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Tesla removes regenerative braking strength option

mswlogo

Well-Known Member
Aug 27, 2018
5,995
4,609
MA, NH
One more thing. While you may not get much sympathy on this forum, muscle memory is a thing. Some manufacturers actually build the regen into the pedal (the first few centimeters is regen until you press enough and then the friction brakes assist). I think this more to ease to EV transition than anything else. I agree with you, it’s just software and Tesla should have left it in there. They have all our data and they know exactly how many of us were using it and for how many miles driven. My guess it was a pretty low utilized feature and as said above, they got points, credits, or something for removing the feature so they did. Fear not though, you won’t miss it. I don’t concur with you it’s a safety issue.

Right, my muscle memory kicks in before the end of the driveway.
That applies to my ICE or the Tesla (because it might not have any regen either on a cold morning).
And for the record you will get limited regen in Virginia anything below 60 degrees at night can kick in some limitation (depends on SOC too). I can get a few regen dots in July in New England if I charge to 90%.

Speaking of muscle memory changes, it took a LONG time to build muscle memory to the change in engaging AutoPilot between Model 3 and Model X.

I think the new Model S/X will actually be an easier transistion, because it's so drastically different your muscle memory will learn quick when it reaches for NO stalks. ;)

The point is, the bigger the difference in the vehicles the easier it is for your brain to switch gears. The more they are the SAME is when something subtle that is different can mess you up.

Also slowing down from regen, in general, is not that aggressive. You have plenty of time for your foot to move to the brake to react if you body doesn't feel the response from the throttle lifting. That reaction is always still active even with full regen, because you always have that muscle memory active for a quick stop with the brake pedal in any vehicle.

If Tesla got rid of the brake pedal or the steering wheel (planned), then they can complain (maybe). Tesla already removed half the steering wheel :) In 10 years it will be the bottom half that goes.
 
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RacerChris

Member
Jan 3, 2020
45
22
Indiana
I speak from experience in the cold with my Model 3 Stealth...When the roads are icy and "bad", I like turning the regen down to the softer setting.The car can get very loose when you let off of the throttle once it is warm and you have full strength regen.
 

jmarcos

Member
Dec 6, 2019
26
29
Los Angeles
Totally agree with the OP. Fine myself with the aggressive regen (really like it), but my wife tends to pulse the accelerator on/off like mentioned in the thread, and this makes the rest of us sea-sick. In low regen it is fine and matches her regular SUV.
Doesn’t make sense to remove the option, it’s a regression, not progress.
 

mswlogo

Well-Known Member
Aug 27, 2018
5,995
4,609
MA, NH
I speak from experience in the cold with my Model 3 Stealth...When the roads are icy and "bad", I like turning the regen down to the softer setting.The car can get very loose when you let off of the throttle once it is warm and you have full strength regen.

Maybe with the newer cars (ones without the low option), there is now newer hardware that lets them detect those conditions and sets it "low" and doesn't rely on the driver to know when to set it low or high. Seems kind of archaic to have to do that. It can also sneak up on you or forget you should perhaps lower it. Since Tesla themselves has recommended what your talking about (on older cars) I'm sure that they deal with those conditions now.

Or are you thinking Tesla removed it because they want you to drive "loose" in those conditions?

Which answer makes more sense?
 

GtiMart

Member
Nov 13, 2019
665
540
Quebec City, Canada
There is absolutely no safety reason to put regen on low. I drive on snow and ice in Quebec, Canada and not once has normal regen made the car dangerous. If it's slippery, it's slippery. Regen reduces automatically when the car detects wheel lock, much like the abs would reduce braking forces.
Now, if you're talking about personal preference, that's a different topic. I also don't understand why they removed the option for that topic. Maybe because people continue to propagate the myth that it's a requirement in winter?
 

dfwatt

Active Member
Sep 24, 2018
2,957
5,004
FL
Based on the safety problem alone, this would be a deal breaker for me. And I was about to plunk down my money. Isn't this just a software fix? Why not leave the low setting on the system? You don't have to use it.

