Tesla Model 3 - Cruise Control Software Issue - but its BETA!!!

[hertfordroad]

I have just bought a new Tesla Model 3 (the overall experience was poor from initial communications from Tesla, through to multiple delivery mistakes and mishaps).

But most disconcertingly, on the second day of owning the vehicle surged forward from standstill and hit a gate. It transpires that the gear stick may have been pressed twice when attempting to put into drive (from standstill), engaging the cruise/autopilot and the car didn't spot the gate as the area wasn't marked in their software and the gate had gaps in it.

Tesla were really slow to investigate, and said that autopilot was only a BETA, but this raise a number of questions for me:

1) Why the cruise/autopilot would engage from standstill as this seems rather dangerous? It seems a bit sporadic from standstill sometimes engaging and sometimes not (when I have tested)

2) How Tesla can claim its only a BETA when never communicating this to me during the order and delivery process. (And get the car approved for use on UK roads on this basis)

3) Putting the cruise control / autopilot on the gear stick seems like a design flaw (both because its easy to press after putting into drive and engage the autopilot) and because anyone with their previous car having windscreen wipers on this stick could also accidentally engage it (from habit)

Again, Tesla came back and said the autopilot didn't spot the gate (as it had gaps in it), but the autopilot is only a BETA.....

I have no idea what they meant by their messaging nor have I had any response since further enquiries....

Welcome anyone's thoughts on this issue and ideas as to how I escalate within Tesla

 

[KetchupKilla]

Sorry that this happened. A good rule of thumb is to press and hold the break while putting it into drive. I could see hitting the gear stalk twice causing it. I use a pin and I know I have to wait about 2 seconds to put it in drive before it will accept it. Sometimes I hit he gear stalk it will do nothing so I wait one second and hit it again. Just make sure you don't hit the gear stalk twice in rapid succession.

There are plenty of people who had bad experiences with Tesla communication, and there are plenty who had a great time. It's not like a dealership so its definitely a bit harder. I for one didn't really have any issues. They communicated with me through emails and if I have a service question I just set up a service appointment and put my questions in the fields. I get a call back and they answer my questions and remove my appointment if I don't need it. I find it a lot easier than calling a dealership, getting transferred, waiting a minute asking my questions and see what they tell me. This could be my age group (35) being antisocial and what not.

As for beta, it does clearly state that on the screen. I know not everyone reads everything and I'm not here to blame you like most will. I was told to download the app before I bought the car and watch the videos to familiarize myself with the car before delivery, which I did. I also knew from research that autopilot was beta and it's limitations. I've accidently hit TACC before while slowing down and the car speed up. Kind of scary, but I am a defensive driver so I always keep plenty of distance and I don't speed. If it says 60 I go no more than 65, but usually 61 is where I usually keep it.

Hopefully you don't have too much damage and make sure to read the manual. It is a car but it is tech centered and not like every other car out there.

 

[WarpedOne]

Return your driving license, sooner the better.

 

[mongo]

1) Why the cruise/autopilot would engage from standstill as this seems rather dangerous? It seems a bit sporadic from standstill sometimes engaging and sometimes not (when I have tested)

It transpires that the gear stick may have been pressed twice when attempting to put into drive (from standstill),

1) It won't (when starting from park)

When Model 3 is in Park, you must press the brake to shift to another gear.

Note: To initiate Autosteer when there is no vehicle in front of you, you must be driving at least 18 mph (30 km/h) on a roadway with visible lane markings. If a vehicle is detected ahead of you, you can initiate Autosteer at any speed, even when stationary (if you are at least 5 feet (150 cm) away from the vehicle).

2) How Tesla can claim its only a BETA when never communicating this to me during the order and delivery process. (And get the car approved for use on UK roads on this basis)

2) Read the manual, or the screen
Order page:

The currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous.

Manual:

Before you can operate Autosteer, you must enable it by touching Controls > Autopilot > Autosteer (Beta) > ON.

3) Putting the cruise control / autopilot on the gear stick seems like a design flaw (both because its easy to press after putting into drive and engage the autopilot) and because anyone with their previous car having windscreen wipers on this stick could also accidentally engage it (from habit)

3) Time for a new habit/ more practice
See also 1)

 

[stevegu]

Oddly, with my car (LR AWD, 2019), it will not shift out of "Park" without my foot firmly on the brake, and it displays a warning should one attempt otherwise.

 

[KetchupKilla]

I found the best way to try to escalate is

Oddly, with my car (LR AWD, 2019), it will not shift out of "Park" without my foot firmly on the brake, and it displays a warning should one attempt otherwise.

