Tesla has a monopoly. Best to wait?

[ecarfan]

Charging takes too long. Hope to have higher capacity chargers like 300 or 500 kwh

I often hear this objection from people who have never owned an EV. What they have trouble imagining is that every day that they drive less than 250 miles or so is a day where the charging time is effectively ZERO. That is because the car charges at night while they are asleep (or if they work the night shift, during the day). So when they wake up and get in the car to drive the car is charged and they have spent ZERO time charging.

Now consider how many days a year you drive more than 250 miles in a day. On those days you will have to spend 25 or maybe even 45 minutes at a Supercharger. So how many days out of the year will that be for you?

I am planning to wait until there is competition from German manufactures who I am sure will provide more luxury features with better build quality. Then Tesla has to improve its quality and features.

You are going to be waiting several more years. Which you are welcome to do. In the meantime, Tesla will build and sell hundreds of thousands of cars and will continue to build out the Supercharger network. As of this moment, no other car manufacturer is building a useful high speed charging network (and from Seattle there are Superchargers for travel north, east, and south: go west and you will drive into the ocean before you run out of charge). Think of how many years it is going to be before any of those manufacturers have such a charging network.

Now reconsider your -- in my opinion -- trivial list of concerns about Tesla vehicles: lack of door storage, more interior color and material choices, head rest adjustment, no cooled seats, etc.

Seriously?

 

[TexasEV]

You can spend your money to have the best EV or you can spend it on a luxury German interior. Everyone has his priorities.

 

[gowthamn]

I often hear this objection from people who have never owned an EV. What they have trouble imagining is that every day that they drive less than 250 miles or so is a day where the charging time is effectively ZERO. That is because the car charges at night while they are asleep (or if they work the night shift, during the day). So when they wake up and get in the car to drive the car is charged and they have spent ZERO time charging.

Now consider how many days a year you drive more than 250 miles in a day. On those days you will have to spend 25 or maybe even 45 minutes at a Supercharger. So how many days out of the year will that be for you?

You are going to be waiting several more years. Which you are welcome to do. In the meantime, Tesla will build and sell hundreds of thousands of cars and will continue to build out the Supercharger network. As of this moment, no other car manufacturer is building a useful high speed charging network (and from Seattle there are Superchargers for travel north, east, and south: go west and you will drive into the ocean before you run out of charge). Think of how many years it is going to be before any of those manufacturers have such a charging network.

Now reconsider your -- in my opinion -- trivial list of concerns about Tesla vehicles: lack of door storage, more interior color and material choices, head rest adjustment, no cooled seats, etc.

Seriously?

I know that building a charging network takes time. But once German EVs arrive with better interiors, Tesla will be forced to do the same and then I can buy a Tesla.

 

[gowthamn]

Just a note to everyone that I cannot charge at home. I live in a condo type place now with open parking

 

[johnnyS]

Wait until next year (or the year after), there will be a better Tesla. When I drive solo in a HOV lane and I zoom by a Porsche in the regular lanes, I laugh at the poor person who thought buying the Porsche was the way to go. I do not miss going to a gas station, it is so much more convenient to have a full tank of electrons each morning. I really do not care how many storage cubbies, buttons, and dials those other cars have.

 

[Hugh Mannity]

Just a note to everyone that I cannot charge at home. I live in a condo type place now with open parking

Seattle is a fairly forward thinking place. Have you spoken to your condo board? Getting an EVSE put in may not be as difficult as you think.

Also agree that German car quality isn't that great in the long run. They don't compare to the longevity of the Japanese or even Korean cars now.

 

[azred]

Tesla currently has a monopoly in the high end EV market. I am thinking of waiting until there is competition before I buy.
I test drove 5 series, E class and MS on the same day. My budget is 100k.

Some of the features which the MS does not have are:

Door storage
Better choice of color and materials for interior
Head rest adjustment.
Cooled seats
Too much outside noise not being filtered
Options like spoilers
Panel gap is too much in the Tesla I test drove
The interior does not feel like a 100k car in general
Charging takes too long. Hope to have higher capacity chargers like 300 or 500 kwh.


I think that since Tesla has a monopoly they can get away with not providing even basic features and still sell well. I am planning to wait until there is competition from German manufactures who I am sure will provide more luxury features with better build quality. Then Tesla has to improve its quality and features.
I like the instant torque of electric cars hence I don't want to buy ICE cars.
I will miss too many convenience features if I buy a MS now.

I didn't wait but you definitely should. Don't follow the crowd on this board by buying a Tesla. Take that hundred large that's burning a hole in your pocket and buy German.

