Tesla Gen 3 Wall Charger Power Sharing (Ontario, Canada) ESA Problems

[giddyup70]

I posted in an Electrical chat forum, but they suggested posting here too. Has anyone else had problems with Gen 3 power sharing and the ESA? I am going to repost what I shared on the other forum and my frustrations. Please bear with the long post.
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Pretty fed up with ESA. Looking for advice.

4 years ago, had licensed electrician install 2x Gen 2 Tesla wall chargers. My garage is on the other side of the houses main breaker box. Electrician had to dig around the front of the house to install wiring. It was a very expensive and time consuming endeavour. We basically had to hire a contractor to do most of the ground work.

They installed I believe Tek cable and there was a 90 amp breaker used at main panel. In the garage, the 2nd gen chargers were daisy chained and set with the dip switches as per instructions. Every thing passed with ESA.

Fast forward to today. 1 charging unit started malfunctioning and we are upgrading 1 car as lease is ending. So we decide to upgrade both chargers too.

Paid different licensed electrician again to install. They remove old gen 2 chargers. Install sub panel with 2x 60 amp breakers and install Gen 3 chargers to that.

They then set everything up for me via the new WIFI interface as per instructions. Everything works as before. Combined cars are not drawing more than 72 amps as programmed.

ESA comes and inspection fails.

It's now turned into a complete gong show. They want me to install yet another cable run from main breaker box. To me, this made absolutely no sense. Have been going back and forth for weeks trying to find out what is wrong. Electrician no longer communicating with me and ESA doesn't want to communicate with us the home owners.

Finally, just recently I found out that the main problem is that ESA doesn't like the new interface wifi login for changing settings. It's 'too easy' to change they say. As opposed, to say, using a very super difficult screw driver to remove screws and change dip switches. They think that I am going to play around with settings because I'm bored and want to burn my house down.

The whole thing has gotten completely absurd. I am not going to pay thousands again to dig up around the house and install yet another cable line. It completely defeats the purpose of the power sharing feature. On top of this, they also want new load calculation tests done because now we assume that the combined draw is a potential 96 as opposed to when it was set at 72 which can now lead to further problems ie. main panel upgrade

Does anyone have experience with any of this? Any advice for me? I am getting nowhere with the electrician and ESA.

I cannot believe what is happening with all this. I have lost all faith in these 'licensed' electricians and certainly this ESA governing body. The whole thing seems like a cash grab covered under the guise of safety.

Everything is just beyond frustrating. It also boggles my mind as to why inspections take place after the fact once everything is installed by a 'licensed' electrician. Doesn't it make sense to forward information before electrical changes are made?? Now I am stuck with this mess and out of pocket for what was done.

The last thing the electrician recommended was to remove 1 wall charger and either install a dryer socket or some cheap lower power chinese wall charger off amazon. Of course, I flatly declined this as it just sounds ridiculous.

I cannot believe what I am going through. Something that has worked for 4 years without a hitch is now a hazard. There has to be some other solution to all this, does anyone have any recommendations???? Is there anything I can further do in the garage to rectify this?

Sorry for the long rant but this is just bonkers to me!

 

[pbcsd]

Oddly my father in law mentioned the same thing, said he wondered if there were going to be issues now that one can change the power draw on the Tesla Wall Charger/vehicle.

It's not the Electrician's fault, it's literally inconsistencies with the ESA. But you're right, there should be some sort of process where you can, at least if you want to, "pre-authorize" what you're intending to do and then get the final certification afterwards as opposed to just finding out after all is said and done.

I guess technically it is a potential hazard if someone were to try and draw 48a and the wiring was only rated to say a much lower number?

 

[giddyup70]

Oddly my father in law mentioned the same thing, said he wondered if there were going to be issues now that one can change the power draw on the Tesla Wall Charger/vehicle.

It's not the Electrician's fault, it's literally inconsistencies with the ESA. But you're right, there should be some sort of process where you can, at least if you want to, "pre-authorize" what you're intending to do and then get the final certification afterwards as opposed to just finding out after all is said and done.

I guess technically it is a potential hazard if someone were to try and draw 48a and the wiring was only rated to say a much lower number?