Honestly I never thought of trying without my foot on the brake. Good to know though.

 

[mswlogo]

If I recall. When you do turn on Beta Auto Pilot it puts a big agreement page that you have to accept for the switch to turn on.

Even though it’s quick and convenient with TACC on the Gear Selector I think it is somewhat dangerous. And yeah I’ve hit it thinking it’s wipers forgetting which Car I’m in.

In Model X it’s in a clunky spot. But it’s always very deliberate. And I have had VW’s put the cruise in the same spot.

 

[stevegu]

I found the best way to try to escalate is


Honestly I never thought of trying without my foot on the brake. Good to know though.

Well, I didn't really "try" it, it just happened... (stopped at curb to pick up the mail, thought it was still in "D" but in "hold" mode.)

 

[Knightshade]

What OP describes, in the order he describes it, is literally impossible.

Car won't shift out of park unless foot is on brake- and car won't go into TACC if foot is on brake.



It's possible the OP really did hit a gate (got any pics of the gate, location, or damaged car BTW? Be interesting to see the "gaps" you're talking about and how far you were from it that somehow cameras, ultrasonics, and radar all missed it)... but not in the order of operation described.

 

[sduck]

~sigh~ another 1 post user reporting unexpected damage from autopilot who clearly doesn't know what they are doing. And now 6 pages of meaningless diatribe will ensue about it. Did the brakes not work also? Too many holes in the story for me to believe it, sorry.

 

[focher]

~sigh~ another 1 post user reporting unexpected damage from autopilot who clearly doesn't know what they are doing. And now 6 pages of meaningless diatribe will ensue about it. Did the brakes not work also? Too many holes in the story for me to believe it, sorry.

Don't forget the whinging about people being PC or not.

 

[hertfordroad]

What OP describes, in the order he describes it, is literally impossible.

Car won't shift out of park unless foot is on brake- and car won't go into TACC if foot is on brake.



It's possible the OP really did hit a gate (got any pics of the gate, location, or damaged car BTW? Be interesting to see the "gaps" you're talking about and how far you were from it that somehow cameras, ultrasonics, and radar all missed it)... but not in the order of operation described.

Thanks for the note, Tesla's response was as follows:

"Remote diagnosis for your Tesla is now complete. Our Technicians have found that the autopilot system is showing it is being activated by the driver, the vehicle is picking up the environment and believes it can navigate this section of the road, however the Autopilot system is still in beta and is being continually updated and improved, and things like this should become more and more rare as time goes on. If this fault becomes more prominent and consistent then please reschedule the booking and we can continue with a more in depth diagnosis, as appropriate, and have determined that an appointment is not necessary. Should the situation reoccur, please reply to this text message."

The gate is a wrought iron one with large gaps in it so possible the car did not detect it.

What I was really trying to understand is how the autopilot can be accidentally engaged from standstill. I have tried to re-create the scenario and the car just brought up a message saying it can't be engaged at this speed.

Car wasn't damaged bar a very small (almost not noticeable) dent on the bottom of the spoiler and gate wasn't damaged beyond a broken drive bracket, so no major issues form this perspective - just trying to prevent re-occurrence

 

[hertfordroad]

Sorry that this happened. A good rule of thumb is to press and hold the break while putting it into drive. I could see hitting the gear stalk twice causing it. I use a pin and I know I have to wait about 2 seconds to put it in drive before it will accept it. Sometimes I hit he gear stalk it will do nothing so I wait one second and hit it again. Just make sure you don't hit the gear stalk twice in rapid succession.

There are plenty of people who had bad experiences with Tesla communication, and there are plenty who had a great time. It's not like a dealership so its definitely a bit harder. I for one didn't really have any issues. They communicated with me through emails and if I have a service question I just set up a service appointment and put my questions in the fields. I get a call back and they answer my questions and remove my appointment if I don't need it. I find it a lot easier than calling a dealership, getting transferred, waiting a minute asking my questions and see what they tell me. This could be my age group (35) being antisocial and what not.

As for beta, it does clearly state that on the screen. I know not everyone reads everything and I'm not here to blame you like most will. I was told to download the app before I bought the car and watch the videos to familiarize myself with the car before delivery, which I did. I also knew from research that autopilot was beta and it's limitations. I've accidently hit TACC before while slowing down and the car speed up. Kind of scary, but I am a defensive driver so I always keep plenty of distance and I don't speed. If it says 60 I go no more than 65, but usually 61 is where I usually keep it.

Hopefully you don't have too much damage and make sure to read the manual. It is a car but it is tech centered and not like every other car out there.

