Tesla Software updates - Australia

[Priit]

I’m also impressed by how much smoother the driving is. It also seems much better at keeping in the same lane across an open intersection.

So, it amazes me how different experiences people have with AP and different software versions. It would suggest that the software behaves differently depending on the hardware. My 2019 Model 3 appeared to never have much issues with the open intersections with no lines. It was rather solid on most drives with exception of narrow residential area roads with cars parked on both sides, however the AP is not designed for those so not really fussed about that. Had occasional phantom breaking and mostly predictable places like bridges, road splits and/or shadows on road.
With the first vision only update 2022.24.6, my car went way down hill, with much more jittery on motorway and way ore random slowdowns. Then I got the 2022.24.8 update and it seems very close to what it was before the vision based update with the exception of minimum follow distance kept at 2 and that auto high-beams icon, so seems mostly normal again.

 

[jamesgo]

So I went down to Wilson Prom on Friday with 2022.24.8, I also drove past that Tesla South Gippsland sign that someone installed on the South Gippsland Hwy outside of Leongatha.

Anyway, i've got FSD and was driving fine with it until I noticed that it was keeping a larger than normal space in front. So the Traffic-Aware Cruise Control used to go down to 1 but now it appears the lowest it goes is 2. I assume its a bug or related to Tesla Vision changes cause ours is a 2019 Model 3 (so with radar) and as per the manual, only cars made after June 2022 can't do close distance: Model 3 Owner's Manual | Tesla

Not sure if anyone else has also noticed this.

 

[positiv]

So I went down to Wilson Prom on Friday with 2022.24.8, I also drove past that Tesla South Gippsland sign that someone installed on the South Gippsland Hwy outside of Leongatha.

Anyway, i've got FSD and was driving fine with it until I noticed that it was keeping a larger than normal space in front. So the Traffic-Aware Cruise Control used to go down to 1 but now it appears the lowest it goes is 2. I assume its a bug or related to Tesla Vision changes cause ours is a 2019 Model 3 (so with radar) and as per the manual, only cars made after June 2022 can't do close distance: Model 3 Owner's Manual | Tesla

Not sure if anyone else has also noticed this.

lol
youve lost your radar. Read this thread a few pages back.

 

[jamesgo]

Ah...well that explains the auto highbeams doing random stuff on the drive.

 

[positiv]

Ah...well that explains the auto highbeams doing random stuff on the drive.

Yeah I'm sorry about that. It's a real pain. I feel that Tesla really hasn't been upfront with the functional downgrades that Tesla Vision brings along with it.

 

[[Zombie]]

I feel that Tesla really hasn't been upfront

It's kinda crazy that people who had already ordered their cars were asked to confirm the change to Tesla Vision but those that already had their cars have had it changed without warning.

But I believe that although vision may be worse in some ways & better in other ways right now, in the long run it'll be better than vision+radar could ever be.

 

[doggy1]

although vision may be worse in some ways & better in other ways right now, in the long run it'll be better than vision+radar could ever be.

Why do you think would that be the case?

 

[bay74]

I have .20.7 and can still select 1 as follow distance. 2019 SR+.
Not sure I can understand, Zombie, how vision alone could be better than vision + radar "could ever be". How could getting extra information be worse? If the extra information were mis-interpreted? Sure, but such a system is not as good as "vision+radar could ever be".
I'm not installing the .24.6.5. update being offered. (Might not update until Tesla forces me too, like when they forced me to v11 via breaking my windscreen ).

 

[[Zombie]]

Why do you think would that be the case?

How could getting extra information be worse?

Having something detected by radar that isn't seen by the cameras can only result in more phantom braking.

Radar by itself can only tell you distance and heading, not the size of the object (the reflection from the concave end of a coke can could be interpreted as a truck) and more importantly, it won't tell you what lane the object is in - so without seeing it on the camera there's no way to know if the object is something you will hit.

I know this goes against the "gut instinct" and it took me a while to come around to this thinking - but ultimately I believe the word of the Tesla engineers that are actually working on this vs the gut instincts of those that are not (including myself)

 

[crustovich]

Happy to go along the "journey" with the change to vision only. But what annoys me is that I am forced to put up with 1/2 baked auto high beam system as well. Surely they could have made it an option to have it on when you are using FSD at night or not, and just advise you when the light was not good enough for FSD (as they do with heavy rain)?
We are beta testing it for them, at least they could let us make some of the calls?

 

[Priit]

Having something detected by radar that isn't seen by the cameras can only result in more phantom braking.

Unless its a spaceship with active camouflage system making it invisible in the spectrum that an eye can identify, then radar might just save you from crashing into it...

