Tesla has a monopoly. Best to wait?

[gowthamn]

I was expecting a couple of genuine replies and a few fanboy replies and that's it. The thread has gone MUCH longer than I thought.

I think I learnt the following:

• Don't buy a Tesla if interior quality is important
• Buy a Tesla if instant torque is important and if environment is important
• Buy a Tesla if you want the most technologically advanced car (Autopilot).

Moderators can close this thread if possible?

 

[pedriscoll]

Gothamn,

I think you may also have learned how passionate Tesla owners are about these cars.

If you want interior quality equivalent to a S Class Mercedes or 7 Series BMW, no Tesla does not have that. With Tesla you are paying for the high performance drive units and battery, as well as the advanced software. You also get over the air software updates. The German auto makers don't offer that yet. My nearly 2 year old Model S is like a new car after each update.

The instant torque is a game changer. I know I can beat 99.9% of the other cars out there off the line, and pass any time I need to. I like not spewing exhaust gases into the environment, dealing with gas fumes at a gas station, etc.

Even in its current state Autopilot is far superior to anything the Germans have on the road.

If you must have the European level interior luxury then you should be prepared to wait for at least 5 years. The other manufacturers will have the same cost issues as Tesla in delivering an expensive advanced electric drive train and at the same time producing a luxury interior. Tesla is also years ahead on the high speed charging infrastructure.

 

[zambono]

40 minutes is too long. And super chargers are not there everywhere. Other chargers are much slower.

I am with you and I have a 90D. The 300 miles of range is good, but if supercharger charging can be lowered to 20 minutes that is the nail in the coffin for ICE. The 40+ minutes if you only have to do it once in a trip is passable, but if you have to charge twice that is way too much wasted time. My trips are on average an hour longer on the S because of current supercharging speeds.

 

[ecarfan]

Don't buy a Tesla if interior quality is important

Interior quality is important to me. But "quality" is a subjective term. I am very happy with the interior quality of my S. At one point in the past I owned a Lexus LS400 and a Porsche Cayman, if that means anything to you.

If you think that having nicer leather and ventilated seats and a butt massager or whatever other stuff you can get in a Mercedes S class is more important than all the other Tesla advantages many owners have listed in this thread, than that is your decision and you are welcome to it.

Threads rarely get "closed" on TMC. This thread will keep going if people choose to make more posts.

 

[daniel]

... The 300 miles of range is good, but if supercharger charging can be lowered to 20 minutes that is the nail in the coffin for ICE. ...

Unfortunately, superchargers need to be far more ubiquitous than they are, for a mere reduction in charging time to kill the ICE car. I take one long road trip per year, and it's on secondary roads where superchargers are unlikely to make an appearance for quite some time to come. There's no scheduled air service and a bus would turn the 6-hour drive into a two-day trip. Stopping at an RV park to charge would turn the 6-hour drive into a ten-hour drive. So I need to keep the Prius for just that one trip per year. There's a gas station in every tiny town along the way, but no superchargers.

 

[oktane]

I'd be happy if the Model S had the interior quality, road noise, or build quality of my friend's Acura TLX ($32,000 car) but it doesn't. Sorry not even the same league, and the Acura sucks compared to luxury cars but is a good value car. Tesla definitely needs to improve in these areas to remain competitive when competition enters the marketplace (2 years).

 

[zambono]

Unfortunately, superchargers need to be far more ubiquitous than they are, for a mere reduction in charging time to kill the ICE car. I take one long road trip per year, and it's on secondary roads where superchargers are unlikely to make an appearance for quite some time to come. There's no scheduled air service and a bus would turn the 6-hour drive into a two-day trip. Stopping at an RV park to charge would turn the 6-hour drive into a ten-hour drive. So I need to keep the Prius for just that one trip per year. There's a gas station in every tiny town along the way, but no superchargers.

There must be a supercharger within 280 miles of your destination? Once there you can charge overnight somewhere, a friends dryer plug at the very least. plugshare can help with that. But yeah much quicker charging and more of them wherever needed, but I do think the plan is for there to be a supercharger within 100 miles of another. Thats what it seems by looking at the map.

 

[brkaus]

Unfortunately, superchargers need to be far more ubiquitous than they are, for a mere reduction in charging time to kill the ICE car. I take one long road trip per year, and it's on secondary roads where superchargers are unlikely to make an appearance for quite some time to come. There's no scheduled air service and a bus would turn the 6-hour drive into a two-day trip. Stopping at an RV park to charge would turn the 6-hour drive into a ten-hour drive. So I need to keep the Prius for just that one trip per year. There's a gas station in every tiny town along the way, but no superchargers.