For you to regard this as a deal breaker is just this side of bizarre. Pretty much everybody who's had the car for more than a week regards the standard region setting as just about perfect. You obviously have little to no experience with car or its systems. Why don't you actually try it for a while and see how you feel after a period of adjustment. It's actually a only capable of 0.2 Gs of deceleration. That hardly qualifies as any kind of violent or unsafe panic stop level. Actually once you get used to it you realise that other approaches to braking are unsafe. This starts you decelerating the moment you take your foot off the gas pedal. And it's way smoother than any human driver could possibly be. Like I said get some experience with something before you post a borderline rant about it.
 
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dmurphy

Woof.
Dec 7, 2018
3,398
4,599
New Jersey - Morris County
I'm simply hoping that someone at Tesla can explain this situation so that I am reassured without merely asserting that 99% of Tesla owners like it this way.

One thing I wanted to point out is that none of us at this forum represent Tesla directly.... we're all just owners and potential owners. Just wanted to be perfectly clear about that; hopefully you're not looking for an "official" response as this isn't the right place to get that. Doesn't mean the folks here aren't ridiculously knowledgeable; just that we don't speak "for" the company, as it were.

Now, on the issue itself -- I have no idea what changed in June to make them eliminate the option on newer cars. I don't understand it either but I'm sure there's some reason for it.

That said ... we were in a very similar position. I had a Model 3, and my wife had a Buick Enclave. My driver profile was set for "full" regen, and hers for "low". We set it that way during our driver orientation when we picked up the Model 3, out of a similar concern.

Not too long after, I recreated our profiles and in doing so, never reset it back to Low for her profile. I only noticed this "mistake" when we replaced the Buick with a Model X this year.. she never said a word, and in fact never noticed.

Honestly - the difference in driving a "cold" Model 3 vs. one that's warmed up makes more of a difference... and that's something you overcome the first time you come off the accelerator and it doesn't slow quite as quickly as you expect. It's really one of those things that you think about pretty intently (as we did) until you're actually using it and get impressed by how easily your habits adjust.

So I totally hear you on it but don't underestimate yourself (or your other driver!) -- you're both better than you give yourself credit for. :)
 
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Spuzzz

Member
Apr 20, 2016
30
14
Columbus, OH
Maybe with the newer cars (ones without the low option), there is now newer hardware that lets them detect those conditions and sets it "low" and doesn't rely on the driver to know when to set it low or high. Seems kind of archaic to have to do that. It can also sneak up on you or forget you should perhaps lower it. Since Tesla themselves has recommended what your talking about (on older cars) I'm sure that they deal with those conditions now.

Or are you thinking Tesla removed it because they want you to drive "loose" in those conditions?

Which answer makes more sense?


I like your theory here. The fact that they didn’t remove the option from older models kind of supports that theory as well.
 

drtimhill

Active Member
Apr 25, 2019
1,605
1,914
Seattle
Why did Tesla eliminate the low setting for regenerative braking? Standard regen braking in the 2021 Model 3 is very aggressive. I understand you have to get used to it and you'll like it and all that. NOT the point! If, like most families, there are two cars, one of which is an ICE SUV, the person who more routinely drives the Tesla will be in trouble when he drives the kids to soccer in the SUV, expecting the thing to slow down sharply when he releases the gas pedal. I'm guessing he will lose a full second of braking while he figures out he's not in the Tesla. Meanwhile, he plows into the back of that SUV full of kids in front of him. What am I not seeing? Is this not a safety issue?

Come now .. cars vary all over the place in braking distance, acceleration, steering, manual vs auto etc. Sure, there is perhaps a bit more difference than (say) acceleration, but certainly its no worse than manual vs auto, and I for one have no trouble switching back and forward.

And if you are so close that to that SUV that you hit it, then you were too close to start with.
 
