Tesla open up the SuC network [in UK]

[Tam]

There’s another thread for discussion. Let’s keep this clear for mostly actual evidence, if possible.

There's an article with pictures showing the short cable problem: people just have to become adaptable to beat the short cable issue any way they can. They are not robots!

See How Non-Tesla EVs Block Tesla Superchargers Now

Since Tesla has opened 10 stations in the Netherlands under the Non-Tesla Supercharger Pilot, we saw multiple examples of what might go wrong.

insideevs.com

 

[cezdoc]

I expect Aviemore to be a no go area since its on the grounds of the hotel. Shame as it's a really useful stop if your avoiding Inverness.

This is a good example. Only 4 stalls and anecdotally is regularly ICEd by hotel customers. Tesla say they are monitoring usage but unless they have eyes on the ground their stall utilisation data will tell them it's nice and quiet at Aviemore, even at weekends when the hotel & car park is busy. Perhaps they are smart enough to use the Nav data from Teslas driving there and then having to wait even if stalls are "free" (or driving off without charging).

This thread will be a useful resource to see if anecdotal evidence matches Tesla's pronouncements about use and blocking of stalls. TOUK, when announcing news of 3rd party access to UK superchargers yesterday, included a quote from Tesla saying they "will be closely monitoring each site for congestion and listening to customers about their experiences" - hopefully that includes keeping an eye on forums like this one.

 

[fancealot]

I do laugh when people complain and threaten to get a Porsche or Merc over this - seriously!?! Over some supercharging stalls which whilst open to others will probably not get used as the additional cost will steer some others away, also the charging cables are really short, having to download the tesla app (for tesla haters that will steer them away entirely) plus the other reason - Gridserve.

I've been to a site with superchargers and gridserve and whilst us tesla owners go instantly for the superchargers for ease some others go to the gridserve chargers. It's a win win for us as we can use both and it may lead to other companies being more competative and increasing supply.

I supercharge maybe once every two months or so, for me the car itself is the pull, yes it's not 'porsche or merc' quality but it's ... well ... fun to drive, the minimal dash with just two buttons on the steering wheel rather than buttons everywhere it's a breath of fresh air. I'll be getting a Y next and whilst the supercharger network (which will still keep expanding) was a pull when I first ordered the M3, I like the other features we get (OTA updates, Streaming services when in park, silly gifts around the holidays, gimmicks, huge screen etc.)

 

[mick4545]

Notification in app listing Supercharger locations now open to all. The one that concerns most is Folkestone.

 

[WllXM]

The supercharger would know because there is a handshaking protocol which exchanges the VIN, amongst other info.

This is how an SC can bill your car without you ever opening an app or tapping a card.

This works only with Teslas, and even if some manufacturers are trying to implement a similar protocol, doesn't mean it will be compatible with SuC.
In addition, the way it works is : your VIN is registered in the database so the system can link your car to your account and start charging immediately. As it's Tesla owned they also know the history of the car and its model (that's how they can ban salvage, etc...) but if they start accepting 3rd parties, they would not have access to other manufacturers database to check that the VIN matches the car make / model you have declared, so you could declare that your vin is any compatible model and still have access to SuC if you really wanted to

 

[greenbottle123]

Already covered in a topic

 

[mick4545]

The only topic I could find was about the Netherlands.

 

[greenbottle123]

The only topic I could find was about the Netherlands.

Tesla open up the SuC network [in UK]

https://mol.im/a/9722767 What's your thinking about this? I heard that Tesla are working on an App that will allow others EV owners to use the super charger network. It makes sense long term as we don't have petrol stations that can only be used by Ford...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[andyf1140]

There's an article with pictures showing the short cable problem: people just have to become adaptable to beat the short cable issue any way they can. They are not robots!

See How Non-Tesla EVs Block Tesla Superchargers Now

Since Tesla has opened 10 stations in the Netherlands under the Non-Tesla Supercharger Pilot, we saw multiple examples of what might go wrong.

insideevs.com

Reading that report I don't understand why Tesla don't block access to cars with incompatible charge port locations. This could be done on a site by site basis and would allow them time to add longer cables to the superchargers. And by the way, longer cables are less efficient.

 

[btc1k]

This works only with Teslas, and even if some manufacturers are trying to implement a similar protocol, doesn't mean it will be compatible with SuC.
In addition, the way it works is : your VIN is registered in the database so the system can link your car to your account and start charging immediately. As it's Tesla owned they also know the history of the car and its model (that's how they can ban salvage, etc...) but if they start accepting 3rd parties, they would not have access to other manufacturers database to check that the VIN matches the car make / model you have declared, so you could declare that your vin is any compatible model and still have access to SuC if you really wanted to

The handshake protocol is a CCS standard.

