Tesla open up the SuC network [in UK]

[SpareHeadOne]

symonds youtube channel should do a quick video taking a few non-tesla cars to a supercharger to see if they’d even be able to reach the cable.

Yes, I think cars with the charge port a significant way along the side are definitely going to struggle - the Taycan and the I-Pace spring to mind.

They would have to park sideways across at least two bays to charge. We all thought ICEing was a problem!

 

[pgkevet]

Evidently an opportunity for CCS extension leads...

 

[Bantam]

Kia EV6 Electric Experience are touring the UK Kia stealerships at the moment. According to somebody I was chatting to at a public charger yesterday, who attended a session. One of the major points in the presentation/sales pitch is the fact that all EVs will be able to use the Tesla SuC network imminently. Obviously I took this with a pinch of salt as I suspect Kia Marketing/Sales people will be the last to know what Elon plans are but at the very least they seem to be using Elon's Tweet back in the summer to push their own sales.

 

[M3noob]

Kia EV6 Electric Experience are touring the UK Kia stealerships at the moment. According to somebody I was chatting to at a public charger yesterday, who attended a session. One of the major points in the presentation/sales pitch is the fact that all EVs will be able to use the Tesla SuC network imminently. Obviously I took this with a pinch of salt as I suspect Kia Marketing/Sales people will be the last to know what Elon plans are but at the very least they seem to be using Elon's Tweet back in the summer to push their own sales.

We can only hope that differential pricing will keep Tesla owners happy (and give Tesla great RoI)

 

[phil4]

In the UK at least, I think this will massively dent Tesla's sales. Every YouTube review of an EV that mentions tesla mentions the charging network. And in many people's minds (mine included) it's a massive benefit.

If they'd kept it to niche manufacturers, eg. Rimac as an example, then I doubt any of us would be fussed. You'd almost never see one, and chances are you don't have the 2million to buy one anyway.

But if they're really extending it to more common and affordable makes like Kia, well suddenly that's a differentiator gone when comparing an Ioniq 5 with a Model Y... oh, that we can't even buy here. The more that they cater for, the more they're helping their direct competition.

I doubt they're doing this with Kia, I suspect it'll be either very limited charging (how they mark that up, I don't know), prohibitively expensive charging, or picking a niche manufacturer that they're not in near direct competition with.

 

[Jason71]

We can only hope that differential pricing will keep Tesla owners happy (and give Tesla great RoI)

if you were on a trip with no where else to charge. You would use Ionity. Same will be true of the superchargers. Come the bank holidays etc when access really counts high pricing will not save you from other brands if they really do open it up to all comers

 

[Derek25]

In the UK at least, I think this will massively dent Tesla's sales. Every YouTube review of an EV that mentions tesla mentions the charging network. And in many people's minds (mine included) it's a massive benefit.

If they'd kept it to niche manufacturers, eg. Rimac as an example, then I doubt any of us would be fussed. You'd almost never see one, and chances are you don't have the 2million to buy one anyway.

But if they're really extending it to more common and affordable makes like Kia, well suddenly that's a differentiator gone when comparing an Ioniq 5 with a Model Y... oh, that we can't even buy here. The more that they cater for, the more they're helping their direct competition.

I doubt they're doing this with Kia, I suspect it'll be either very limited charging (how they mark that up, I don't know), prohibitively expensive charging, or picking a niche manufacturer that they're not in near direct competition with.

Can’t see anything to worry about here. The differentiator is about to disappear whatever Tesla do. High speed charging hubs will be popping up everywhere over the next few years. If you’re Tesla, you have to decide whether you are a niche provider of charging infrastructure or a mainstream provider of charging infrastructure. As Tesla drivers, we’ll always have the best of both worlds.

 

[Jason71]

Can’t see anything to worry about here. The differentiator is about to disappear whatever Tesla do. High speed charging hubs will be popping up everywhere over the next few years. If you’re Tesla, you have to decide whether you are a niche provider of charging infrastructure or a mainstream provider of charging infrastructure. As Tesla drivers, we’ll always have the best of both worlds.

You are right but those "few years" could be a step backwards for the Tesla ownership experience. There are currently no non Tesla hubs on any routes I do regularly

 

[glide]

Remember Tesla's mission statement is to accelerate the world's transition to sustainable energy.....

Mission statement - accelerate transition to sustainable energy.

How do we do this? Let’s build a proprietary charging network!

Real mission statement - profit at any cost.

 

[davidmc]

One thing that has come to my attention regards opening up the Tesla Supercharging network is the cable length and position.

