Tesla Model 3 vs. Honda Accord Hybrid

[Gamsberry]

Those are two totally different cars and I know because my car prior to my current model 3 was the Accord Hybrid. It's a great car but I would try to go EV is you can. Get the LR, even if it means buying used. I can also speak to the current Honda driver assist features because my wife has a brand new CR-V Touring hybrid and I'm assuming it's the same system as what's on the Accord. It's pretty nice but it doesn't hold a candle to Tesla Autopilot. The LKAS (Lane Keeping Assist System) won't change lanes for you, which I assume you drive in fairly heavy traffic is a must. It is also extremely finicky about keeping your hands on the wheel at all times and will shut down in just around 10 seconds if you don't. Their version of (automatic cruise control) ACC is on par with Tesla's TACC though.

I had a 2018 Accord hybrid. It was the first vehicle I'd owned with TACC & LCAS. Averaged 47mpg on summer fuel. I loved that car. the comfort, tech & economy reset the bar for what I would own. It wasn't a "fun" car to drive but as a transportation appliance it's hard to beat.

I traded it for a model 3 awd. It changed everything. The performance is stunning - 1.5 years later it's still as much fun to get into as it was the first day. Autopilot has it's quirks as does many of the cars features but the benefits far outweigh the negatives. By my rough math on actuals fuel cost was only a slight advantage to the tesla if only supercharging but about 60% less for home charging.

I thought the minimalist interior & loss of the honda hud would bother me. Within a day it seemed normal & now I can't imagine going back.

 

[beachsideev]

I would follow all of the advice given so far to rent a 3 from Turo (oldest SR+ you can find, for the worst case example). I would further suggest that before you do your test run, charge or drain the battery to 90% and select your destination using the in-car navigation. At the bottom of the route listing will be an estimate of the battery's capacity if you plan to make a round trip. That will tell you right away if the car thinks it can make the trip. Keep the heat on for the duration of the drive, say 76-78 degrees and drive as fast / aggressively as you normally do; in other words, don't take any steps to "hypermile" or lessen the amount of energy used. When you get to your destination, I'm assuming your workplace, subtract about 15 miles from the battery's range in order to estimate your worst case phantom drain during the day that your car sits at work (8 to 10 hours). This should be the worst case if you keep Sentry Mode on or have to pre-condition the cabin (heat or cool) before driving. If you are making this trip on a weekend and don't plan to spend the actual time at "work", then drive around the vicinity to burn off those 15 miles before going back home. Before your return trip home, again use the in-car navigation and it will tell you if you need to hit a Supercharger (and where it is).

Doing this should tell you how much of a mileage / range buffer you can expect during "normal" usage. That should tell you if you need to spend the extra money for the LR model. Note that weather conditions during the year will affect your range; cold and headwinds are worse but so can extreme heat (more A/C usage). Elevation increases will sap the battery faster but a portion of it can be "recovered" when you reverse course and head back downhill. So will hauling extra weight so if you can convince one or two people to accompany you on your test drive, that will be even more of a worst case example.

this is excellent advice!

 

[lolder]

Currently I don’t have a level 2 charger at my house but my Tesla rep told me that I can get it installed for about $300? Is that what you guys also did?

You don't need a level 2 charger, just a 14-50 208-240 vac outlet of the industrial type like Hubbell. The Honda hybrid I believe uses a transmission clutch for the ICE. I don't know what type of CVT it has but avoid the belt and pulley type.

 

[Vaillant]

One other part of the calculus is running costs. Depending on where you live, the cost per mile to charge can be significantly cheaper than the cost per mile for gas. If your electricity rate is tiered, though, with much higher rates the more you use, then the cost difference can narrow or even flip. So, do the math and see how it shakes out. On average, EV drivers have running costs that are much less than gas drivers.

Electric Cars vs Gas Cars: What Do They Cost? | EnergySage

 

[tintinfish]

150 miles commute is not recommended for SR+.
It is rated at 263 miles, yes, but you only charge to 90% and should not use the bottom 10%, that leaves u with 263 * 0.8 = 210 usable range. Highway is only 70~80% efficient, that means the 210 miles = 168 actual miles.
After a year, your battery will degradate, losing another 5% and its gg.

Accord hybrid is a good car, I have driven it before. The interior is nice, TACC is pretty decent, MPG is good, overall very good value.
Anyways, if you can afford a LR then go for it, no point of getting a used LR since CVAP and CVRP probably can't be applied.

