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Wiki Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

bhtooefr

Active Member
Apr 16, 2018
1,156
6,633
Newark, OH, USA
Edit: There are technical challenges too. One of the reasons making superchargers so fantastic is that we just plug in. The charger know who is charging and where to send the bill. This is because our Teslas sends an unique ID to the charger. Other EVs lack this. Which is part of the reason why using other chargers is so cumbersome with apps, rfid-dongles and expensive to run payment stations.
That's... not as insurmountable as it seems.

First, Teslas don't, to my knowledge, send any ID to the charger. They just have a flag telling the charger whether they're authorized to charge, and the car then communicates the billing info for that charge session back to the mothership. (This is actually really insecure...)

Second, CCS does support the vehicle sending a unique ID to the charger, the VIN, and some charging networks actually use this to provide plug-and-charge, and I think all CCS vehicles support this. (A different, and potentially worse, potential security vulnerability exists here, as VIN spoofing may be possible.)

Third, CCS also has a (probably actually secure, but also incredibly over-engineered) mechanism using asymmetric cryptography and TLS (that is, the same tech used for HTTPS). Not all CCS vehicles support this, though.

Of course, both CCS authentication methods mean that a Tesla Supercharger install would need a data connection to the mothership that it isn't required to have to bill non-Teslas (because of the car's connection to the mothership being used instead).
 

JBRR

Member
Dec 13, 2015
960
19,399
UK
Tesla investors should be watching for M&A for S&P inclusion

"
The index committee aims to pick the companies that best represent their industries, while keeping the weighting of the sector in check against the others, which include information technology, health care, and financials, so the index's performance matches that of the overall market, one source said.

Mergers among companies in the index give committee members - the names of whom S&P does not make public - additional opportunities to readjust weightings based on the ever-changing dynamic of the market."

----

"
At any moment there are 25 to 50 companies that technically qualify to be in the index, but are not in, and a handful of those are companies the committee agrees are acceptable candidates when discussed in its monthly meetings, one source said.

With a big name like Tesla, it is tempting to look for a big exit from the index, the person said, adding that the committee tracks announced mergers, which are opportunities to make unscheduled additions.
"
 

Christine69420

Autopilot's Assistant
Supporting Member
Oct 19, 2018
1,343
16,521
Scandiwegian
That's... not as insurmountable as it seems.

First, Teslas don't, to my knowledge, send any ID to the charger. They just have a flag telling the charger whether they're authorized to charge, and the car then communicates the billing info for that charge session back to the mothership. (This is actually really insecure...)

Second, CCS does support the vehicle sending a unique ID to the charger, the VIN, and some charging networks actually use this to provide plug-and-charge, and I think all CCS vehicles support this. (A different, and potentially worse, potential security vulnerability exists here, as VIN spoofing may be possible.)

Third, CCS also has a (probably actually secure, but also incredibly over-engineered) mechanism using asymmetric cryptography and TLS (that is, the same tech used for HTTPS). Not all CCS vehicles support this, though.

Of course, both CCS authentication methods mean that a Tesla Supercharger install would need a data connection to the mothership that it isn't required to have to bill non-Teslas (because of the car's connection to the mothership being used instead).

I belive most cars don't implement the CCS ID system since it's not being used on chargers in Europe.

I agree that it's not impossible to solve. And Tesla have excellent engineers. But it will cost time and money.

The big issue though in my view is why risk reducing the excellent Supercharging Marketing effect? I still believe a configuration error in Germany might be all this is. But then my brain don't work like Elon's brain at all so what do I know?
 
Last edited:

Artful Dodger

"Ducimus, lit"
Aug 9, 2018
10,018
132,745
Canada
Tesla investors should be watching for M&A for S&P inclusion

"The index committee aims to pick the companies that best represent their industries, while keeping the weighting of the sector in check against the others, which include information technology, health care, and financials, so the index's performance matches that of the overall market, one source said.