But that's the thing, the old gen 2 was setup the same way. A user could manipulate the amp draw by flipping the dip switches. Not to mention the older gen 2's were rated at a higher 80 amps were they not? The ESA is nitpicking 1 tool over another (screwdriver/dip switch over phone/wifi interface). What they are now saying completely defeats the purpose of the power sharing feature. If this was such a large issue why can't they communicate the problems with Tesla? Perhaps the gen 3's should have a password to get in or have tesla send a signal over the net to unlock the unit for an hour for changes to be made. It makes no sense that now home owners are dealing with this mess. I may call the service center and see if something can be escalated somewhere on Tesla's side.

Has anyone on forums here gotten power sharing working here in Ontario for Gen3?

 

[Tony_YYZ]

Yeah I was speaking with my HPWC installer recently and he said the same thing. ESA is denying any load sharing installs for Gen 3 HPWCs. Same reason you said “it’s too easy to modify the settings using your phone”. He said it’s basically dinosaurs running the ESA operations and they refuse to bring themselves up to the modern world of EVs.

The ESA solution is to run dedicated feeds to each HPWC and that would mean halving the power to each permanently. So if you’re getting 48A then each HPWC will have 24A max at all times.

But it’s like you said, it wasn’t hard to change the dip switches on the Gen 2’s but they certified those load sharing setups.

 

[Cricklewood]

Perhaps not ideal, but would swapping the two 60a breakers for 2 x 40a and configuring the chargers accordingly satisfy the ESA? Remove the load balancing all together. Can you get by with 32a max charging per vehicle?

 

[RAM_Eh]

Perhaps not ideal, but would swapping the two 60a breakers for 2 x 40a and configuring the chargers accordingly satisfy the ESA? Remove the load balancing all together. Can you get by with 32a max charging per vehicle?

Ok So I am an electrician and would recommend taking this approach. Take a permit out with ESA as the home owner and ask the questions above. Changing the breakers should satisfy ESA.

If this helps put a panel on the end of the 90A feed and install separate feeds to each charger at 40A.

I have a 2021 MS plaid and a 2018 M3, and originally installed a 100A panel in my garage in 2013 for the S. It was charging at 80A then as it had the dual chargers. Fast forward to today I have installed two second generations chargers and the new MS can only charge at 47A, same as the M3. I derated the M3 charge limit on the charger and the car to 30A and the MS to 45A. I am not using the load balance option of the chargers with an interlock.

FYI - The M3 only drives 100-150 KM between charges usually and the MS can use 400KM normally between charges.

Flowing this thread with interest.

 

[RAM_Eh]

They installed I believe Tek cable and there was a 90 amp breaker used at main panel. In the garage, the 2nd gen chargers were daisy chained and set with the dip switches as per instructions. Every thing passed with ESA.

Have them install a 100A panel at the end of this cable and feed each charger with 40A breakers.

 

[Ed C BC]

I posted in an Electrical chat forum, but they suggested posting here too. Has anyone else had problems with Gen 3 power sharing and the ESA? I am going to repost what I shared on the other forum and my frustrations. Please bear with the long post.
----
Pretty fed up with ESA. Looking for advice.

4 years ago, had licensed electrician install 2x Gen 2 Tesla wall chargers. My garage is on the other side of the houses main breaker box. Electrician had to dig around the front of the house to install wiring. It was a very expensive and time consuming endeavour. We basically had to hire a contractor to do most of the ground work.

They installed I believe Tek cable and there was a 90 amp breaker used at main panel. In the garage, the 2nd gen chargers were daisy chained and set with the dip switches as per instructions. Every thing passed with ESA.

Fast forward to today. 1 charging unit started malfunctioning and we are upgrading 1 car as lease is ending. So we decide to upgrade both chargers too.

Paid different licensed electrician again to install. They remove old gen 2 chargers. Install sub panel with 2x 60 amp breakers and install Gen 3 chargers to that.

They then set everything up for me via the new WIFI interface as per instructions. Everything works as before. Combined cars are not drawing more than 72 amps as programmed.

ESA comes and inspection fails.

It's now turned into a complete gong show. They want me to install yet another cable run from main breaker box. To me, this made absolutely no sense. Have been going back and forth for weeks trying to find out what is wrong. Electrician no longer communicating with me and ESA doesn't want to communicate with us the home owners.

Finally, just recently I found out that the main problem is that ESA doesn't like the new interface wifi login for changing settings. It's 'too easy' to change they say. As opposed, to say, using a very super difficult screw driver to remove screws and change dip switches. They think that I am going to play around with settings because I'm bored and want to burn my house down.