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Apone

Member
Oct 7, 2020
75
52
Philadelphia Area
Came to say that I drove in snow for the first time yesterday. I was on the freeway and let off the go pedal as a made a move and felt the car move in a way I did not expect, beginning to slide just a little at the rear. It did it again and I remembered regen, had my daughter pull up that screen and change it to low. The option was there but the car is from Sept 2020. I'm on 2020.48.35.5

I'm sure it would have been fine with high left on but I appreciated the option to change it. I (won't say most) people like to lay off any braking on a slippery surface and make each input deliberately.
 

Apone

Member
Oct 7, 2020
75
52
Philadelphia Area
For you to regard this as a deal breaker is just this side of bizarre. Pretty much everybody who's had the car for more than a week regards the standard region setting as just about perfect. You obviously have little to no experience with car or its systems. Why don't you actually try it for a while and see how you feel after a period of adjustment. It's actually a only capable of 0.2 Gs of deceleration. That hardly qualifies as any kind of violent or unsafe panic stop level. Actually once you get used to it you realise that other approaches to braking are unsafe. This starts you decelerating the moment you take your foot off the gas pedal. And it's way smoother than any human driver could possibly be. Like I said get some experience with something before you post a borderline rant about it.

love you man so don't take this any type of way but who are we to say what is a dealbreaker for him? It is his money and his car. If that makes him not buy - I don't care. I would think no one else would either, unless they have money tied up in Tesla in which case that's no longer an unbiased opinion. How can he get experience without buying it or renting for multiple days. I don't think anyone should buy a car to "try it". And now to say that other ways of braking are unsafe? I don't agree with that either. I very much like the regen feeling and have stated in other posts that it can feel at times like a manual to me which I like. What I do not at all like is the not knowing how much regen I will get feeling (because of cold etc). That is not at all safe when I'm driving more aggressively. Knowing exactly what I will get every time is key to confidence when going quickly. If other car makers wanted all cars to hit the brakes when you let off the gas (for safety) they could do it and I would hope would do it. EV cars do it to return any energy they can to the battery and increase range obviously.

I thought I read here on TMC the track guys turning it to low when racing for that exact reason. If I'm wrong I'm sure they will clarify.
 

dfwatt

Active Member
Sep 24, 2018
2,957
5,004
FL
love you man so don't take this any type of way but who are we to say what is a dealbreaker for him? It is his money and his car. If that makes him not buy - I don't care. I would think no one else would either, unless they have money tied up in Tesla in which case that's no longer an unbiased opinion. How can he get experience without buying it or renting for multiple days. I don't think anyone should buy a car to "try it". And now to say that other ways of braking are unsafe? I don't agree with that either. I very much like the regen feeling and have stated in other posts that it can feel at times like a manual to me which I like. What I do not at all like is the not knowing how much regen I will get feeling (because of cold etc). That is not at all safe when I'm driving more aggressively. Knowing exactly what I will get every time is key to confidence when going quickly. If other car makers wanted all cars to hit the brakes when you let off the gas (for safety) they could do it and I would hope would do it. EV cars do it to return any energy they can to the battery and increase range obviously.

I thought I read here on TMC the track guys turning it to low when racing for that exact reason. If I'm wrong I'm sure they will clarify.
Fair enough. I may have been a little hard on him but again part of what I struggle with on this forum and on others are the instances of what I call the triumph of doctrine over experience. People drawing conclusions before they've ever experienced something really bothers me. I am pretty confident that if somebody had exposed me to regen breaking a number of years ago I would have thought maybe there some way I should dial this back because it's more deceleration than I'm used to. After about 2 days with standard regen I was a convert. My wife had similar experiences and for that matter everybody else I've ever talked to about the car pretty much has stated the same.
 
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kilpatds

Member
May 28, 2013
91
44
Seattle
I thought I read here on TMC the track guys turning it to low when racing for that exact reason. If I'm wrong I'm sure they will clarify.
IIRC, the main reason the Track guys turn regen down, when on the track, is heat ... not handling/balance. Regen adds more heat to the battery, which means it overheats faster which means your run ends sooner.
 