"Mergers among companies in the index give committee members - the names of whom S&P does not make public - additional opportunities to readjust weightings based on the ever-changing dynamic of the market.

"At any moment there are 25 to 50 companies that technically qualify to be in the index, but are not in, and a handful of those are companies the committee agrees are acceptable candidates when discussed in its monthly meetings, one source said.

"With a big name like Tesla, it is tempting to look for a big exit from the index, the person said, adding that the committee tracks announced mergers, which are opportunities to make unscheduled additions."
"

LOL, damn. I thought this article was going to end with Tesla making an itsy-bitsy purchase of ETSY. :p

Cheers!
 

SPadival

Active Member
May 7, 2016
1,083
10,368
Oz
Battery day location confirmed.

tsla-defa14a_20200922.htm

grtg3q20j1fn000001.jpg
 

avoigt

Active Member
Sep 5, 2017
2,840
40,132
Germany
Our very own @avoigt has made a video of Tesla's presentation to the Brandenburg Parliament


It's my most watched video ever already after just 6 online days :D and has been fun to record.

My next video will be about the reactions and statements from all party fractions after the presentation from Tesla in the Brandenburg Parliament. That's even more interesting I believe as it allows a glance behind the political curtain in Germany and how they see Giga Berlin.

If you don't want to miss it, subscribe
 

ammulder

3P, X ordered
Supporting Member
Apr 11, 2019
1,272
4,681
Philly area
Sell the dog ICE car. I really don't understand having to suddenly take a trip with no time for Supercharging. But if it will ease her mind, show her how many days the money you spend on insurance, oil and batteries could cover car rentals for those mythical "no time for Supercharging" trips you will need to take.

Is she prepping for the zombie apocalypse? o_O

I guess rental cars are not the thing in the US ;)?!

Hoping over here that battery day announcements give a good reason to replace the minivan with an X for the "family car" (family of 6). But since we have additional family in the area, the minivan is paid, it's old and comes pre-beat-up so minor additional damage isn't really a concern, and it has a gigantic cargo area... It's not clear that it will be traded in as opposed to live a long and boring life visiting Ikea every couple months or whatever. Minivans aren't that cheap to rent.

Though, hopefully it would be worth enough as a trade-in to make the rental argument compelling.

Truly, hopefully there will be a significant enough announcement on the non-Plaid Model X to make this discussion worth having at all. :)
 
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dc_h

Active Member
Feb 14, 2015
3,542
13,442
Naperville, IL
Read the whole twitter thread - carsonight expects GF1 seeding GF Austin before cells are produced locally, just like it did for Shanghai.
Doesn’t make sense. No Austin cars for 7-8 months. Either for more Fremont cars or Semi or to send to Shanghai for the new Y production. Shanghai has likely been battery constrained. Since LFP batteries added production appears to have jumped on the 3 line. If they are adding 1000 weekly Y’s soon and much more heading into 2021, they’ll need a lot more batteries for Performance Model Y.
 

jerry33

(S85-3/2/13 traded in) X LR: F2611##-3/27/20
Supporting Member
Mar 8, 2012
19,998
24,672
Texas
I guess rental cars are not the thing in the US ;)?!
Driven too many rental cars in the past. Often dirty, questionable maintenance, time to get and return them, expensive. It's something you only do if you absolutely have to.
 
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Right_Said_Fred

Moderator
May 11, 2012
4,007
35,151
The Netherlands
Battery day location confirmed.

tsla-defa14a_20200922.htm

grtg3q20j1fn000001.jpg

It's going to be a long night for us Europeans. The Annual Meeting of Stockholders starts at 1:30 PT, which is 10.30 PM CET (and an hour earlier for the Brits). If the meeting takes 1,5 hours then Battery Day itself will only start at midnight. Elon time :rolleyes:

Good thing I'm off the next day :D
 

samppa

Member
Feb 17, 2019
463
2,174
My Island Cottage
I belive most cars don't implement the CCS ID system since it's not being used on chargers in Europe.

