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Tesla Supercharger network

Discussion in 'Charging Standards and Infrastructure' started by dsm363, May 25, 2012.

  1. stopcrazypp

    stopcrazypp Well-Known Member

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    Problem with CHAdeMO: not enough power (500VDC and 125A means 62.5kW peak). It's completely fine for smaller packs like in the Leaf, not enough for a pack 3.5x as large (the 85kWh Model S). The superchargers can handle twice the power (120kW).

    Problem with J1772-DC: Not ready yet.

    Given the choice between the two, I think Tesla would have chosen J1772-DC (Tesla's connector is very similar), but unfortunately it's wasn't ready when Tesla had to finalize their car.

    As for access to the Supercharger network, that's largely orthogonal to the connector. If Tesla went with a standard connector, I don't think they would have built this network (but rather would have pushed for more publicly funded chargers, like other manufacturers have done). Their goal for this network is NOT to provide charging for EVs overall, but rather to provide an exclusive perk to Tesla owners. At this point, running a fast charging network is doesn't make economic sense (even with charging fees; the current networks only exist because of government funding), so even if Tesla can build a network that other EVs can use, they won't. This is esp. true when you have cars charging at half the speed the charger can handle.
     
  2. Lloyd

    Lloyd Active Member

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    I'm sure if another manufacturer wanted to pony up to pay for the research, testing, UL certification and a licensing fee, Tesla would be willing to discuss licensing thier technology!
     
  3. Norbert

    Norbert TSLA will win

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    Yes, I did. I liked your point about not being ready for a standard. I guess when the time comes for ~200kW chargers, we might have a standard. If so, it will be more like Tesla's connector, than like the others.

    Regarding another aspect of the discussion, I think convenient long trips do require a 200+ mile range *plus* fast chargers at least around 80 to 100 kW. CHAdeMO has its place to support extending the range of EVs with shorter range, but that is a different thing. Tesla is betting on battery prices improving to the point where 200+ mile ranges become affordable for higher-volume cars. Owners of 40 kWh batteries will be able to upgrade, and by the time they may do so, there will be an extensive network available. Perhaps there will be an upgrade even for Roadster owners.

    Within a year from today, I think the quality of Tesla's approach will become very clear, and that Tesla is really serious about what they are doing. Much of the current discussion will simply become obsolete.
     
  4. Schlermie

    Schlermie P4932 - Delivery: 12/22

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    I found the SC in Tejon Ranch. It's a nice big one with at least 6 stalls but only one of them is active now. It's by the Yogurtland and it has the big solar panel cover as advertised in the announcement. I didn't see the lighted spire though. In fact, it was fairly unlighted and difficult to see at night.
    20120930_205202.jpg
     
  5. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    By the way, for the LEAF, the pack wants voltages around 350V (even though the CHAdeMO spec can go up to 500V). At that lower voltage I think they let the amperage go a bit higher, but I think LEAF published CHAdeMO charge rate is around 50kW max. Anyways, your point is even more true: Supercharging is more powerful and quicker than CHAdeMO...
     
  6. DrComputer

    DrComputer Member

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    I got bad news about the SuperChargers today from my delivery person. I am planning on doing factory delivery and driving back to my home in Los Angeles. My delivery date can be as early as this weekend (if all things in production go well). I was hoping to drive back on the 5 and use the SuperChargers. But my delivery guy just sent me this e-mail:

    One important note is that the Supercharging Stations that have been installed in California are not accessible to the public yet because they are awaiting UL Certification. They will be turned off until we have the certification to use them. I have no information on timeline whenthis will happen.
     
  7. ModelS1079

    ModelS1079 Member

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    Officially to open in a month or so. Smile. You are way ahead of the rest of us :cool:
     
  8. doug

    doug Administrator / Head Moderator

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  9. ggr

    ggr Roadster 537, Sig P85

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    Well, when we planned our pickup we had no trouble organizing relatively fast charging on the way down. Lloyd has 70amp J1772 in San Luis Obispo, there's a public 70amp in Goleta, and we found a hotel in Santa Barbara with multiple chargers if you want to stay overnight. Unfortunately we never got to do the trip, due to delivery delays. Dadelus did factory pickup and drove home to San Diego, you could ask him where he charged.
     