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XPsionic

Member
Jan 20, 2021
57
77
los angeles
there are two cars, one of which is an ICE SUV
Obviously the solution is to get a Model Y or X!

I find the Model 3's interior/gear stalk/one pedal driving so unique, that I never get the operation of the accelerator pedal confused with another car's. To me it's not really an issue, but I can see that as a concern. I do wish Tesla makes the low regen option available again, nothing wrong with more choices.
 

Altarr

Member
Jan 17, 2021
19
13
Earth
I'll miss this. When I see something strange near the road, I move my right foot to the brake pedal. I do this to be able to brake faster if it turns out the strange thing is a moose or something. That doesn't mean I want to decelerate with max regen.

I guess I could start driving like an American (left foot on the brake), but then I'll be handicapped when I use a stick shift.

Do you think we all wear cowboy boots and carry 6 shooters too?
 
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Phlier

Bluebird
Jun 12, 2019
1,391
1,731
Utah
I'll miss this. When I see something strange near the road, I move my right foot to the brake pedal. I do this to be able to brake faster if it turns out the strange thing is a moose or something. That doesn't mean I want to decelerate with max regen.

I guess I could start driving like an American (left foot on the brake), but then I'll be handicapped when I use a stick shift.
And you can still do this. All you need to do is adjust the pressure on your right foot until the energy bar is in the neutral position. That's your "coasting" setting, the same as moving your right foot over the top of the brake. But even better, as now all you have to do to decelerate is just lighten up even more on the right foot pressure, instead of actually moving your foot. It doesn't take long to get a feel as to where that pedal position is, so it's not like you have to stare at the energy bar to do it.

Some of the stereotypes that Americans are pegged with really make me laugh. "Driving like an American (left foot on the brake)" .... how did you ever come up with that one? It's funny, 'cause over here, we call that driving like a European. ;)
 

elptxjc

Member
Dec 15, 2019
752
143
El Paso, TX
Well, forget looking at the energy bar with the latest update; it's basically invisible. Super thin, and with very little contrast. Useless. But it'd be useless to me anyway, so not a big deal. I always drive with one pedal and very smoothly, so don't care what the bar does :)
 

Gasaraki

Active Member
Oct 21, 2019
1,457
977
Syracuse, NY
And you can still do this. All you need to do is adjust the pressure on your right foot until the energy bar is in the neutral position. That's your "coasting" setting, the same as moving your right foot over the top of the brake. But even better, as now all you have to do to decelerate is just lighten up even more on the right foot pressure, instead of actually moving your foot. It doesn't take long to get a feel as to where that pedal position is, so it's not like you have to stare at the energy bar to do it.

Some of the stereotypes that Americans are pegged with really make me laugh. "Driving like an American (left foot on the brake)" .... how did you ever come up with that one? It's funny, 'cause over here, we call that driving like a European. ;)

Yeah I don't get it. You modulate the regen braking by keeping your feet on the accelerator petal till you need full regen then lift off completely. Then if you need even even more braking you hit the brake petal. I got used to it after the first day.

I used to drive a WRX, maybe this is hard for people who ride the brakes all the time in an ICE car.
 

ym1973

New Member
Feb 21, 2021
4
0
LA
It is strange for tesla to have an option like this not pushed out to the existing fleet. I just got 2020.44.10.1 (so I am extremely current right now as far as updates go), and I checked for the low regen option, and its still there.
I just got a 2020 model S. It doesn't have the regen braking setting. I'm in California and didn't really pay attention to this setting. I was looking for the range mode setting mentioned in the manual and couldn't find. When searching for the reason why it is missing I came across the articles about the braking and realized I don't have that too. It seems to be an issue for the model S raven cars. Some sites speculate they did it to achieve the 400+mile range for this car.
 

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