Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Curt Renz]

From my brokerage's newsfeed:

Tesla Announces Date for Third Quarter 2020 Financial Results and Webcast
4:04 pm ET October 8, 2020 (Globe Newswire) Print

Tesla will post its financial results for the third quarter of 2020 after market close on Wednesday, October 21, 2020. At that time, Tesla will issue a brief advisory containing a link to the Q3 2020 update, which will be available on Tesla's Investor Relations website. Tesla management will hold a live question and answer webcast that day at 2:30 p.m. Pacific Time (5:30 p.m. Eastern Time) to discuss the Company's financial and business results and outlook.

EDIT: Verification from Tesla: News | Tesla Investor Relations

 

[lafrisbee]

I keep seeing people talking about Tesla Insurance (not picking on you DurandalAl - just a starting point), as if it's a serious business for Tesla -- either now or in the reasonably near future.

Can anybody point me to anything that suggests that Tesla Insurance is viewed as a serious business for Tesla, either now or in the future?


My understanding is that today it isn only available in California. My belief is that this will never be a serious business for Tesla - that biggest outcome intended would be Tesla acting in the role of a referral and bundler of a large number of new customers to an existing auto insurance company (i.e. - negotiating a special rate for "Tesla" insurance through State Farm, and then referring Tesla buyers to the "Tesla Insurance operated by State Farm" insurance policy).

I DO see this idea as something of a threat or nudge / motivation to the current auto insurance industry - start taking the improved safety and lower overall claims levels from Tesla vehicles into your premiums, or we'll just start up a competitor (or work with one of your competitors that IS doing this) and take your Tesla auto insurance premiums away from you.


In the meantime, the barriers to entry for Tesla as an insurance provider are very high. State by state licensing. Reserves so that Tesla can pay claims when needed. Building up a new division with the insurance business processes and expertise. It's this last point I see as a particularly large barrier - the Tesla insurance legal entity is going to need a fair bit of cash to get started, and will need to retain some reasonably large amount of reserve to be certain of being able to pay claims. Stuff that insurance companies do routinely and do well.

I imagine there are others here with a lot more insurance industry experience than me (who has ~none) and can articulate these barriers to entry better.


In the end, I see Tesla insurance as a money loser or break even for Tesla outside of a situation in which none of the current auto insurance providers see lower claims insuring Teslas and thus Tesla decides to go into competition by charging lower insurance premiums to insure Teslas.


Also worth adding, again MHO, is that it isn't completely clear to me that Teslas actually ARE cheaper to insure. Factors in favor of cheaper are fewer accidents, and reduced medical bills for the people in the Tesla when it does get in an accident.

Factors in favor of more expensive are that Teslas are totaled more frequently (I believe - don't have data to back this) and that seemingly minor damage leads to much larger repair bills (again - my belief, not data). Also that Teslas are more expensive on average than other cars on the road.

I think that the balance of those factors, mostly because of the medical bill side, DOES make Teslas cheaper to insure. Is it enough cheaper though for a standalone insurance business to flourish and generate significant profits though? I am firmly of the opinion that this is no, at least today and the foreseeable future. Get 10M Teslas on the road in the US - maybe then.


(and in the meantime, Tesla referring customers to a particular provider with typically good deals on auto insurance for Teslas - totally)

I'll add some salt to the soup....
First I think something along the lines of a critical density needs to be there for the insurance model to work.
But there has been one issue I have struggled with (without researching so those that are inclined to have the answer chime in), and that is the cost of repair parts. If Tesla wants to be the only insurer of Tesla vehicles then a funny little game can be played, a dirty game some may say...
Tesla could sell replacement parts at even HIGHER mark-ups than the other ICE OEMS currently do. The advantage would keep other insurance companies from having rates anywhere close to Teslas. When you add that to Tesla having all the data from the crash to decide the legal issues and therefore reduce the cost of litigation, as well as the cameras/data telling the truth in regard to injuries that were sustained (or not)...well the assholiness/greed of individuals and sectors of business no longer can gain monetarily from Tesla Insurance as it does in other insurance companies.
I do not believe there is a short solution and outcome, but identifying the culmination of gains Tesla Insurance will have over other Insurance companies when insuring Teslas is easy.
Tesla Insurance can get parts at a "reduced" price. Tesla can reduce litigation concerning who is responsible with all the sensor and camera data. And reduce false insurance claims with the sensor data and cameras as well.
Oh another free thought... Just like the "box" that some insurance companies are promoting in their commercials about being monitored as a "safe driver" to get a lower rate... that "box" has nothing on Tesla Insurance IF a driver agrees to let Tesla Insurance access to their data. The policyholder could even agree to more stringent parameters, such as the in car camera identifies when a non-owner is the driver the software automatically stays in "chill mode minus."
There are other significant money-saving agreements.
But the bigger BUMP in the road will be when does Tesla eliminate "Drivers' Insurance" all together. And how is that going to be handled? FSD all the time. What kind of insurance will Tesla have? hmmm seems like Elon needs to fully flesh out this insurance issue regardless, So a good place to start to get a grip on it will be with Tesla offering normal driver's insurance now.