 

[tintinfish]

One other part of the calculus is running costs. Depending on where you live, the cost per mile to charge can be significantly cheaper than the cost per mile for gas. If your electricity rate is tiered, though, with much higher rates the more you use, then the cost difference can narrow or even flip. So, do the math and see how it shakes out. On average, EV drivers have running costs that are much less than gas drivers.

Electric Cars vs Gas Cars: What Do They Cost? | EnergySage

Also depending on where you live in California, the electricity can be stupidly expensive.
They also imposed a $150 registration fee for EVs.
Insurance might be more expensive since Tesla is considered luxury.
Anyways, just saying that costs are not that different between EVs and hybrids, but the experience will be better yes

 

[The_Observer]

Also depending on where you live in California, the electricity can be stupidly expensive.
They also imposed a $150 registration fee for EVs.
Insurance might be more expensive since Tesla is considered luxury.
Anyways, just saying that costs are not that different between EVs and hybrids, but the experience will be better yes

Agreed on those fees as well, but I think charging a flat registration fee specifically on EVs is stupid. Yes, people can argue that ICE drivers pay their fair share of taxes on fuel, but we also get taxed on electricity, not like it's tax free.

Electricity fees will depend on OP's local utility, where they may charge less during off-peak hours.

 

[Gasaraki]

In addition to what you presented, the views on this forum might be a bit biased toward one of those options.

Get the Honda. We don't need more people owning Teslas. I don't want to own a car that everyone else has.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

You don't need a level 2 charger, just a 14-50 208-240 vac outlet of the industrial type like Hubbell. The Honda hybrid I believe uses a transmission clutch for the ICE. I don't know what type of CVT it has but avoid the belt and pulley type.

I'd add that I'd suggest getting a separate Corded Mobile Connector or a standard EVSE that is always left plugged into the 14-50. That way there's less chance of a bad connection. You'll want to put something on the wall so the connector body is supported rather than hanging from the plug.

Then you can always carry your Mobile Connector with you, and get a 14-50 adapter for it so that you can use it at home if your normal EVSE fails for some reason.

 

[Fernand]

Not taking into account state and federal rebates, just car to car, I'd look for a used Model 3 LR with EAP or (better) FSD. A 150 mile commute every single day is cool with NOA. It's &$#& tiring without it.

Some years' Hondas are phenomenal cars. We have a Model 3 MR and a Honda Accord LX 2007 ICE that's purring along w/ 145,000 miles. Don't know about the hybrids etc. But a Tesla with NOA is another level entirely. Joy of a car. You're not just going to be plowing back and forth to work.

For charging you just need any 240 volt (washer/dryer) outlet at home close enough to run a 10 gauge extension cord. And the right adapters. Inexpensive. You can get fancier later.
.

 

[Gauss Guzzler]

Neither. It's never wise to buy at the very limits of your budget. Get a 2015 Prius and revisit this topic in a few years.

 

[Fernand]

Good point, @Gauss Guzzler. I confess I stretched that rule getting the late 2018 Model 3 w/ EAP and adding FSD. But it's been such a great beastie, no regrets. I might quote that saying about "the quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten", but once every month that payment does keep reminding me, snuk.

But old Plius? that might be stretching it. My friend in Tokyo has one, and explained how the bent plastic sheets that make up the body have a strong urge to straighten back out.

We have 2 Chevy Bolts in the family, and they've been cheap and run quite well, only a little bit humiliating. One of them is a slime-green special order that the buyer reneged on, and that conversation piece of an auto was a killer lease deal.
.

 

[DDHEverything]

Those are two totally different cars and I know because my car prior to my current model 3 was the Accord Hybrid. It's a great car but I would try to go EV is you can. Get the LR, even if it means buying used. I can also speak to the current Honda driver assist features because my wife has a brand new CR-V Touring hybrid and I'm assuming it's the same system as what's on the Accord. It's pretty nice but it doesn't hold a candle to Tesla Autopilot. The LKAS (Lane Keeping Assist System) won't change lanes for you, which I assume you drive in fairly heavy traffic is a must. It is also extremely finicky about keeping your hands on the wheel at all times and will shut down in just around 10 seconds if you don't. Their version of (automatic cruise control) ACC is on par with Tesla's TACC though.

Tesla Autopilot won't change lanes for you either...

 

[Noodles]

not to rub it in but ... you came to a tesla thread asking if a turd is better than a tesla?


all jokes asides. Tesla>Turd

 

[natman316]

Recent EV adopter here.