  10. dadaleus

    dadaleus 4GETOIL P85#S70,FdrX,S85D

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    I just got the same info from Tesla about the Superchargers.

    Interesting... I guess I slipped in. Glad I managed to get a charge (just for fun) before this info came out so I know how well they actually work.
     
  11. DrComputer

    DrComputer Member

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    Yeah, that's the route I was planning on taking. Factory to SLO, charge, drive to Santa Barbara, stay over night, drive home the next morning....although I really did want to user the SuperChargers.
     
  12. jkirkebo

    jkirkebo Model S P85+ VIN 14420 EU

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    125A max anyway. The Leaf starts at about 350V and goes up to 394V. It starts to ramp down the charging current somewhere around 380-390V or so. Max charging power is about 47kW.

    The Model S has a similar battery voltage so around 47kW max there too.
     
  13. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    (Qualifier: when using a hypothetical CHAdeMO adapter...)
     
  14. driver_EV

    driver_EV Member

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    #814 driver_EV, Oct 6, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2012
    SuperCharger location needed - Augusta, GA on Interstate 20.

    I strongly agree with Augusta just off I-20 for a Supercharger location.
    I-20 is a key route to/from ATL for South Carolina.
    Augusta is an appropriate Inter-state stopping point for traveling.

    I travel it several times each year from Charleston. Best alternative when charging on this drive for me is the Heritage RV park near Augusta. That is what I currently use when I travel in the Roadster.
     
  15. dadaleus

    dadaleus 4GETOIL P85#S70,FdrX,S85D

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    DrComputer: Late reply, just noticed this. (Is there a way to get notified of mentions BTW?)

    Anyway, there are free 70amp J1772's at Rabobanks at the following locations along 101 which can be found on Recargo:
    - Salinas Rabobank Salinas - Salinas, CA - Recargo
    - Atascadero Rabobank - Atascadero, CA - Recargo
    - Goleta Rabobank - Goleta, CA - Recargo
    - Santa Maria Rabobank - Santa Maria - Santa Maria, CA - Recargo

    There are also a couple non-Rabobank 70amp J1772 in San Luis Obispo:
    - $.75/hr Marsh St. Parking Structure - San Luis Obispo, CA - Recargo
    - $5/hr at LLoyd's office: Marcum, Copp, Barbieri DDS - San Luis Obispo, CA - Recargo

    We used the Salinas and Goleta stations on our Model S drive down with no problems.

    We stayed at the Embassy Suites in San Luis Obispo so charged for the night on the free 30amp J1772 in the parking lot:
    - San Luis Obispo Promenade - San Luis Obispo, CA - Recargo

    Lastly, you're far enough north that you should be set after Goleta. We had to continue on to San Diego and once you get south of Goleta you're a bit out of luck for 70amps until Tesla gets the Superchargers turned back on or puts in J1772 or Model S connector stations at their stores or service centers. But there are plenty of 30amp stations to be found. Maybe Tesla can arrange something for you to use a Roadster > S adapter or something.

    ChadS made a very nice map of charging stations as well. I've suggested he parse out the 70amp J1772s (right now they are mixed with the 70amp Roadster specific stations) but you can get the info from the descriptions: Tesla Highway - Google Maps

    And I've suggested to Recargo that they let us filter on the amps. They have a field for amps, and if we could search on it I suspect us Tesla owners would fill that in for the higher amperage stations pretty quickly.
     
  16. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    Nice recap, dadaleus... Thanks!
     
  17. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    October 19th is Supercharging Day

    e-mail from Tesla:

     
  18. mcornwell

    mcornwell Active Member

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    Interesting that they say an update is needed prior to supercharging. Dadaleus was able to supercharge at the unveiling event last month...
     
  19. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    They've probably done some sort of firmware upgrade to the Superchargers, requiring a matching change in the cars.
     
  20. CapitalistOppressor

    CapitalistOppressor Active Member

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    They were waiting for certification, which is the same issue that has delayed the HPWC. The software update is likely a separate issue that has been sitting on the shelf with no need to be implemented prior to certification.
     

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