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Tesla, please get rid of the fake leather and use real leather

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Livestock and their byproducts account for at least 32,000 million tons of carbon dioxide (CO2) per year, or 51% of all worldwide greenhouse gas emissions.


the 51% claim comes from a non peer reviewed paper, containing a series of flaws and fallacies used in arriving at their number.

A peer reviewed critique of the paper highlights many of the flaws that consistently exaggerate the effects of animal agriculture.

Again, whatever ”facts” you want to come up with can be countered with other “facts”.

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(moderator note)

There is usually a lot of "passion" around discussing anything that deals with meat / leather here. I had to move some posts because, while they contained some good information, they also contained what amounts to personal attacks. I am not going to go through and edit the posts to remove objectionable personal attacks, so the entire post(s) got moved.

Those of you who had posts moved, please feel free to repost your data, without statements that attack a person, or mention their family, or anything else of that nature. Consider this a general warning that, after this general warning, posts doing so will likely be met with something a bit more than moving posts)
Gotcha. Thanks. Not worth the increase in blood pressure or time to be lectured by someone that has never met me.
 
Gotcha. Thanks. Not worth the increase in blood pressure or time to be lectured by someone that has never met me.
Whoa Mod.

You have left the OP's post above, and his previous post, but you removed mine, a post with the actual FACTS from the OP's supposed rebuttal?

Wow.

Let me try again, and please do not remove this post--it's just a posting of the FACTS in the OP's own link.

Thank you.

Source (AGAIN: the OP's own link):


The other sectors continued to increase their emissions since 1990, including agriculture (12% increase, 2nd largest sector), industrial emissions (180% increase, 4th largest sector), and waste (16% increase, 5th largest sector).

Avoiding the worst climate impacts will require reversing the upwards trend in all sectors and rapidly decreasing emissions to net zero by 2050.

[truncated]
 
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Whoa Mod.

You have left the OP's post above, and his previous post, but you removed mine, a post with the actual FACTS from the OP's supposed rebuttal?

Wow.

Let me try again, and please do not remove this post--it's just a posting of the FACTS in the OP's own link.

Thank you.

Source (AGAIN: the OP's own link):


The other sectors continued to increase their emissions since 1990, including agriculture (12% increase, 2nd largest sector), industrial emissions (180% increase, 4th largest sector), and waste (16% increase, 5th largest sector).

Avoiding the worst climate impacts will require reversing the upwards trend in all sectors and rapidly decreasing emissions to net zero by 2050.

[truncated]


I already stated why some posts were moved in their entirety. I will re quote myself here, with bolded emphasis.
(moderator note)

There is usually a lot of "passion" around discussing anything that deals with meat / leather here. I had to move some posts because, while they contained some good information, they also contained what amounts to personal attacks. I am not going to go through and edit the posts to remove objectionable personal attacks, so the entire post(s) got moved.

Those of you who had posts moved, please feel free to repost your data, without statements that attack a person, or mention their family, or anything else of that nature.
Consider this a general warning that, after this general warning, posts doing so will likely be met with something a bit more than moving posts)
 
I'd much rather have fairly durable artificial material than the cheap leather you often see in vehicles. Leather is harder to care for, as well. Issues with sourcing animal products aside, I just don't see the appeal of real leather. It's expensive, unsustainable, difficult to care for properly long term, and maybe I'm a pleb but I really don't notice much difference in touch & feel. The synthetic stuff has gotten so good it seems like the only reason to switch back is leather for the sake of leather, which isn't a convincing argument imo.

Alternatively I wouldn't be opposed to them offering a real leather option, if one wanted to opt in for an extra premium. Not personally for me but it's your car, you should be able to buy what you want. I doubt that'll ever happen though.
 
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I'd much rather have fairly durable artificial material than the cheap leather you often see in vehicles. Leather is harder to care for, as well. Issues with sourcing animal products aside, I just don't see the appeal of real leather. It's expensive, unsustainable, difficult to care for properly long term, and maybe I'm a pleb but I really don't notice much difference in touch & feel. The synthetic stuff has gotten so good it seems like the only reason to switch back is leather for the sake of leather, which isn't a convincing argument imo.

Alternatively I wouldn't be opposed to them offering a real leather option, if one wanted to opt in for an extra premium. Not personally for me but it's your car, you should be able to buy what you want. I doubt that'll ever happen though.
Often wondered the same thing, I think there is still 'status' attached to 'real' leather seating and/or surfaces, though as others have pointed out both the 'value' of leather (cost) and authenticity is highly debatable. Anyone who has experienced a car say 5 years+ old with leather must surely realize the inferiority versus a better quality vegan leather over time if not from day one.

Although one's preference is always valid, I think it's hard to make the argument from any other perspective.
 
