 but that would complicate things re: messaging about supply constraints causing price increases, media criticizing Tesla for demand issues (because nuance and context do not exist for them), criticism when prices are raised again (accusing Tesla of trying to capture tax incentives).

I think including FSD for free (maybe for a year- $2388 @ $199/mo.) would be a great way to gather even more AP/FSD data, excite new owners w/ the possibilities of FSD, and likely hook those who don't want to give it up after a year.

 

[Cares]

I think you're greatly overestimating how informed the general public is of upcoming legislature.

 

[PNWLeccy]

I think you're greatly overestimating how informed the general public is of upcoming legislature.

I am just as cynical as you but my bias is showing. I'm on a Tesla forum with some highly informed individuals and that may be skewing my expectations. haha

 

[leaftoy]

Why would they do that? It's not like the $10k would be coming from Tesla.

They don’t need to do that, of course, unless it makes business sense to them.

May be there are enough folks for whom getting the car 1-3 months earlier is worth $8k. Or may be they can focus on making international deliveries and delay US deliveries into next year. Or use the lower demand period to focus on retooling Y production lines and/or focusing on S&X builds.

 

[mrwug]

Car demand is 3-6 months out right now. Sure some people will wait but I bet you more people will be glad to forgo the tax credit to take delivery now.

This may be true in this forum (may be) but if the bill is signed by the end of Sept with the current proposed language for EV tax credit and credit starts on Jan 1 how many can forego an almost 15% discount for the privilege of driving the vehicle couple of months sooner? Especially when resale value won’t distinguish between, say, a Dec 21 MY and Jan 22 MY and would factor in the discount.

As someone with a late November EDD, I'm watching the situation very closely. While I've learned my lesson about managing delivery dates, for an $8K tax credit, I'd happily postpone my purchase by 2-6 months. I don't actually need another vehicle until late next summer so if waiting will reduce my cost by 12-15%, I'll (almost) happily keep driving my X1.

For folks like me, it would some pretty exceptional incentives to get me to take delivery in 2021. Doubly so if the credit is offered at point of sale as has been proposed.

 

[Canyonero]

I think you're greatly overestimating how informed the general public is of upcoming legislature.

And I think you're a bit critical of the general public for someone who calls legislation "legislature."

I'll see myself out now.

 

[Firocity]

I think you're greatly overestimating how informed the general public is of upcoming legislature.

I wouldn’t call a Tesla consumer ”general public.” In addition to the cars being $60k, one must be savvy enough to figure out charging and the nuances of an EV. I would say Tesla consumers are more likely to be informed about tax legislation than the average Joe.

 

[Cares]

I wouldn’t call a Tesla consumer ”general public.” In addition to the cars being $60k, one must be savvy enough to figure out charging and the nuances of an EV. I would say Tesla consumers are more likely to be informed about tax legislation than the average Joe.

I disagree but of course this is just all opinion. Go look at the type of questions that are asked on Facebook Tesla groups. This is a much better representation of the average Tesla buyer. Also look at how many forum users there are on here and how many Teslas sold.

 

[Zorg]

I disagree but of course this is just all opinion. Go look at the type of questions that are asked on Facebook Tesla groups. This is a much better representation of the average Tesla buyer. Also look at how many forum users there are on here and how many Teslas sold.

Tesla is way past the early adopter phase (basically most of the folks in this forum) and is a pretty mainstream car manufacturer. Anecdotally, I see this in friends and family that have recently purchased one or are looking at one.

 

[mrwug]

I disagree but of course this is just all opinion. Go look at the type of questions that are asked on Facebook Tesla groups. This is a much better representation of the average Tesla buyer. Also look at how many forum users there are on here and how many Teslas sold.

If the legislation passes as currently composed, it’ll be a major news story, perhaps more than one:

• There’s the angle of new EV incentives
• There’s the angle of Tesla getting a new chunk of incentives
• We’ll have the TSLA bears coming out pointing out that Q4 sales will be in the dumpster due to people deferring until the new tax year

In any case, I think most people with orders will likely aware of the tax change. The bigger question is how many are in a position to defer? Those with expiring leases or needing an additional car might have to forgo the credit.

On the plus side for TSLA, the current backlog might encourage orders immediately, which would help paint a rosy picture even if deliveries slip in Q4.

 

[nate704]

$4500 extra for the union is purely political push and lobbied by UAW , which is wrong and unfair. Biden needed something in there, so he can say he did try at least to please his donors.