It is typically less expensive to rent a car for that once a year trip than it is to keep an extra car around. Prior to the Tesla, I frequently would rent a car for trips - to get something a bit larger and more reliable.

 

[daniel]

There must be a supercharger within 280 miles of your destination? Once there you can charge overnight somewhere, a friends dryer plug at the very least. plugshare can help with that. But yeah much quicker charging and more of them wherever needed, but I do think the plan is for there to be a supercharger within 100 miles of another. Thats what it seems by looking at the map.

There is no supercharger anywhere on either of my two major routes. And the one-way drive is farther than any existing electric car will go on a charge. A P100D might make it if I drive the whole way at 35 mph. But that has the same problem as stopping at an RV park along the way and charging at 9 kW. Along each route there is only one town large enough that there might conceivably be a supercharger in a decade. Without one at each of those two towns, or a car with a 400 mile range at highway speed, an EV turns a 6-hour drive into a 10-hour trip.

There are superchargers along the Trans-Canada Highway, but both my destinations are on that highway, so if I reach the chargers I've already reached my destination. Slow-charging while there could probably be arranged, since once there I'm off hiking for a week or two at a time.

The Tesla supercharger network makes long-distance driving practical, only along the major highways. But I never drive long distances if I can fly instead. So I'm in the position of having to keep my stinker for that one long trip per year. I also use it for hauling recycling to the recycling center, and for hauling my tires to and from the tire place, but once I get my Model 3 I won't need the stinker for that. Just the hiking trip.

The sad fact is that it will take time to build the infrastructure to make EVs truly as convenient as stinkers.

 

[daniel]

It is typically less expensive to rent a car for that once a year trip than it is to keep an extra car around. Prior to the Tesla, I frequently would rent a car for trips - to get something a bit larger and more reliable.

That would be true if I was comparing to buying a new car. But my 2004 Prius costs me about $40 a year for the oil change, and my annual hiking trip is six weeks long. Renting a car for that length of time would likely be more expensive than keeping the Prius, which is reliable, and larger than I need.

Once I have the Model 3, and no longer need the Prius for recycling or tire hauling, I'm going to look into the cost of hiring a car and driver for the hiking trips. Having someone else drive (I dislike driving long distance) might throw the equation the other way. But I'd still be burning gasoline. I'd much rather make the trip on electric, but the infrastructure does not yet exist for that.

 

[thx1139]

Worst car I ever had was a Mercedes. Twice within first 2 years just died while driving. Handles on rear folding seats pop off. Not to mention the most expensive car to maintain that we have ever owned. Never again.

 

[brkaus]

That would be true if I was comparing to buying a new car. But my 2004 Prius costs me about $40 a year for the oil change, and my annual hiking trip is six weeks long. Renting a car for that length of time would likely be more expensive than keeping the Prius, which is reliable, and larger than I need.

Once I have the Model 3, and no longer need the Prius for recycling or tire hauling, I'm going to look into the cost of hiring a car and driver for the hiking trips. Having someone else drive (I dislike driving long distance) might throw the equation the other way. But I'd still be burning gasoline. I'd much rather make the trip on electric, but the infrastructure does not yet exist for that.

True. Don't forget insurance, registration, etc. But a 6 week trip does change the balance significantly. Especially if it is mostly with the car parked and thus not saving miles and wear and tear on personal car.

 

[roblab]

I am with you and I have a 90D. The 300 miles of range is good, but if supercharger charging can be lowered to 20 minutes that is the nail in the coffin for ICE. The 40+ minutes if you only have to do it once in a trip is passable, but if you have to charge twice that is way too much wasted time. My trips are on average an hour longer on the S because of current supercharging speeds.

Nothing personal, but it interests me how people will actually choose to work an hour's drive from home, and spend ten hours a week getting to and from work, and complain about charging maybe once a month, that might take twenty minutes while they take a bathroom break and get a drink of coffee. Or they will choose to sit up past midnight watching Jimmy Fallon or SNL, complete with commercials, and then moan because Tesla made them waste their time.