 

[P85DBeast]

If your "Waiting for a car with Tesla tech. and German fit and finish and features" You won't find one. Tesla is the way to go. If anyone decided to wait there wouldn't be as many people on the forum as there is. Tesla is the most advanced Manufacture that I know of you won't find a another car with a 17 inch screen, power, looks, safety, and technology like the Model S. It's just can't be compared to any other car. In any category the Model S has always killed it. The Model S hasn't been knocked off the pedestal for the 4+ years it been out. And if you decide to wait or go with another manufacture that's you'r call. You're gonna be missing out. Im just saying don't worry about what feature's aren't there yet. They will be coming just give it time. What are you waiting for pull the trigger...

 

[dknisely]

Tesla currently has a monopoly in the high end EV market. I am thinking of waiting until there is competition before I buy.
I test drove 5 series, E class and MS on the same day. My budget is 100k.

Some of the features which the MS does not have are:

Door storage
Better choice of color and materials for interior
Head rest adjustment.
Cooled seats
Too much outside noise not being filtered
Options like spoilers
Panel gap is too much in the Tesla I test drove
The interior does not feel like a 100k car in general
Charging takes too long. Hope to have higher capacity chargers like 300 or 500 kwh.


I think that since Tesla has a monopoly they can get away with not providing even basic features and still sell well. I am planning to wait until there is competition from German manufactures who I am sure will provide more luxury features with better build quality. Then Tesla has to improve its quality and features.
I like the instant torque of electric cars hence I don't want to buy ICE cars.
I will miss too many convenience features if I buy a MS now.

Definitely could do better, but these are features for me:

• Door storage
• Better choice of color and materials for interior
• Head rest adjustment.
• Cooled seats

I ended up with the last of the ventilated seats on my S60. Head rest adjustments might be better, but I think they are constrained by safety certification standards/tests. I also got in before the simplification of the color/materials combinations.

LACK of door storage is a HUGE positive for me because my wife is a huge trash-in-door-storage abuser. Bravo for no locations for trash to accumulate!!!!!

 

[Apropos]

Seattle is a fairly forward thinking place. Have you spoken to your condo board? Getting an EVSE put in may not be as difficult as you think.

Also agree that German car quality isn't that great in the long run. They don't compare to the longevity of the Japanese or even Korean cars now.

I'm in the same situation--I live in a condo that currently has no charging available in the parking garage. I've had my MS for 3 months and use a Tesla brand destination charger about once a week in the parking garage where I work. I'm also on the committee at our condo looking into options for installing charging stations in our parking garage. There are other options for local public charging as well--REI, Whole Foods, etc. There was some uncertainty when I purchased my car about charging, but it really hasn't been an issue.

 

[calisnow]

The driving experience of Tesla is nice. That is why did not buy 5 series or E class. Electric cars are awesome for driving experience. I hate turbo lag. I am imagining a car with the luxury of bmw or merc with the the technology of tesla. Some day I hope !

So - you like going on test drives. What do you actually own?

 

[SFOTurtle]

So if you can't charge in your condo complex (worth pushing the condo association at a minimum and it might even be illegal for the association to deny building a charger), what is the plan to charge? Even if one of the German makers comes out with a larger battery pack than Tesla's (I'm not holding my breath for this), where would you charge your car?

Although Tesla has made improvements to charging speed and tapering, these incremental improvements have shaved some charging time but nothing that would allow you to charge to full in 10 minutes. If you need that kind of charging speed, you probably don't have your kids. As much as I'd like to drive the car for hours on end like I did when I was in my 20s, now once our kids are in the car, 2 to 2 1/2 hours is about as much as they can tolerate without stopping. I actually welcome the breaks now and just enjoy taking my time. If we're in a hurry, we fly.

 

[Electroman]

Also autopilot is not much better than assisted driving currently. It will improve with time I guess, but the improvement with Tesla vision is so slow.

Really? The best luxury I have that no amount of fine Euro leather and wood finish can give me, is AP1. You can't compare anything to the luxury of reducing stress in heavy commute traffic.

Of course AP2 is not on par with AP1 as of now, but it's only a matter of time.

 

[gowthamn]

So - you like going on test drives. What do you actually own?

Now I own just an Audi A4 (youtu.be/qqnkA8dCI40?t=9s). Want to sell it and buy a more premium car.

 

[gowthamn]

Really?

I mean Merc and BMW's current assistance systems do have stop and go ability in heavy traffic. Eventually Tesla will be better then them all, but now they are all comparable.