 

[positiv]

I know this goes against the "gut instinct" and it took me a while to come around to this thinking - but ultimately I believe the word of the Tesla engineers that are actually working on this vs the gut instincts of those that are not (including myself)

"A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush".
Tesla Vision might get better... or it might not on the current hardware. And then we are stuck with a half baked system. I'm not willing to take that risk, hence I'm not updating my radar M3 until Tesla delivers equivalent performance on Tesla Vision.

Unless its a spaceship with active camouflage system making it invisible in the spectrum that an eye can identify, then radar might just save you from crashing into it...

Or if it's foggy. Or if your cameras are blinded by dirt or direct sunlight. Or if the object is out of visible range of the camera.
Either way radio frequency is better than relying on the the visible spectrum exclusively.

 

[chadwickau]

Wonder if there was supply chain issues with radar and that swayed/moved forward the "lets just do vision" decision

 

[Maximillan]

 

[EcoCloudIT]

"A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush".
Tesla Vision might get better... or it might not on the current hardware. And then we are stuck with a half baked system. I'm not willing to take that risk, hence I'm not updating my radar M3 until Tesla delivers equivalent performance on Tesla Vision.

Or if it's foggy. Or if your cameras are blinded by dirt or direct sunlight. Or if the object is out of visible range of the camera.
Either way radio frequency is better than relying on the the visible spectrum exclusively.

Do your eyes use radar when in fog?

 

[schnaxxl]

has something happened to digital radio in these recent updates?
I usually have ABC classic DAB as my main station but it looks like the FM version now

 

[cafz]

has something happened to digital radio in these recent updates?
I usually have ABC classic DAB as my main station but it looks like the FM version now

DAB still working fine for me on 2022.24.8.

 

[Priit]

Do your eyes use radar when in fog?

In fog, I also use my voice and ears to navigate (call out to mates and follow their voice), so maybe they should add sonar?

 

[ZeeDoktor]

Did a 1000km drive today on 24.8 on my (radar equipped) 2019 Model S with FSD. There definitely are some major changes. Here are my observations. I tried to drive as much as possible with Navigate on AP enabled.

The good:
- Visualisations are now showing a lot more traffic than before - and most importantly, includes parked vehicles along a road. It never showed those before.
- Auto high beams is not enforced when using AP on my model in the pitch dark night.
- Cars/trucks in the left lane are no longer shown on the traffic vis as crossing the dividing line when they clearly aren't.


The bad:
- Auto lane change still is aborting every other change into the left lane - even if NoA initiated the lane change.
- Auto lane change has on more than one occasion changed into the passing lane despite traffic ahead being >120m away and in fact pulling away. 5 seconds later it decides to change back into the left lane.
- In the deep dark of the night, trucks with red lights at the top of their trailers are still mistakenly identified as a traffic light. On the M31. 50km or more away from where there is an actually existing traffic light.
- APP_w269 still appears as soon as the landscape goes pitch dark (and NoA stops working at that point)
- With NoA engaged, the car rarely passes traffic that's going 2-3km/h slower than my TACC set speed. It tried it once, 1.5km before it needed to take the next exit on the left. Seriously? The other times, well away from the next exit, it just sat behind the traffic ahead like the dumb effing moron that it is.
- They managed to make the hands-on-wheel detection more sensitive. Now I actually have to move my hand on the wheel every 30 seconds or I get cautioned. Used to be able to just keep the hand on one finger, and change that around every few minutes. But not every 30 seconds.
- When coming over a hill where it can't see past the curvature, the car slows down far more conservatively than before.

The ugly:
- it still is using indicators incorrectly. When on a 2 lane motorway onramp in the right lane, it will indicate LEFT where the two onramp lanes merge... yet the left lane is merging into the right.
- I manually enabled auto high beams just to see if they've made any progress. Ha. Hahaha. LOL! utterly and totally unusable. Whoever came up with the algo that drives them should have to sit a mandatory lesson with me on how to operate high beams.
- oncoming traffic is now often triggering a decisive slowdown, despite nobody being even close to the lane I'm in.
- phantom speed limits have been detected on numerous occasions today, such as outside Berridale going towards Cooma, in a section that's 100. The "vision" guesser saw a 50 sign, so my AP speed was limited to 50. These false speed limit detections tend to drag on forever, there are not many speed signs out in the sticks. I ended up having to drive manually for 25km. I've always had those happen occasionally, but today I had more than I normally have in a month. There really needs to be a function undo automated speed sign detections. Manual override.

At some point when I have not driven 1000km in a day I'll have the stamina to make some plots on the follow distances I recorded today. My feeling is they're roughly equal to what we had in radar only days. Setting 2 ~ 1s follow time, setting 7 = 2s follow time, the ones inbetween stepped i 0.2s increments.

 

[Flatbat]

In fog, I also use my voice and ears to navigate (call out to mates and follow their voice), so maybe they should add sonar?

That will work well when you are driving in fog. Perhaps this is the technique used by drivers who persist with driving in fog, leading to the pile ups we see from time to time in the northern hemisphere.