 

[lafrisbee]

From my brokerage's newsfeed:

Tesla Announces Date for Third Quarter 2020 Financial Results and Webcast
4:04 pm ET October 8, 2020 (Globe Newswire) Print

Tesla will post its financial results for the third quarter of 2020 after market close on Wednesday, October 21, 2020. At that time, Tesla will issue a brief advisory containing a link to the Q3 2020 update, which will be available on Tesla's Investor Relations website. Tesla management will hold a live question and answer webcast that day at 2:30 p.m. Pacific Time (5:30 p.m. Eastern Time) to discuss the Company's financial and business results and outlook.

One week, One hour, and 13 minutes to go

~~~Shall I edit this??????~~~

OK OK So I missed it by a week,,,
Two weeks and 26 minutes to go

 

[StealthP3D]

Omg it almost happened to me the other day. It was at the final purchase confirmation page.

Now, how would a story like that make headlines. Any publicity is good publicity.
It shows just how simple it is to order.

I was terrified of butt-dialing an expensive Tesla upgrade but I fixed the problem by ordering all available upgrades pre-emptively.

Totally worth it!

/s

 

[bkp_duke]

One week, One hour, and 13 minutes to go

~~~Shall I edit this??????~~~

Yeah, probably a good idea to redo the math.

 

[Favguy]