 

[tchockie]

Here are my last 3 leases before my Model S:

BMW F10 M5
Mercedes W212 E550
Porsche Panamera S

I really really liked those cars. Clearly I have a thing for German cars. You do have some valid considerations (but spoilers? Idk what you're talking about there). The paint, fit/finish, storage, refinement, Bluetooth media interface, cupholders, etc were all superior to my Tesla. I've posted on another thread that my M5 seats are imo one of the best seats in any car today. I really really miss my ventilated seats. I miss some buttons on my dash. I miss the HUD on the BMW.

And obviously you're gonna read a lot of Tesla hate articles and complaining posts here. I have a thread about how it took 6 months to get my MS repaired after I was rear ended. I have panel gaps that I can fit my finger in. My seats are kind of uncomfortable. The paint is soft.

But u know what? I frikkin love this car. I love driving it. I used to take my cars to tracks so I really love driving, and while the MS is not close to a track car, it's more fun to drive every day than any of my previous cars. I feel special driving it. Having AP is like experiencing a real glimpse of the future. One of, if not, the safest cars on the planet. This car is just damn cool. And there's nothing else like it. Not even close. Everyone else is stuck in the past. Tesla is doing things nobody thought was possible, and they're just getting started.

You can't have it all. But I feel like I do when I drive my car.

 

[Sir Guacamolaf]

Door storage: But you gain so much in car storage, Model S has a lot of carrying capacity.

Better choice of color and materials for interior
Head rest adjustment.
Cooled seats
Options like spoilers
Panel gap is too much in the Tesla I test drove
The interior does not feel like a 100k car in general
All the above, I agree, as a part of general fit and finish not being comparable to other 100K cars.
However, autopilot is a big draw, and those other 100K cars don't have the driving dynamics of Tesla.
So I see it as pros and cons.

Too much outside noise not being filtered: Partially agreed, because there is lesser noise to filter. Actual measurements show that at freeway speeds lexus is quieter than Tesla, merc and bmw are comparable, but in town driving, Tesla is quieter.

Charging takes too long. This is a non-issue. The only people who care about charging time are the ones who have wasted time going to a gas station.

Here is how to charge an ICE,
a) Background thread sapping your energy "I need gas"
b) Begrudgingly dress up, unlock, get in car, ignition, open garage door, don't forget to close it, drive to gas station: 30 mins out of your life.
c) Step out, damn its cold .. #*(#, check for credit card skimmers, step into someone else's slurpy. cuss!
d) Smell fumes, yummy
e) open gas door, swipe card, .. I'm not sure what the actual sequence is, haven't done it in 2 years.
f.1) Hope that damn clicker works this time.
f.2) F** credit card skimmers
f.3) Oh great card machine is down
f.4) Is that a booger is just crusted up gas + dust?
f.5) Oh she's cute, oh no wait that's a he.
f.6) Crap receipt didn't print, stand in line, deal with the clerk
g) Go home, and never actually enjoy the security of a full tank. Car drives like crap anyway.
h) Open garage door again, remember to turn the car off again . .. .

Here is how to charge a Tesla,
Glide home in my space machine, plug in ~ 5 seconds.

So yes, you should totally get a BMW.

 

[houdini]

I think the first real competition will be the Jaguar I-Pace. It is being spruiked as a Model X competitor and supposedly around the same price. The interior looks amazing, high tech, premium materials, futuristic, lots of the screen type tech of the Tesla's and is made by a manufacturer with some prior experience in high quality interiors.

 

[alevek]

I've enjoyed my 2014 P85D immensely and overlooked the lack of amenities for the superior driving experience of an EV. However, for my EV SUV I'n not considering the Model X, I'll be waiting for the Jaguar IPace, Audi ETron, or Mercedes EQ.

 

[henderrj]

Mt Rainier -> I have enough range for that, but I generally go to MuckleShoot casino afterwards anyway, which has a free J1772. It's slow, but casinos are slower .
Olympic National Park -> SilverDale or Bremerton Chademo

So the first is a non-issue. The second is. You need about 90 minutes there total on the way there+back from Redmond, and it's real waiting time - those chargers aren't exactly located next to a Ruth's Chris. But it's maybe a once-a-year trip, so that's 90 minutes/year.

And it sucks, but it sucks more spending 6 hours a year driving to gas stations and filling up - which is what I used to do. I can do quite a few SuperCharging/Chademo stops in that time.

For the Olympic National Park on the south end there is the Aberdeen supercharger.

I owned an older S-Class that I did love. And there are indeed more Creature Comforts even in that than there is in the current model S. But I wouldn't trade my Model S for a brand new S-class. The trade offs turn me off!

And, like many his said, charging is a non-issue! I did a 3500 mile trip and that's about the only time I used Superchargers. And it was absolutely no problem on that trip.