Learn to read. Then take a book with you. When you are waiting for the car to get enough charge to make it to the next charger, read the book. Or even better, get out of the car and take a walk. Do not walk over to the Burger Shack, but go a half mile up the road, and back. Breathe deeply and ponder how clouds are formed. Look at the tiny flowers growing under your feet. Get back in car refreshed, with your blood pumping up your legs instead of pooling, making clots that will break loose and kill you. Now, there's a choice!

 

[boonedocks]

To the OP:

I would definitely Wait ....wait....wait.....I can guarantee you that what you want will be available tomorrow...tomorrow...tomorrow....or better yet "SOON" j/k

 

[jmanning]

With that kind of $$$ buy what you want and what fits your needs. Tesla is an unbelievable car with many positives, especially considering how young of a company it is. If you want to buy an electric car Tesla is the way to go. If you want to buy an ICE, "engine" vehicle than I just ask you buy one that is most fuel efficient for the planet and future generations......good luck with your purchase.

 

[jdhcon]

My wife previously drove a Lexus RX-450h before getting her 2017 S90D. I currently drive a 2014 Mercedes E550 and my daughter has an 2015 Acura TLX. To be honest, I don't think the Tesla interior quality is any worse than our other cars. The ultra white premium seats look and feel luxurious. Driving it feels like a luxury car, and certainly NOTHING can match the grin you make when you floor the accelerator!

 

[Kurt'sX]

Mercedes B Class. Get it now! Tesla drive train Mercedes body & interior. B-Class Electric Drive | Mercedes-Benz

87 mile range on full charge....Hmmmmm.......not exactly a competitor for Tesla!

 

[iqless]

• Buy a Tesla if instant torque is important and if environment is important

Lol. The environment IS important, there are no IFs about it. The only if is whether you want to be a part of a thing that does something about it or you'd rather have nice interiors. For me, that is not even a question.

 

[AndrewTX]

There is no supercharger anywhere on either of my two major routes. And the one-way drive is farther than any existing electric car will go on a charge. A P100D might make it if I drive the whole way at 35 mph. But that has the same problem as stopping at an RV park along the way and charging at 9 kW. Along each route there is only one town large enough that there might conceivably be a supercharger in a decade. Without one at each of those two towns, or a car with a 400 mile range at highway speed, an EV turns a 6-hour drive into a 10-hour trip.

There are superchargers along the Trans-Canada Highway, but both my destinations are on that highway, so if I reach the chargers I've already reached my destination. Slow-charging while there could probably be arranged, since once there I'm off hiking for a week or two at a time.

The Tesla supercharger network makes long-distance driving practical, only along the major highways. But I never drive long distances if I can fly instead. So I'm in the position of having to keep my stinker for that one long trip per year. I also use it for hauling recycling to the recycling center, and for hauling my tires to and from the tire place, but once I get my Model 3 I won't need the stinker for that. Just the hiking trip.

The sad fact is that it will take time to build the infrastructure to make EVs truly as convenient as stinkers.

That's true. It did take the oil industry more than 100 years to build out the ICE fueling infrastructure available today. It'll take some time to catch up.

I do think that eventually we'll see gas stations install fast charging facilities to serve BEVs. These stations make the vast majority of their profits from food/beverage sales rather than gasoline sales even today. Just a matter of time before the critical mass of BEVs gets them to start catering to that market.

 

[daniel]

.. NOTHING can match the grin you make when you floor the accelerator!

Heck, even my little abysmally-underpowered Zap Xebra put a grin on my face every time I drove it. The Tesla is even better. (Though I still miss that little rattle-trap.)

That's true. It did take the oil industry more than 100 years to build out the ICE fueling infrastructure available today. It'll take some time to catch up.

I do think that eventually we'll see gas stations install fast charging facilities to serve BEVs. These stations make the vast majority of their profits from food/beverage sales rather than gasoline sales even today. Just a matter of time before the critical mass of BEVs gets them to start catering to that market.

Yep. Just a matter of time. The more EVs are on the road, the more incentive they'll have to install chargers. 20 to 30 minutes would be ideal to hit the restroom, stretch the legs, eat a sandwich. But 3 to 4 hours at an RV park is too much for me. Note also, they they need to have enough chargers, or a reservation system, so we don't need to wait half an hour to get that 30-minute charge. It's coming, but I don't really expect to see it on my secondary roads before I'm too old to visit those hiking lodges, and after that I won't need it any more. I'll just be making short trips in my self-driving Tesla if I live another 10 or 12 years.