I think its doable? But not much experience on driving EV long distance yet. Good advice here on renting and trying the trip. Can you charge at work?

Another factor not sure if mentioned here yet is depreciation and maintainance. I assume the Accord will cost more to maintain over the time you have it, but a Tesla with huge miles may be a harder to sell.

150 miles commute is not recommended for SR+.
It is rated at 263 miles, yes, but you only charge to 90% and should not use the bottom 10%, that leaves u with 263 * 0.8 = 210 usable range. Highway is only 70~80% efficient, that means the 210 miles = 168 actual miles.
After a year, your battery will degradate, losing another 5% and its gg.

Accord hybrid is a good car, I have driven it before. The interior is nice, TACC is pretty decent, MPG is good, overall very good value.
Anyways, if you can afford a LR then go for it, no point of getting a used LR since CVAP and CVRP probably can't be applied.

But as a new car, theoretically you can run the battery to max capacity and get it replaced under warranty within 8 years if it degrades too much? (Serious question, the warranty shouldnt void if you charge to 100% and run it down to say 5% every day)

 

[pure9]

not to rub it in but ... you came to a tesla thread asking if a turd is better than a tesla?


all jokes asides. Tesla>Turd

Where else can I ask about this? I've been super impressed since after test driving a Tesla and I'm just trying to see if there is a catch with it (bad service, parts, etc.) because apart from the price the Tesla looks something too good to be true.

 

[pure9]

Recent EV adopter here.

I think its doable? But not much experience on driving EV long distance yet. Good advice here on renting and trying the trip. Can you charge at work?

Another factor not sure if mentioned here yet is depreciation and maintainance. I assume the Accord will cost more to maintain over the time you have it, but a Tesla with huge miles may be a harder to sell.



But as a new car, theoretically you can run the battery to max capacity and get it replaced under warranty within 8 years if it degrades too much? (Serious question, the warranty shouldnt void if you charge to 100% and run it down to say 5% every day)

I think I can charge at work but I don't want to completely rely on it because I've heard that charging stations do tend to get full nowadays esp with so many people going EV. Will they entertain me if battery degradation is significant because of my charging habits?

 

[pure9]

I would follow all of the advice given so far to rent a 3 from Turo (oldest SR+ you can find, for the worst case example). I would further suggest that before you do your test run, charge or drain the battery to 90% and select your destination using the in-car navigation. At the bottom of the route listing will be an estimate of the battery's capacity if you plan to make a round trip. That will tell you right away if the car thinks it can make the trip. Keep the heat on for the duration of the drive, say 76-78 degrees and drive as fast / aggressively as you normally do; in other words, don't take any steps to "hypermile" or lessen the amount of energy used. When you get to your destination, I'm assuming your workplace, subtract about 15 miles from the battery's range in order to estimate your worst case phantom drain during the day that your car sits at work (8 to 10 hours). This should be the worst case if you keep Sentry Mode on or have to pre-condition the cabin (heat or cool) before driving. If you are making this trip on a weekend and don't plan to spend the actual time at "work", then drive around the vicinity to burn off those 15 miles before going back home. Before your return trip home, again use the in-car navigation and it will tell you if you need to hit a Supercharger (and where it is).

Doing this should tell you how much of a mileage / range buffer you can expect during "normal" usage. That should tell you if you need to spend the extra money for the LR model. Note that weather conditions during the year will affect your range; cold and headwinds are worse but so can extreme heat (more A/C usage). Elevation increases will sap the battery faster but a portion of it can be "recovered" when you reverse course and head back downhill. So will hauling extra weight so if you can convince one or two people to accompany you on your test drive, that will be even more of a worst case example.

Thank you for this amazing advice. I talked to my Tesla SA and they agreed on letting me take the Tesla for a test run to see to my work and back home to get a better idea of real world range but they don't have any more SR+ for that purpose and they will be giving me the LR. I guess real world mileage shouldn't be that much different in the two cars as long as I keep track of how many miles I lost in the worst case scenario like you said? For example, a loss of 150 miles would be the same loss in LR and SR+, right? I'll make sure I track the miles travelled and efficiency. Anything else you can think of?

 

[baylife650]

I would also take into consideration that you will experience some range loss over the life of the battery

 

[RayK]

I believe that the SR+ weighs somewhat less than the LR, mainly due to the LR being an AWD and the SR+ a RWD. So the efficiency of the SR+ will be better than the LR. If true, then a measured 150 mile loss in your loaner LR AWD should be more than what you would obtain from the SR+ in the same trip.