Couldn't agree more. Perhaps we can keep the political discussion out of this forum and instead focus on that which brings us together, the wonders of Tesla!
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Tesla in Australia
- Thread starter PeterW
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- Australia New Zealand
Couldn't agree more. Perhaps we can keep the political discussion out of this forum and instead focus on that which brings us together, the wonders of Tesla!
As an Australian working in Hong Kong I can tell the doubters that Australian internet is an embarrassing joke. Download limits!?!? NBN cancelled!? Beyond belief! That, and the "Australia Tax" that seems to make OZ so expensive, is one reason why we are still here. As for Tesla, Australia needs a more progressive green attitude in govt, and I hope the amazing capability of the Model S gets peoples attention.
Oh, that's a good idea: If I can afford my Sig I'm going to offer my representatives (Abbott is my federal rep and the treasurer of NSW is my state) a ride in the car. With any luck it could help other Australian's get some incentives for electric cars!
Wait a minute. I just read this in another part of the forum:
We arrived in Tilburg a few minutes earlier than expected. If we had known that there was only one cab waiting at the taxi rank we wouldn’t have filmed the train station from different angles. Still it all went well and our taxi ride took around 15 minutes.
You could immediately see that the Tesla area was huge. I thought the area in Vienna was extensive, but Tilburg was easily ten times bigger. Not surprisingly really, considering that all cars ordered in Europe have to go through this location as we were told later on. Cars are shipped from the States in three parts and assembled in Tilburg. Why? Tax advantages because of spare part deliveries.
So it's not without precedent to "avoid" some tax implications by not shipping a complete car.........
Certainly, but Tilburg handles European final assembly. In terms of volume, Australia won't even be close, so there is no point in them investing in facilities here at this time.
Sorry my point was that they have created a situation where there are tax benefits to assembling the vehicles after they've been shipped from overseas. This is relevant to us if we want to bring in a 5kw version and then "upgrade" to a 60 or 85 in Country and thereby pay less on the purchase price for the initial purchase.
I agreed, but my point was that it is not financially viable for them to do that due to a lack of volume in Australia.
gizmonty
Member
Looking into the issue of customs duty, someone suggested to me that it is not applicable to cars of US origin due to the free trade agreement. I had a look at it (http://www.customs.gov.au/webdata/resources/files/PS200913-ig-AUSFTA.pdf) and found the following (page 7).
1.7. Certain US originating passenger motor vehicle goods have phasing rates of customs duty
imposed. The rates are 8% (2005), 6.5% (2006), 5% (2007), 3% (2008), 1.5% (2009)
and Free (2010).
Am I getting too excited about this or does it mean we can take a few thousand off 772's calculations? Also, as LCT is a tax on this tax in part, it will feed through to a reduction in LCT as well.
I also note that that AUD is climbing (91.4c today) and various market observers are calling a short term breakout to 94-95c or higher (parity?) in the near future.
Maybe things aren't as bad as I thought, or maybe it's just a nice day here today and I'm in a good mood.
What I need is a test drive in a nice fast electric car to keep my mind off these things. Can anyone help me? Cary? Stone? anyone? Bueller?
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Here are 772's calculations redone if I am right. Unfortunately I noticed that 772 had used 30% as the LCT rate when it is actually 33% so his estimates are actually a few hundred dollars short.
60 kWh Model S = 69,900 + 1,170 USD = 71,070 USD * 1.09724 AUD/USD = 77,978 AUD = Customs Value (CV)
Shipping + Insurance = 4,000 AUD
VoTI = 77,978 + 4,000 = 81,978 AUD
GST = VoTI*0.10 = 8,198 AUD
LCV = VoTI + GST = 90,176 AUD
LCT = (90,176 - 75,375)*0.3 = 4,884 AUD
Total price (LCV+LCT): 95,060 AUD
and if the AUD hits 94c.
60 kWh Model S = 69,900 + 1,170 USD = 71,070 USD * 1.06382 AUD/USD = 75606 AUD = Customs Value (CV)
Shipping + Insurance = 4,000 AUD
VoTI = 75606 + 4,000 = 79606 AUD
GST = VoTI*0.10 = 7961 AUD
LCV = VoTI + GST = 87567 AUD
LCT = (87567 - 75,375)*0.3 = 4,023 AUD
Total price (LCV+LCT): 91,590 AUD
That's almost $5500 less if I'm right about customs duty, and another $3500 if the currency does what some are predicting over the next couple of months.
If I run the numbers for fully loaded I get $195,553 at 772's exchange rate and $189,017 at 94c.
Just wishful thinking?
1.7. Certain US originating passenger motor vehicle goods have phasing rates of customs duty
imposed. The rates are 8% (2005), 6.5% (2006), 5% (2007), 3% (2008), 1.5% (2009)
and Free (2010).
Am I getting too excited about this or does it mean we can take a few thousand off 772's calculations? Also, as LCT is a tax on this tax in part, it will feed through to a reduction in LCT as well.
I also note that that AUD is climbing (91.4c today) and various market observers are calling a short term breakout to 94-95c or higher (parity?) in the near future.
Maybe things aren't as bad as I thought, or maybe it's just a nice day here today and I'm in a good mood.
What I need is a test drive in a nice fast electric car to keep my mind off these things. Can anyone help me? Cary? Stone? anyone? Bueller?
