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Ty_McMahan

Blogger
Jan 19, 2017
30
9
Brooklyn
Tesla’s energy products will soon only be sold as a package.



Tesla Chief Executive Elon Musk said on Twitter that the company’s solar products will only be available in combination with the company’s Powerwall battery. 



“Solar power will feed exclusively to Powerwall,” Musk tweeted. “Powerwall will interface only between utility meter & house main breaker panel, enabling super simple install & seamless whole house backup during utility dropouts.”




Solar power will feed exclusively to Powerwall. Powerwall will interface only between utility meter & house main breaker panel, enabling super simple install & seamless whole house backup during utility dropouts.— Elon Musk (@elonmusk) April 22, 2021




Musk also announced an upcoming software update that will be a big improvement. “Depending on production date, power increase power may be >50% at 30C ambient temp,” Musk tweeted.



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[email protected]

New Member
Apr 4, 2019
3
2
Woodland, WA
Personally, I don't see the point in ordering the solar panels or roof without the Powerwalls. The energy storage and backup power is what sold me. We ordered a 16kW system with 3 Powerwalls and our installation is set for June.
 

wjgjr

Active Member
May 11, 2020
1,209
947
Silver Spring, MD
Personally, I don't see the point in ordering the solar panels or roof without the Powerwalls. The energy storage and backup power is what sold me. We ordered a 16kW system with 3 Powerwalls and our installation is set for June.
I do not know what the policies are in WA, but it makes complete sense in MD (and I say this as somebody who did get PWs.) For many, the grid is very reliable, and full net metering with no time-of-use rates means there is no cost benefit to storing your power versus sending it to the grid - in fact, there is a loss, because running the power through the PW is less efficient than sending it to the grid and getting other power back when needed.

My point is not to disagree with your decision or situation - I elected PWs to guard against the chance of an outage and for possible future options to arbitrage, and because there are state rebates available. So, there are a number of reasons - both financial and non-financial. But I think it is clear there are very good reasons - and benefits - to solar without PWs. It just depends on the individual preferences and the applicable utility interconnection agreements.
 

dc121gw

Member
Oct 19, 2019
93
114
Atlanta
I think both Tesla and customers were getting frustrated by the utility agreements needed for installation. This arrangement should simplify installation as no power goes back to the grid. Cheaper and faster installs. But, it adds significant cost for anybody buying just to save money on electricity, pushing back the break-even point even further. If I lived in a state with net metering, I would be reluctant to take on this new expense unless I was specifically looking for emergency power during outages.
 

h2ofun

Active Member
Aug 11, 2020
2,426
412
auburn, ca
I think both Tesla and customers were getting frustrated by the utility agreements needed for installation. This arrangement should simplify installation as no power goes back to the grid. Cheaper and faster installs. But, it adds significant cost for anybody buying just to save money on electricity, pushing back the break-even point even further. If I lived in a state with net metering, I would be reluctant to take on this new expense unless I was specifically looking for emergency power during outages.
IF this new solution does not allow any power back to grid, would be a huge change. But, for me, would never consider since I do not have that much money to burn.
 

wjgjr

Active Member
May 11, 2020
1,209
947
Silver Spring, MD
I think both Tesla and customers were getting frustrated by the utility agreements needed for installation. This arrangement should simplify installation as no power goes back to the grid. Cheaper and faster installs. But, it adds significant cost for anybody buying just to save money on electricity, pushing back the break-even point even further. If I lived in a state with net metering, I would be reluctant to take on this new expense unless I was specifically looking for emergency power during outages.

From the blog, citing the tweets:
“Solar power will feed exclusively to Powerwall,” Musk tweeted. “Powerwall will interface only between utility meter & house main breaker panel, enabling super simple install & seamless whole house backup during utility dropouts.”
I do not read this as no power going back to the grid. It sounds like the main difference is that the solar would not directly feed the grid but would always feed the PW. The PW would then feed the grid. Whether this "laundering" of the energy through the PW actually makes a difference in terms of utility interconnections remains to be seen. I am not convinced in our area that the utilities will treat it any differently, particularly if you want the benefits of NEM. It will also be interesting to see the details of exactly how the energy is flowing (in terms of number of conversions from DC to AC.
 