 

[patmurphey]

Is it clear that the "union" $4,500 applies to BEVs or does it also apply to plug in hybrids? If PHEVs are included, we would see a ridiculous $8,500 credit, more than Tesla's $8,000. PHEVs are a backward step for zero emissions.

 

[nate704]

Is it clear that the "union" $4,500 applies to BEVs or does it also apply to plug in hybrids? If PHEVs are included, we would see a ridiculous $8,500 credit, more than Tesla's $8,000. PHEVs are a backward step for zero emissions.

Most experts say this $4500 is just one of those "check the box" type, which will not make it out of the Senate. Also, as Sandy Munro said, hybrid platform is good at nothing and over complicate things and wrong thing to do at this point.

 

[Zorg]

Most experts say this $4500 is just one of those "check the box" type, which will not make it out of the Senate. Also, as Sandy Munro said, hybrid platform is good at nothing and over complicate things and wrong thing to do at this point.

Phev manage to combine the disadvantages of both ice and EV

 

[MY-Y]

When I placed my M3 order a week ago, the order page said delivery in January. Now my order says 10/13-11/13. With so much on the line with the tax rules, I'm shooting for January. I suspect this may mean March though -Tesla doesn't seem too keen on deliveries early in the quarter.

If the $40k cap is in there, I'll have to forgo the blue, and stick with the $39,990 white one.

 

[rjpjnk]

Phev manage to combine the disadvantages of both ice and EV

This may be true now, but we should give them credit for helping to usher in the age of affordable EVs. The Prius broke a lot of ground for us and I am grateful for it. Respect.

 

[FlatSix911]

More information from Electrek including Elon's response...

Dems propose new $12,500 electric car rebate, Tesla left with $4,500 disadvantage

Democrats have proposed an updated electric car incentive program at the federal level, which would go through their $3.5 trillion...

electrek.co

Elon Musk claims Ford and auto worker union wrote the new electric car incentive bill

Tesla CEO Elon Musk commented on the new federal electric car incentive reform proposed by the Democrats, which includes a...

electrek.co

"Musk alleged that Ford and the United Auto Workers union wrote the new piece of legislation. As we reported last week, the Democrats unveiled the latest version of their planned reform of the federal EV incentive, which they plan to push through as part of their $3.5 trillion social spending bill. They were several changes compared to previously proposed reforms, but the biggest one is a $4,500 additional benefit to electric vehicles coming out of factories where the workers are part of a union.

It is putting several foreign automakers that produce vehicles without union workers at a disadvantage. Domestically, it gives a strong advantage to virtually all American automakers, except for Tesla. The automaker and its workers have resisted efforts from the UAW to unionize the Fremont factory, where Tesla produces all its vehicles for the US market. On Twitter last night, Tesla CEO Elon Musk said that he believes that lobbyists for Ford and the UAW are behind the new language in the bill:“This is written by Ford/UAW lobbyists, as they make their electric car in Mexico. Not obvious how this serves American taxpayers.”

 

[Watts_Up]

Tesla is basically the only US based company exporting in a large numbers US made cars all over the world.

Why any government would try to penalized such succesful company making products that everyone talk about everywhere over the world and that anyone is eager to get.

Iphones are not made in US, neither the Ford Mach-E.

 

[MY-Y]

Phev manage to combine the disadvantages of both ice and EV

My Pacifica has about 75% of its mileage on full electric. The extra boost from the electric allows a very efficient engine. I get 32-33 MPH on the highway after my battery is "empty" (32 miles). I can also take trips of any distance without the charging delays. I still get heat and AC without running the engine and full-power ac without moving. Regen braking, instant power....

As good as my MY for a daily driver? No.
The disadvantages of EV and ICE? No way.

The electric driving experience of my phev van is why I'm driving a Tesla now.

 

[watsongrg]

Phev manage to combine the disadvantages of both ice and EV

What?
PHEV combine the advantages of both EV and ICE.
My Chevy VOLT has 75,000 miles on it. 85% of those are fully electric, at less than 200Wh/mile. The rest are miles driven on the interstate where i never had range anxiety, never altered my route, never slowed down my pace, never worried about my A/C being on, how cold or hot it was outside, nor thought once about finding charger. It didn't cost much, is cheap to insure and cheap to maintain, has the original tires, And gets 50+ MPG. Its been perfectly reliable, well built, requireing only 2 oil changes and one air filter, that cost less than any required service on a Tesla.
Sure its burned a little -very little- gas. But so does the entire support network for Tesla.

So lets recap....197Wh/Mile and 50 MPG. Definitely an example of the best of both worlds.