I agree that it's not impossible to solve. And Tesla have excellent engineers. But it will cost time and money.

The big issue though in my view is why risk reducing the excellent Supercharging Marketing effect? I still believe a configuration error in Germany might be all this is. But then my brain don't work like Elon's brain at all so what do I know?

So who figured this out? I'm kind of having a hard time believing it was by accident. Like "hey I just bought an Id.3., lets go to a Tesla supercharger to see if it charges?"
Kind of hard to believe. Was there any rumor beforehand?
 

H Mak

Member
Mar 16, 2020
480
7,527
Liverpool
It's going to be a long night for us Europeans. The Annual Meeting of Stockholders starts at 1:30 PT, which is 10.30 PM CET (and an hour earlier for the Brits). If the meeting takes 1,5 hours then Battery Day itself will only start at midnight. Elon time :rolleyes:

Good thing I'm off the next day :D

I'll be having a few beers and making a night of it :)
 

Christine69420

Autopilot's Assistant
Supporting Member
Oct 19, 2018
1,343
16,521
Scandiwegian
So who figured this out? I'm kind of having a hard time believing it was by accident. Like "hey I just bought an Id.3., lets go to a Tesla supercharger to see if it charges?"
Kind of hard to believe. Was there any rumor beforehand?

I don't know. But I have seen other EVs trying their luck on Superchargers before.
 
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UncaNed

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Apr 8, 2015
1,493
5,655
East coast
Cathie Wood has commented specifically that ARK Invest scenarios DO NOT include Tesla Energy because the other Analysts on Wall St. aren't including T.E.

ARK want's their SP targets to be directly comparible to other Wall St. estimates on an apples-to-apples basis (no easy-weasel route out when other firms are proven wrong).

This is NOT to say that ARK Invest thinks that T.E. is without value: it's to say in 5 yrs time ARK wants to show up the other Wall St. meringues for what they are. That's how they sell their ETF products, by demonstrating better insight. ;)

Cheers!
I wasn't aware Tesla Energy branched off from TSLA.
 

UkNorthampton

TSLA - 12+ startups in 1
Jun 15, 2019
779
7,042
Northampton, England
I don’t favor charging more or even the same amount as ionity at all. The goal is to accelerate the transition. I did the math. With the Ionity rate, the cost per distance travelled is higher than gas! And with gas we have the advantage that the money collected is mostly taxes (which we don’t have to pay in another manner, which will be necessary if Ionity is used). No, put the pressure on Ionity, make Tesla look good and charge less. Would improve the profitability (or reduce its loss) of the Supercharger.

On reflection, I agree. For me the mission is first priority, Tesla profit a close second (because it affects family investments). If Tesla Superchargers are supported by owners of other EVs, that will encourage more locations for Tesla and faster EV adoption. Ionity and others do need to be put under some competition, but I really want the ICE age to end. I want every petrol station to stop selling fuel and for pollution to be reduced especially in urban environments but also for climate change, rogue state, corruption and war reasons.
 

PaulusdB

Mayor Gnomus Vintage Limb
Jul 12, 2013
6,685
6,455
Europe
So who figured this out? I'm kind of having a hard time believing it was by accident. Like "hey I just bought an Id.3., lets go to a Tesla supercharger to see if it charges?"
Kind of hard to believe. Was there any rumor beforehand?
There was a report in the UK on Sept 1st of some Hyundai or Kia successfully plugging into a supercharger.
Non Tesla on a supercharger?
Funny that the poster wasn't believed until last week...
 

ProfTournesol

Member
Sep 23, 2018
319
1,435
Netherlands
It's going to be a long night for us Europeans. The Annual Meeting of Stockholders starts at 1:30 PT, which is 10.30 PM CET (and an hour earlier for the Brits). If the meeting takes 1,5 hours then Battery Day itself will only start at midnight. Elon time :rolleyes:

Good thing I'm off the next day :D
Night and next day cleared in the agenda!
 

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