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Reactions: tfan2018

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Nov 28, 2018
8,729
9,704
Riverside Co. CA
My wife and I are buying a house that already has solar but no battery storage. If we want to get a couple Powerwalls is our best bet now to get them 3rd party?

Thats currently your only choice, as you can not currently purchase powerwalls only to add to existing solar from tesla.
 

tfan2018

Member
Apr 14, 2018
86
25
USA
It’s interesting there’s a backlog for PW but now they will require all solar to be bundled with PW thereby increasing PW demand even more
 

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Nov 28, 2018
8,729
9,704
Riverside Co. CA
Thanks for the reply, I guess what I’m really asking is: are 3rd party solar companies also restricted from buying PWs from Tesla given the new bundling change?

Currently (pre this announcement from musks' twitter account regarding bundling PV an ESS) some third parties have had product flow issues trying to get these from Tesla.

We dont currently know if this will change much. For example, if the powerwall product is physically changed in some way, it may change availability for this (for example). The short answer is, we dont know, but I would expect that you will need to contact your chosen third party and ask them (or move quickly, to ensure you get an order in before the product changes if, in fact, it changes).
 

h2ofun

Active Member
Aug 11, 2020
2,426
412
auburn, ca
Currently (pre this announcement from musks' twitter account regarding bundling PV an ESS) some third parties have had product flow issues trying to get these from Tesla.

We dont currently know if this will change much. For example, if the powerwall product is physically changed in some way, it may change availability for this (for example). The short answer is, we dont know, but I would expect that you will need to contact your chosen third party and ask them (or move quickly, to ensure you get an order in before the product changes if, in fact, it changes).
i would want new stuff which i hope is the 2.1 version
 

[email protected]

New Member
Apr 4, 2019
3
2
Woodland, WA
I do not know what the policies are in WA, but it makes complete sense in MD (and I say this as somebody who did get PWs.) For many, the grid is very reliable, and full net metering with no time-of-use rates means there is no cost benefit to storing your power versus sending it to the grid - in fact, there is a loss, because running the power through the PW is less efficient than sending it to the grid and getting other power back when needed.

My point is not to disagree with your decision or situation - I elected PWs to guard against the chance of an outage and for possible future options to arbitrage, and because there are state rebates available. So, there are a number of reasons - both financial and non-financial. But I think it is clear there are very good reasons - and benefits - to solar without PWs. It just depends on the individual preferences and the applicable utility interconnection agreements.
Totally get where you are coming from. It comes down to everyone's individual situation and location. Our grid (hydro) in SW WA is very reliable at the moment, but with the increase in wildfires on the West Coast, it doesn't matter how reliable our grid is today if the infrastructure to deliver power burns down tomorrow. A big factor for me to choose PW's was seeing the trends in extreme weather/climate change and not wanting to rely on utilities to deliver power with the increasing frequency, strength, and devastation of weather events. The main strategy was to be completely independent of utilities as we are already on well and septic. Solar was the last puzzle piece. Not to mention... As a cybersecurity analyst, I also worry about existing malware hiding on our critical infrastructure that can cripple our power grid. Case-in-point, look at what just happened with the Colonial Pipeline. Do what's best for your situation, but I'd encourage everyone to try to achieve energy independence. I can't wait for those 4680 cells to go into Powerwalls!
 

SaveOurPlanet

Member
Jan 6, 2018
235
140
San Francisco
With Cybertruck and Semi waiting around the corner, I'm not sure there will be enough 4680 for PW, but I think LFP may be an option since Tesla only going to use them for the M3SR now, it's ok to be bulky for home storage, no? Regardless, people buy home insurance, auto insurance and health insurance, so is it that wrong to look at PW as energy insurance on top of other benefits (I know, you get 1:1 NEM, fine)?
 

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