- - - Updated - - -
Here are 772's calculations redone if I am right. Unfortunately I noticed that 772 had used 30% as the LCT rate when it is actually 33% so his estimates are actually a few hundred dollars short.
60 kWh Model S = 69,900 + 1,170 USD = 71,070 USD * 1.09724 AUD/USD = 77,978 AUD = Customs Value (CV)
Shipping + Insurance = 4,000 AUD
VoTI = 77,978 + 4,000 = 81,978 AUD
GST = VoTI*0.10 = 8,198 AUD
LCV = VoTI + GST = 90,176 AUD
LCT = (90,176 - 75,375)*0.3 = 4,884 AUD
Total price (LCV+LCT): 95,060 AUD
and if the AUD hits 94c.
60 kWh Model S = 69,900 + 1,170 USD = 71,070 USD * 1.06382 AUD/USD = 75606 AUD = Customs Value (CV)
Shipping + Insurance = 4,000 AUD
VoTI = 75606 + 4,000 = 79606 AUD
GST = VoTI*0.10 = 7961 AUD
LCV = VoTI + GST = 87567 AUD
LCT = (87567 - 75,375)*0.3 = 4,023 AUD
Total price (LCV+LCT): 91,590 AUD
That's almost $5500 less if I'm right about customs duty, and another $3500 if the currency does what some are predicting over the next couple of months.
If I run the numbers for fully loaded I get $195,553 at 772's exchange rate and $189,017 at 94c.
Just wishful thinking?
Those are very close to the numbers I'd come up with as well, here's hoping! If I can get a 60 kWh Model S with a few options (metallic paint, tech package, pano roof, parking sensors) for under six figures, I'd be extremely happy.
Dborn
Confirmed
What are "certain motor vehicle goods". Entire cars or just components thereof or accessories? How to get a ruling from customs?
I don't really know why people were expecting they'd be cheap here, compared with other luxury cars. Sure, the US list price for the 60 kWh model is just shy of USD$70k. But there, that price can get you a BMW ActiveHybrid 5 with plenty of options - the same car retails for over $130k here. If anything, on current projected pricing, the Model S is quite a bit more competitive here.
I think there is a lack of brand awareness, once people start getting them and become tesla ambassadors, it'll get much easier.
Also, The distances driven in Aus are very low. For example if I was still living in Canberra, I'd probably get a 60kWh, because you're really not gonna drive more than 300km in a day. Even if you're going to Sydney, you could probably just make it (JMac I remember you mentioning that you made it in a roadster?),
This on top of the fact that electricity and solar is significantly cheaper than petrol. Here in the states Gas is like $4 a gallon, and everyone is complaining, power is around 9-10c/kWh, but with Solar in Aus, compared to $1.80 per litre, using a Tesla for a daily commute makes a lot of sense.
This, The Model S is competing with Audi A7 and BMW 6 series. So you have to realise its not actually that much more/less than their competitors
Good to know that there isn't an import duty on American cars... as for the 33% vs 30%, the LCT rate is indeed 33%, but it is only payable on the non-GST portion of the LCV. Thus the additional 10/11 factor, which effectively brings the rate to 30%. I skipped that step for simplicity's sake :tongue:
Working out the LCT on an import | Australian Taxation Office
I wouldn't say it was expecting them to be cheap but rather "in competition". Because it's relative. Forgetting the RRP as it's a fiction the actual prices of the competition are:
1. Nissan Leaf $36,000 ish for a demo and $38,000 ish for a new one
2. Holden Volt I've seen as low as $39990 for a 100km demo and $47,000 drive away for a brand new one.
3. The i-miEV are about $27,000.
So at $100,000 the Model S is kinda triple the price of the EV competition. It is a great car with lots of advantages but we don't have superchargers here for free power which limits the long trips a bit. We don't have the charging infrastructure at all so those videos of people driving all over Europe and the US charging as they go are just teasing me endlessly.
So does that make the S a local EV? A premium one for sure but is it worth triple? When you can get a Lexus hybrid for the same sort of money?
Of course - but I argue that, adjusted for the Australia tax, the ratios are pretty much equal. The Leaf, for example, is around $28k in the US before tax credits, approximately 40% the base Model S RRP. Here, it's close to $40k - which is also approximately 40% the cost of a 60 kWh S, if the current predictions bandied around prove correct. Clearly they are not in direct competition - just as a Toyota and Merc may both be ICE cars, but they aren't competing either. Clearly the Model S won't be a mass-market-appeal kind of vehicle, here just as it isn't in the USA, but you're paying a premium for jumping onto a technology still in its infancy, with the hope of supporting future models that bring longer-range EVs to the masses.
Dborn
Confirmed
Following meeting with Stone, we should still get our cars at about the same time as HK. Sigs will be approx same price as a similarly configured production. The web site is more complicated than other jurisdictions so that is what is taking time, but he expects it to be up in early April. All current colours will be available as sigs. The tan leather is a lot lighter than on the web and has a very slight greyish tint. It is more beige than tan. The brown is darker than I expected and the green and blue are nearly black. ( indoors and overcast day). Early reservation holders should get the relief from the first price rise as promised and possibly the second one but no promises.
Interesting, I'm guessing this is probably due to the variation in stamp duty between states. Thanks for the info!