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Real leather has a high environmental cost compared to 'fake' leather. For a company that touts sustainable energy future, I do not think it will ever utilize the real leather... I would definitely suggest a regular cleaning regimen to maintain/expand the lifespan of the fake leather quality. Maybe it will help 🤔
What are people doing to mess up their "pleather" seats?? I've had four Teslas, and my fake leather seats in my newest car don't even wrinkle under my 220 lb. body. My take is that the new faux leather is better than the real thing, and I'm glad to use it for many reasons. Real leather wrinkles and discolors more easily in my experience. Of course, if you have white leather and slide into the car wearing your greasy, oily work pants, that might be a problem, but I don't do that. And you can easily buy some sort of seat cushion or seat cover if you need to sit in the car all dirty and grubby. I'd bet the wives here would have a few things to say if their dirty man came and plopped down on the new couch without changing.

Any carmaker's seats will have the same problem. It's not just Tesla. And I don't ever clean mine either.
 
Recommend you click through your own links, so as to post more erudite information for all to know and share . . . .

The other sectors continued to increase their emissions since 1990, including agriculture (12% increase, 2nd largest sector), industrial emissions (180% increase, 4th largest sector), and waste (16% increase, 5th largest sector).

Avoiding the worst climate impacts will require reversing the upwards trend in all sectors and rapidly decreasing emissions to net zero by 2050.

*******************************

Note that ag is the second largest sector . . . so why not just eat plants, instead of plants being raised to then feed to animals?

Look, with all due respect, you live in Seattle, right? Thus, this is a silly thread--you must be aware of the plethora of plant-based and non-animal materials available. Ditto for eating--in 2021, in your city especially, there are likely dozens (hundreds?) of sources of non-animal food and seating materials.

"You either have to be part of the solution, or you're going to be part of the problem."

--Eldridge Cleaver

Please, just drop it; be a part of the solution.

Thank you.
What I get from climatewatchdata.org is that we can reasonably reduce emissions by about 60%. Maybe 70%. If the remaining 30% is still a problem, we might have to consider engineered solutions to cover what is left.
 
I'd much rather have fairly durable artificial material than the cheap leather you often see in vehicles
I agree. Even BMWs standard leather isn’t great. Feels pebbly and rough and gets shiny with minimal wear. The Merino leather is great but I hate cleaning and conditioning seats. Sucks for my back. Tesla seats feel soft, looks good, doesn’t wrinkle, cleans easily.
 
What I get from climatewatchdata.org is that we can reasonably reduce emissions by about 60%. Maybe 70%. If the remaining 30% is still a problem, we might have to consider engineered solutions to cover what is left.
Given the planetary-scale threat to our only planet, I recommend we begin with the easy stuff first, such as what is on the seats of our cars (see OP's post), followed by what's on our forks.

Future generations will appreciate the wisdom some demonstrate, to actually ACT on such concerns.

I don't know what the OP knows or believes--the science doesn't care what anyone believes . . . .
 
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yes, this is truly the reason they use it. Cheaper. And some folks think it is helping to save the planet in some small way. Marketing.
No its not. There were several publicized stockholder meetings werein the owners of the company rpeatedly voted to become a "vegan" company. It was done to avoid having products from dead animals, not for cost reasons.

Edit: meetings from 2012-2016
 
Just start using kangaroo instead.
Sad, but accurate, that among the few that still support the abuse of animals for their skins the level of discourse is akin to what one finds in grade school.

Tesla EXISTS to hasten our transition to sustainable transportation; filling Tesla interiors with animal skins would do the opposite, and that's why they've stopped using animal skins.

It's not too hard to figure out; just use First Principles thinking . . . like Elon.
 
No its not. There were several publicized stockholder meetings werein the owners of the company rpeatedly voted to become a "vegan" company. It was done to avoid having products from dead animals, not for cost reasons.

Edit: meetings from 2012-2016
To be more accurate, the "owners" of the company voted about 99%+ IIRC to keep using animal skins. Both Props 3 and 4 failed in 2016 (or 2015?).

But the board of directors, and/or Elon Musk, gave the collective middle finger to the idiot shareholders and DID THE RIGHT THING anyway.

This is why we buy Teslas (our 10th MS is on order), and TSLA shares: in the face of collective stupidity by 99%+ of the shareholders, Tesla's leadership still does the right and smart thing.

That combination of intelligence and chutzpa is beyond rare.
 
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Seems like nobody wants to talk about the plastics that won’t biodegrade that are associated with this substitute this seems like a bigger issue than using a byproduct of the food industry for the seats. Choose to use it or not, it goes to waste anyway because people keep eating meat regardless of the vegan teacher’s struggles.

That said your “toxic” chemicals in production of real leather, did you consider that polyurethane also has numerous toxic chemical processes in factories that also contribute to greenhouse gas emissions?
 
Seems like nobody wants to talk about the plastics that won’t biodegrade that are associated with this substitute this seems like a bigger issue than using a byproduct of the food industry for the seats. Choose to use it or not, it goes to waste anyway because people keep eating meat regardless of the vegan teacher’s struggles.

That said your “toxic” chemicals in production of real leather, did you consider that polyurethane also has numerous toxic chemical processes in factories that also contribute to greenhouse gas emissions?
I tend to agree, and I'm under the impression that this synthetic leather isn't cheaper than entry level leather either. Having said that, I also prefer it over most car grade "genuine" leather.

It'd be nice if they offered an upgrade option with a high end leather, though.