The whole thing has gotten completely absurd. I am not going to pay thousands again to dig up around the house and install yet another cable line. It completely defeats the purpose of the power sharing feature. On top of this, they also want new load calculation tests done because now we assume that the combined draw is a potential 96 as opposed to when it was set at 72 which can now lead to further problems ie. main panel upgrade

Does anyone have experience with any of this? Any advice for me? I am getting nowhere with the electrician and ESA.

I cannot believe what is happening with all this. I have lost all faith in these 'licensed' electricians and certainly this ESA governing body. The whole thing seems like a cash grab covered under the guise of safety.

Everything is just beyond frustrating. It also boggles my mind as to why inspections take place after the fact once everything is installed by a 'licensed' electrician. Doesn't it make sense to forward information before electrical changes are made?? Now I am stuck with this mess and out of pocket for what was done.

The last thing the electrician recommended was to remove 1 wall charger and either install a dryer socket or some cheap lower power chinese wall charger off amazon. Of course, I flatly declined this as it just sounds ridiculous.

I cannot believe what I am going through. Something that has worked for 4 years without a hitch is now a hazard. There has to be some other solution to all this, does anyone have any recommendations???? Is there anything I can further do in the garage to rectify this?

Sorry for the long rant but this is just bonkers to me!

Hi, I took a different approach to getting level 2 charging for my Model 3. Dug a trench from just below the dryer vent out to the curb, including tunnels under my sidewalk and 5 foot wide city sidewalk. Special trenching shovel worked great for that. Installed 2 inch PVC pipe and valve box from a sprinkler system supplier. Found directions for bending PVC pipe on YouTube, did that rather than install elbows. Pulled in cabtire cable easily, installed a receptacle in the valve box. Mounted a Dryer Buddy by the dryer, connected cable from the curb to that. Plugged in the cable that came with the car and good to go. Voltage drop at 24 amps was a little more than I wanted to see so reset in the car to 20 amps.

Worked fine till my insurance company insisted on having my whole electrical system inspected. The electrician/ inspector did not like the Dryer Buddy or the cable I used.
Called an electrician to address issues from the inspection. He said the Dryer Buddy had to go, made room in my panel for a new 30 amp breaker, ran new cable to a junction box by the dryer, then armoured cable thru my 2 inch pipe. He insisted the receptacle at the curb had to be 12 inches above ground, so I mounted a piece of 2 x 6 in the valve box, dryer receptacle got mounted there. I covered the 2 x 6 and receptacle with cedar barn boards, again plugged in the cable and started charging at 24 amps.

There was no breakdown of costs in the electricians bill, and he looked after a couple of other issues in the same tab so I don't know exactly what all this cost. My best guess for the system I have now is about $1100 Canadian. That does not include the Dryer Buddy or the first cable & fittings.

And no, I did not get a permit from the city to install this system. Best not to ask.

 

[giddyup70]

So just an update. Approached them about lowering the amps at the sub panel but they also don't like this. They claim that "Breakers can fail".

Also contacted another electrician and he finally had a chance to come out. This guy seems more confused then the original installer. No one really seems to know how these chargers function. I showed him the wifi login page because he had no clue it existed.

It has been very frustrating dealing with all this. Right now everything is working. I am ignoring it for the time being. It's Christmas and Omicron is causing more headaches.

If no one gets back to us in the New Year I will simply continue using it as is and pretend I never even had this situation to begin with. I managed to talk to another friend who is pretty capable with machinery. He was mentioning installing a fuse box between the TEK cable and sub panel. The same they use in machine shops. Throw 80 amp fuses into it if they don't like the breakers, but he also agrees that the inspector is making too far big a deal over this. They are installed like this all through the USA with no problems. They simply just want to use their own code books to justify what they are doing. In his opinion, they seem to have an issue with the Tesla charger itself and ultimately should be bringing this up with Tesla. I tend to agree.

 

[ElmieY]

I installed my 2 Gen3 chargers just like the way you did originally. 2 chargers on a sub-panel, can’t be bothered with ESA. Been using my chargers like this since May 2021 and load sharing has been flawless.

 

[Solartech]

What is the gauge wire of the tek cable? How much amps is your main service?

Perform a total load calculation and work from there to satisfy the inspector. There are solutions just work through it. Be safe and Merry Christmas!