Thanks for your note and help - appreciated! This was the note form Tesla. All I am trying to do is prevent re-occurrence:

"remote diagnosis for your Tesla is now complete. Our Technicians have found that the autopilot system is showing it is being activated by the driver, the vehicle is picking up the environment and believes it can navigate this section of the road, however the Autopilot system is still in beta and is being continually updated and improved, and things like this should become more and more rare as time goes on. If this fault becomes more prominent and consistent then please reschedule the booking and we can continue with a more in depth diagnosis, as appropriate, and have determined that an appointment is not necessary. Should the situation reoccur, please reply to this text message."

 

[hertfordroad]

1) It won't (when starting from park)




2) Read the manual, or the screen
Order page:
Manual:



3) Time for a new habit/ more practice
See also 1)

Thanks for taking the time to reply - appreciated! What I am trying to do is prevent re-occurrence. This is what Tesla's engineers said:

remote diagnosis for your Tesla is now complete. Our Technicians have found that the autopilot system is showing it is being activated by the driver, the vehicle is picking up the environment and believes it can navigate this section of the road, however the Autopilot system is still in beta and is being continually updated and improved, and things like this should become more and more rare as time goes on. If this fault becomes more prominent and consistent then please reschedule the booking and we can continue with a more in depth diagnosis, as appropriate, and have determined that an appointment is not necessary. Should the situation reoccur, please reply to this text message.

 

[DopeGhoti]

Was it really necessary to say the same thing thrice in three separate posts? That said, AP cannot, as was earlier stated, be activated with the foot on the brake. And the car cannot be taken out of Park without a foot on the brake. So what actually happened?

 

[Knightshade]

Was it really necessary to say the same thing thrice in three separate posts? That said, AP cannot, as was earlier stated, be activated with the foot on the brake. And the car cannot be taken out of Park without a foot on the brake. So what actually happened?

This.


So what must have happened was this:

1) The car was already in drive (I'd guess in hold mode)- because AP can't activate while in park.
2) You did not have your foot on the brake (because AP can't activate with your foot on the brake)
3) You pushed the stalk down twice to activate AP (I'm unclear on why- if you mistakenly thought you were in park only 1 time would be needed, though you'd have had to have been pressing the brake which the actual events show you weren't)



Back to my earlier question though- do you have any pictures of the location where this happened? Ideally including the road/lane markings if any and the gate- plus the car damage?

 

[TLLMRRJ]

They do still rather like doing everything in triplicate in the UK, for good measure of course.

 

[thewishmaster]

The most you can do is shift to drive, let go of the brake pedal, keep the car in hold mode by not touching any pedal, and then if the car thinks that there is something car-like in front of you, you can engage TACC from a standstill. I've done this by accident after swiping the stalk down instead of just pressing the accelerator. In my case I was parallel-parked at a curb and there was a car a few spots ahead, letting me engage TACC. Don't know what the situation was in OP's case, but if they forgot that they were in Drive already after letting go of the brake pedal and swiped down again, this *could* happen, but hard to tell without trying to replicate.

 

[hertfordroad]

This.
As requested, I have attached an image of the gate and the small marks on the lower spoiler from hitting the gate

What would be really helpful to understand is how to prevent this happening again. If I turn off autopilot will it ever be possible to engage cruise control from standstill like this?

thanks for your help



So what must have happened was this:

1) The car was already in drive (I'd guess in hold mode)- because AP can't activate while in park.
2) You did not have your foot on the brake (because AP can't activate with your foot on the brake)
3) You pushed the stalk down twice to activate AP (I'm unclear on why- if you mistakenly thought you were in park only 1 time would be needed, though you'd have had to have been pressing the brake which the actual events show you weren't)



Back to my earlier question though- do you have any pictures of the location where this happened? Ideally including the road/lane markings if any and the gate- plus the car damage?

 

[SlimJim]

The most you can do is shift to drive, let go of the brake pedal, keep the car in hold mode by not touching any pedal, and then if the car thinks that there is something car-like in front of you, you can engage TACC from a standstill. I've done this by accident after swiping the stalk down instead of just pressing the accelerator. In my case I was parallel-parked at a curb and there was a car a few spots ahead, letting me engage TACC. Don't know what the situation was in OP's case, but if they forgot that they were in Drive already after letting go of the brake pedal and swiped down again, this *could* happen, but hard to tell without trying to replicate.

This is the likely scenario.
Tesla is very convenient for me thanks to auto hold and one pedal driving but it is a very different system. So if the user is still not completely used to the system, mistakes can happen and it may result in an accident.