Porsche, VW id range and a few others have their CCS port on the opposite side to Tesla's. If there is no upgrade to the SuC's or some form of extension kit that can be purchased/rented, then the bays will become disorganised with VW and others parked in the wrong bay to use the charger. Therefore blocking 2 bays to charge. If this did happen an 8 bay SuS could quite easily become a 4 bay SuC!

 

[TestPilot]

One thing that has come to my attention regards opening up the Tesla Supercharging network is the cable length and position.

Porsche, VW id range and a few others have their CCS port on the opposite side to Tesla's. If there is no upgrade to the SuC's or some form of extension kit that can be purchased/rented, then the bays will become disorganised with VW and others parked in the wrong bay to use the charger. Therefore blocking 2 bays to charge. If this did happen an 8 bay SuS could quite easily become a 4 bay SuC!

While incorrectly reporting 4 available stalls on the map. I’m all for opening it up, but there’s work to do in order to prevent chaos and fights

 

[Drew57]

In a way, delays to a UK Model Y work quite well for me because if the network does open up I will have other choices whereas with a unique SUC network we would stay with Tesla (and even if the Y becomes available soon I will wait and see what happens with the infrastructure before deciding).

 

[AndrewGR]

Having watched the video of a Taycan struggling to plug in to an Ionity chargepoint, I can’t see how it could possibly plug into a Tesla SuC. Not easy to plug in an extension lead if you are delivering 250kW and the lead needs to be liquid cooled. Providing longer leads would result in heavier leads and/or charging inefficiency.

 

[Mrklaw]

If Tesla opens up superchargers to other makes, will they also open up their satnav to other chargers?

 

[nxsynjs]

Having watched the video of a Taycan struggling to plug in to an Ionity chargepoint, I can’t see how it could possibly plug into a Tesla SuC. Not easy to plug in an extension lead if you are delivering 250kW and the lead needs to be liquid cooled. Providing longer leads would result in heavier leads and/or charging inefficiency.

Not just that. The Cabinets are sized so that the existing cables can draw back inside. Longer cables would mean they would sprawl all over the place and create a healthy and safety nightmare. Fixing it would involve replacing every SuC cabinet as well as fitting longer cables, with no guarantee the charge rate could be retained due to a change in the resistance/heat etc of a longer cable.

 

[Neilman]

Out of interest I wonder if Tesla chargers can supply the 800vDC that the Taycan uses?
Most if not all of the Tesla fleet use 400vDC and as they're "private" chargers are they optimised for that?

Edit: someone recently posted a link to a girl comparing LR ot SR on a 400 mile trip.
She had a linked video to "how charging worked" and claimed Tesla chargers were rated to 480vDC and 800/1000vDC cars had an onboard 400-to-whatever DC-DC converters (in addition to the AC charger for mains charging).

So Taycans *could* use a Tesla charger if it was practical cablewise and was allowed logistically to charge

 

[stopcrazypp]

Out of interest I wonder if Tesla chargers can supply the 800vDC that the Taycan uses?
Most if not all of the Tesla fleet use 400vDC and as they're "private" chargers are they optimised for that?

The V2s and older maxed out at 410VDC.
Can the Model S Plaid use V2 Superchargers?

The V3 cabinets seem to max out at 1000VDC:
Pictures of V3 Supercharger cabinets
The cables to do too:
Tesla Supercharger V3 is installed at the Nürburgring

So theoretically it can support 800VDC (depends on how it's configured though).

 

[MrBadger]

So Taycans *could* use a Tesla charger if it was practical cable wise and was allowed logistically to charge

Why would it be any different to any other DC charger that doesn't support 800v? It would just mean that they wouldn't get the full charge rate, assuming current was constant.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Why would it be any different to any other DC charger that doesn't support 800v? It would just mean that they wouldn't get the full charge rate, assuming current was constant.

This was not known when Taycan didn't come out yet. You could design the pack like a normal pack and it would just be straight 800V and it wouldn't be able to charge at 400V chargers at all (it's not a matter of speed, you can't charge a ~800V pack if the charger maxes out at ~400V). But the production Taycan has a DC-DC converter to deal with 400V chargers. Eventually when 800V chargers are unbiquitous, it's possible for automakers to drop that extra part, although it's not practical at the moment, while many, if not most, chargers don't support 800V.

 

[MrBadger]

Exactly. They charge at normal DC chargers so no reason why they wouldn’t work at a supercharger- other than no support for third party cars on Tesla network, yet. And cable ergonomics but having had the highly successful CCS upgrade rollout I’m sure Tesla can manage cable changes again.