Fastned also use VIN recognition for auto-billing. Other suppliers such as Gridserve are also looking to roll it out.

 

[WllXM]

The handshake protocol is a CCS standard.

Fastned also use VIN recognition for auto-billing. Other suppliers such as Gridserve are also looking to roll it out.

Again, this would cover billing as an alternative to rfid cards, but in no way would it allow an operator to check and discriminate based on car make & model for the location of the charge port, which is the issue at hand here.

 

[robbieduncan]

Again, this would cover billing as an alternative to rfid cards, but in no way would it allow an operator to check and discriminate based on car make & model for the location of the charge port, which is the issue at hand here.

Really? Can you not tell the manufacturer and model from a VIN? (obviously you could with a massive database with every VIN and the appropriate details in it: I was hoping for something cleverer than that)

 

[WllXM]

Really? Can you not tell the manufacturer and model from a VIN? (obviously you could with a massive database with every VIN and the appropriate details in it: I was hoping for something cleverer than that)

Manufacturer yes from the first three characters, but then model is their own serial assignment, not sure if each manufacturer is making this publicly available, especially to a competitor.
As far as I know this database doesn’t exist, and even if a private charging operator could get access to say, DVLA records or equivalent for each local market, this wouldn’t cover foreign registered vehicles visiting when abroad so I don’t think that is is feasible in the short to medium term.

 

[qwickshot]

Of course it exists, and it’s available to buy.

It’s what you use to complete a proper HPI check on a car.

The U.K. database only covers U.K. registered cars but every country will have one.

 

[UrbanSplash]

That link is a great read. The id3 and etron examples are outrageous. The two most common other ev’s I see on the roads.

 

[WllXM]

Of course it exists, and it’s available to buy.

It’s what you use to complete a proper HPI check on a car.

The U.K. database only covers U.K. registered cars but every country will have one.

This is for an individual vehicle lookup, not for full batches of specific models. If the purpose is to only select cars which have a port located at the rear left, and connect with every possible (or lets say EU) country, good luck to Tesla if they want to try this... And the maintenance and monitoring alone (oh yes so YY models from XX brand manufacturer from 2024-onwards now have a charge port on the 'right' location, lets add them to the list...)
What if you just purchase a new vehicle and cannot charge at a SuC because they haven't synced their database to include it and you are left stranded? I can see a ton of issues going that route. Not sure that's worth the pain and effort on Tesla's side.

 

[qwickshot]

For an individual, yes, but companies like HPI have access to the entire database, that is where they get the information to do the history check for you as an individual. They’ll get the information from the DVLA and the insurance industry.

It’s a mute point anyway as Tesla don’t want to block cars with the charge port in the ‘wrong’ place. They want all cars to use it.

They just need to fix their ludicrous stall design that they insist on still using that only works for their car despite wanting to deliver a charge network for all cars.

They’ve had plans to open up the network for a long time and there has been evidence floating around to back that up.

You can’t tell me a company like Tesla couldn’t have designed a new tombstone and stall layout in all of that time? It’s bonkers when you think about it.

No one expected them to retrofit older stations, just stop deploying new ones that obviously don’t work for the majority of cars on the road.

 

[Bernard_S]

I think you'll find that Tesla's are the majority of EV's on the road.

 

[WllXM]

For an individual, yes, but companies like HPI have access to the entire database, that is where they get the information to do the history check for you as an individual. They’ll get the information from the DVLA and the insurance industry.

It’s a mute point anyway as Tesla don’t want to block cars with the charge port in the ‘wrong’ place. They want all cars to use it.

They just need to fix their ludicrous stall design that they insist on still using that only works for their car despite wanting to deliver a charge network for all cars.

They’ve had plans to open up the network for a long time and there has been evidence floating around to back that up.

You can’t tell me a company like Tesla couldn’t have designed a new tombstone and stall layout in all of that time? It’s bonkers when you think about it.

No one expected them to retrofit older stations, just stop deploying new ones that obviously don’t work for the majority of cars on the road.

Agreed for the stalls redesign. But for a company that wants you to trust them with your life (literally) at 70mph using their cameras ability to recognise traffic, I believe they could easily develop a camera system built in the stall that would prevent you from charging if you are parked like a prick blocking 2 or 3 bays.

 

[robbieduncan]

I think you'll find that Tesla's are the majority of EV's on the road.

Maybe. Government figures (All vehicles (VEH01)) show about 70,000 Teslas (all models). If you add the Leafs, Zoes, E-Golfs and E-Ups alone it's basically the same.