One week, One hour, and 13 minutes to go

~~~Shall I edit this??????~~~

Not if you're writing this from the future...

Maybe now well see some buying in the run up...

 

[AudubonB]

Naah.....he was mean to his Mod a bit ago. Let him stew.

 

[ByeByeJohnny]

Insurance?

20 million cars/year = 200 million cars after a decade. $10 profit/month = $24 billion a year in profit.

That'll be chump change by then but still nothing to sneeze at.

 

[heltok]

From my brokerage's newsfeed:

Tesla Announces Date for Third Quarter 2020 Financial Results and Webcast
4:04 pm ET October 8, 2020 (Globe Newswire) Print

Tesla will post its financial results for the third quarter of 2020 after market close on Wednesday, October 21, 2020. At that time, Tesla will issue a brief advisory containing a link to the Q3 2020 update, which will be available on Tesla's Investor Relations website. Tesla management will hold a live question and answer webcast that day at 2:30 p.m. Pacific Time (5:30 p.m. Eastern Time) to discuss the Company's financial and business results and outlook.

EDIT: Verification from Tesla: News | Tesla Investor Relations

For the rest of the world the webcast will start: 21:30 UTC.

 

[EVMeister]

For the rest of the world the webcast will start: 21.30 UTC.

And for the weirdos, 22:30 BST.

 

[Tslynk67]

Congrats guys! We finally closed below the 40 million trades mark.

For what it's worth, volume looks low across all stocks on my watchlist - AAPL, for instance, 79M today, that's anaemic.

 

[Thumper]

BBC posted an article suggesting that autonomous vehicles will be energy hogs and thus polluters. Cites a study from Feb. 2018, almost 3 years old, authored by five folks, three of which are Ford employees. Very wrong conclusions even for the time it was published. I expect better from the Beeb.
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20201007-can-driverless-cars-tackle-climate-change

 

[adiggs]

I'll add some salt to the soup....
First I think something along the lines of a critical density needs to be there for the insurance model to work.
But there has been one issue I have struggled with (without researching so those that are inclined to have the answer chime in), and that is the cost of repair parts. If Tesla wants to be the only insurer of Tesla vehicles then a funny little game can be played, a dirty game some may say...
Tesla could sell replacement parts at even HIGHER mark-ups than the other ICE OEMS currently do. The advantage would keep other insurance companies from having rates anywhere close to Teslas. When you add that to Tesla having all the data from the crash to decide the legal issues and therefore reduce the cost of litigation, as well as the cameras/data telling the truth in regard to injuries that were sustained (or not)...well the assholiness/greed of individuals and sectors of business no longer can gain monetarily from Tesla Insurance as it does in other insurance companies.
I do not believe there is a short solution and outcome, but identifying the culmination of gains Tesla Insurance will have over other Insurance companies when insuring Teslas is easy.
Tesla Insurance can get parts at a "reduced" price. Tesla can reduce litigation concerning who is responsible with all the sensor and camera data. And reduce false insurance claims with the sensor data and cameras as well.
Oh another free thought... Just like the "box" that some insurance companies are promoting in their commercials about being monitored as a "safe driver" to get a lower rate... that "box" has nothing on Tesla Insurance IF a driver agrees to let Tesla Insurance access to their data. The policyholder could even agree to more stringent parameters, such as the in car camera identifies when a non-owner is the driver the software automatically stays in "chill mode minus."
There are other significant money-saving agreements.
But the bigger BUMP in the road will be when does Tesla eliminate "Drivers' Insurance" all together. And how is that going to be handled? FSD all the time. What kind of insurance will Tesla have? hmmm seems like Elon needs to fully flesh out this insurance issue regardless, So a good place to start to get a grip on it will be with Tesla offering normal driver's insurance now.

I gotta say that that I like how you think (or am disturbed by how you think - which might mean I'm disturbed how how I think!?!). But I also wonder why there aren't any captive insurance companies at other makers with this general idea.

The central point to all of my comments around insurance, is that offering insurance isn't as simple as putting a check box on a web page, figuring out the premium you'll charge, and *poof* you're in the insurance biz. It's a LOT more complex than that.

I'll stop now on that point, and hope that we'll hear from somebody with some industry knowledge about how easy/hard it is to enter the auto insurance business and what it actually takes.

 

[lafrisbee]

So Tesla has spent years on advanced battery design, space age manufacturing advances, and driving automation.

What has Audis EV division been up to?

Audi teases electric e-tron GT production version, releases 'progressive' sound of the supercar - Electrek
n-release-progressive-sound-supercar/

Development of the e-sound for the Audi e-tron GT with musical creativity and
technical competence; designed on the computer, in the sound laboratory, and in
the car

32 individual sound elements; weighted and modulated based on drive management
data

Optional sound package: two control units in the luggage compartment, two
external loudspeakers on the car and two internal loudspeakers in the rear
doors

Sound characteristics can be adjusted across multiple stages using Audi drive
select

All kidding aside, well perhaps I can put some "kidding" in it....
How hard would it be for a software engineer to... All those below could be choices from the screen. And the driver could choose both the internal interactive sound, AND an external sound stream.
Launch Mode should be enhanced....make the internal speakers mimic a SpaceX launch, with the official voice of the launches saying after a specific noise perhaps one that mimics the sound coming from the rocket "disengagement of the boosters has occurred" . And then at 100mph another spaceX mechanical sound with the Official Announcer saying something else truly "Space-ish" like "Separation of the Dragon capsule achieved." heck fill other bits in there like when the wheels first roll the announcement of "lift-off."
While those outside could hear the SpaceX Rocket launch noise AND be given audio And VISUAL cues that the vehicle has achieved various speeds... Something as simple as all the rear lights blink at 10mph increments with a long blink at 60mph, and a cascading visual at 100mph...
Animal lovers in Cheetah mode.... When in Cheetah stance the purr of the big cat comes over the speakers, a Cheetah running with the occasional leopard scream (as as far as I know a cheetah doesn't sound fearsome?) as the 60mph and 100mph are reached
.... for horsey people have a blend of Kentucky Derby gates opening and neighing with the "thundering hooves." heck that could work well for the outside noise too?
And then to make fun of the muscle car crowd give an option of various engines... Nascar, or F-1, or A dragster..even one of them rice burner idiot things that come through my town acting the fool..but have them do the "all exterior lights blink" at whatever desired speeds the Driver chooses.
Slap a big speaker on the outside, and giddyup! I'd easily pay a few hundred for that speaker and the software.

Oh I promised a funny/kidding one... right now just the way the Tesla vehicles "sit" a "soft"ware update could be done so all the seats fart when the accelerator is aggressively pressed and /or at certain speeds. Just a simple little "tweak."
Elon? You in a good mood today?

 

[Singuy]

For what it's worth, volume looks low across all stocks on my watchlist - AAPL, for instance, 79M today, that's anaemic.

AMD had a major product launch today, taking back the performance crown from Intel and their volume is 20% below average. Just one of those days.

 

[JRP3]

Possible macro impact tomorrow, there is talk of invoking a certain amendment. Probably nothing will come of it but markets might react.

 

[Singuy]

Possible macro impact tomorrow, there is talk of invoking a certain amendment. Probably nothing will come of it but markets might react.

Whaaaaat, that's crazy talk..unless people thinks dexamethasone is affecting his judgement. People makes way too big deal out of the drug. We dose pt a very small amount for Covid and most people are absolutely fine taking it for a short amount of time. Can you imagine all the crazy people who can't function because they are on a Medrol Dose pack?..lol.

 

[JRP3]

Whaaaaat, that's crazy talk

Exactly

 

[Singuy]

For those who can't get enough of Rob's sexy voice

 

[JRP3]

Get ready for another Tesla Killer article from Anton