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Tesla removes regenerative braking strength option

alexgr

Member
Aug 13, 2019
650
531
Tulsa
I use Standard all the time, my wife uses regen. on Low. I see absolutely no reason to take this option down in newer cars. If it affects mileage, it can be stated when switching to Low (yes, it is less efficient as it is an equivalent of braking because if I coast to every traffic light I will risk to be constantly subjected to road rage).

I wonder if this applies to performance models too. I thought that for track performance you may want to switch completely to regular brakes. Isn't it not an option now? If this Electrek report is based on some fake news, then maybe Elon should think about bringing PR back in some form to Tesla.
 

KenC

Active Member
Sep 4, 2018
3,555
3,229
Maine
You can get better range by NOT using regen or brakes so much.

EDIT: Since some people decided to disagree since they may not understand physics, let me rephrase and expand my above original comment

Brakes < Regen < Coasting

From a strictly technical standpoint, if you coast to a stop, this is the most efficient. Also, coasting down a hill and burning off the gained speed(from gravity) going back up the next incline, this is also the most efficient. From an energy efficiency standpoint using regen is ALWAYS worse than just coasting, and using brakes is ALWAYS the worst option.

Regen is a great thing for the final few feet(could be a hundred-ish) when coming to a stop. It is also great for sudden slowdowns due to traffic conditions. Maximizing your coasting is best.
Correct, but most people don't optimally coast up to lights, etc. So, regen is capturing waste energy of your average driver.
 

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Nov 28, 2018
8,879
9,888
Riverside Co. CA
From my understanding they're not removing regenerative braking. They're only removing the "low" setting so that regenerative braking is there, on 'standard' mode, for everyone with a later build car.

Yeah I ment "removal of the low regen option". My wife uses that on my model 3 as she doesnt drive it much. Low regen helps the car feel more like "a regular car" to her. I realize this is supposedly for newer cars, but like I said, I dont trust electrek to do due diligence on reporting stuff like this, and wonder if this is a real change, if it effects all new teslas (or just the model Ss that people are reporting on TMC), etc.
 

not4antoher

Member
May 15, 2019
156
114
Walnut, CA, USA
Stop the vehicle? There is regen with hold mode. There is brakes if you mis-judge your coasting distance...It's all planning and adjusting your driving when you can foresee that you will need to stop up ahead. There are times that someone will HAVE to use their brakes as well. It is a dynamic driving environment.

Yes I am well aware of coasting with regen standard and have spoken about this at length in the past in regards to the tolerance of the power bar on the screen to get to as close to zero power(pos or neg) as possible.

My original statement that you disagreed with stands however. "You can get better range by NOT using regen or brakes so much."
I think we are on the same page. I misunderstood your original post.
Thank you for the explanation.
 
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ftmaybe

Member
Feb 11, 2020
215
296
San Joaquin
However, in practical terms, regen probably wins since (a) at some point you reach a downhill speed limit and must then slow the car, which is best done via regen rather than brakes, (b) as speed increases you lose more energy to air drag, and (c) regen energy, while less efficient, can always be used for something, even if its not coasting along a flat road immediately after going down a hill (for example, if you hit a red light at the bottom of the hill).

This kind of thing is why IMO while "coasting" is better in a perfect world, in teh real world it his limited practical benefits over running max regen. every hill within 100 miles of me is too steep to fully coast, you'll have to limit your speed at some point or you're breaking the law, and setting the cruise control allows the car to manage the right amount of regen vs set speed for you.

Around town there is enough stop and go + unpredictable people around you that the "perfect coast" isn't worth pursuing constantly IMO. Though if you wanted to, its possible to adjust the accelerator enough to be very either very slightly regen'ing or very slightly accelerating, which would be the closest to "coasting" .. however the accelerator is almost too sensitive for this (also you'd have to stare at the regen/accel bar on the screen to get it about right) and for me it seems like I would spend too much time "trying to coast" for very little benefit over just slowing down with regen when I need to.
 
Aug 7, 2020
587
1,244
USA
I'll miss this. When I see something strange near the road, I move my right foot to the brake pedal. I do this to be able to brake faster if it turns out the strange thing is a moose or something. That doesn't mean I want to decelerate with max regen.

I guess I could start driving like an American (left foot on the brake), but then I'll be handicapped when I use a stick shift.
American here. I don’t believe we are taught to left foot brake under normal circumstances.
 

SergeyUser

Member
Feb 11, 2017
439
234
Austin, TX
You can get better range by NOT using regen or brakes so much.

EDIT: Since some people decided to disagree since they may not understand physics, let me rephrase and expand my above original comment

Brakes < Regen < Coasting

From a strictly technical standpoint, if you coast to a stop, this is the most efficient. Also, coasting down a hill and burning off the gained speed(from gravity) going back up the next incline, this is also the most efficient. From an energy efficiency standpoint using regen is ALWAYS worse than just coasting, and using brakes is ALWAYS the worst option.

Regen is a great thing for the final few feet(could be a hundred-ish) when coming to a stop. It is also great for sudden slowdowns due to traffic conditions. Maximizing your coasting is best.

The only thing that matters here is EPA rating. It is not about optimal coasting which you can technically do, but rather specific tests performed during EPA certification. Put it another way, Regen=Standard will likely give higher EPA rating than Regen=Low. Just because of some energy will go back to the battery rather than to heat via friction brakes.
 

valaeyron

Member
Sep 8, 2020
241
129
Virginia
well that could increase EPA rating. These "government approved tests" are always susceptible to micro tweaking so as to "do better on" without actually raising the bar IMO.

it’s just a standardized test. Yes they’re capable of being gamed. But there is commonality that is valuable too.
 

KenC

Active Member
Sep 4, 2018
3,555
3,229
Maine
I'll miss this. When I see something strange near the road, I move my right foot to the brake pedal. I do this to be able to brake faster if it turns out the strange thing is a moose or something. That doesn't mean I want to decelerate with max regen.

I guess I could start driving like an American (left foot on the brake), but then I'll be handicapped when I use a stick shift.
?!? Is that what Danes think Americans do? Ride the brake pedal with their left foot? Didn't you know we're all ex-Formula 1 drivers. We heel-and-toe, and dab the brake with our left foot.
 

Dutchie

Active Member
Jun 9, 2013
1,560
3,504
Canada
This is bad unless they coupled the regenerative braking to the ABS system. I live on a hill. Which snowy conditions, driving in the ‘standard’ setting the wheels tend to block when regenerative braking kicks in. I always put it in “low” so I am forced to use brakes in which I am sure ABS works.
 

NOLA_Mike

Grouchy
May 11, 2013
2,260
3,808
Hammond, LA
This is interesting considering Tesla recommends (in the latest Model S owner's manual) setting Regenerative Braking to LOW in snowy and icy conditions.

Screen Shot 2020-10-27 at 6.44.03 PM.jpg
 

LionXng

Member
Mar 4, 2020
254
366
Virginia
Yes, Brakes < regen < coasting

@LionXng and @not4antoher Physics. I edited my previous post to help you two along. :)

Physics eh? My physics teachers taught me science was proven with experimentation, not discussion:). I think your logic is flawed because the real world is not an empty pinewood derby ramp. You go ahead and prove your physics with a go-pro going up and down centreville road on low regen. I'll match your path on standard and we can compare who went a further with 10% battery.
 
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