Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Wiki Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

Lycanthrope

S3XY old dude
Supporting Member
Nov 15, 2013
9,778
75,771
At home
Good luck y'all!

upload_2020-12-18_14-27-39.png
 

Johan

Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Feb 9, 2012
7,496
9,788
Drammen, Norway
Interesting- some deep ITM covered calls (dated 2022) I had sold awhile back were exercised this morning.

Have you ever experienced that before? (I'm not a seasoned options trader and couldn't sell covered calls since my shares are held with my Norwegian broker while I trade options with a US brokerage, so I couldn't say of this would be common or uncommon. )
 

TheTalkingMule

Distributed Energy Enthusiast
Oct 20, 2012
7,215
27,586
Philadelphia, PA
Yeah, the $ is so weak right now against the € - I thought that with Biden getting in and some political stability coming it would strengthen.

Even though I'm in Europe, I keep my trading accounts in $ and just convert to € as-and-when I need it. Just that now I need some. Painful!
The irrational $ strength pre-pandemic was about us selling 13M barrels of oil a day and growing IMO. As a TSLA investor you know.....that's all over now. Petro-dollars in general could be said to be "over" now.
 

JBRR

Member
Dec 13, 2015
960
19,336
UK
Isn´t it the closing price that is relevant for options expiry? :confused:

I was under the impression that the witching expirires all took place on the close, but a recent email distribution from a goldman sachs guy says:
80a55c106a689c3b65dc0323a563ba89.png


Specifically related to TSLA, yes it's the closing price. But if all this stuff expires on open it will cause some ripples on its own.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: hobbes

FrankSG

Active Member
Jun 27, 2019
1,615
21,504
Singapore
Can anyone who uses IBKR help me with this?

I have 2 options positions expiring today which, if they end up in the money, I do not have the ability to exercise.

However, I may want to hold these positions until minutes before market close, or even until after market close. Although I may sell them earlier during the day, I may want to sell them during the cross, or even short the stock in AH if the options are ITM, and then buy back the shares through exercising the options.

I just talked to the IBKR trading desk, and was informed that (as I suspected) these positions will be automatically closed by them, because I will be unable to exercise them. As early as 12:30 Chicago time... I asked them to not do so, but the best the person I talked to could do for me is put in a request to the risk department, which he informed me usually isn't granted.

I'm kind of at a loss, because it sounds like IBKR will close these positions automatically as early as 1:30PM if they are ITM. Does anybody know of anything else I can do? Worst thing that could happen is that I lose internet connection, the options expire ITM, and I don't have the margin to exercise them. I don't understand why IBKR would have a problem with this.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: AZRI11 and FS_FRA

Congo Line

(not the dance)
Feb 2, 2013
146
780
East Coast
Until the past 24 hours, I was not aware of the availability of 'Market Close' orders, which could be useful to trade the closing cross.

TD Ameritrade offers this in their online ordering system.

Vanguard, surprisingly, does not. I called their representative this morning and they said their system was not equipped for it. I told the rep that I was going to transfer my shares pronto. Hard to believe that an institution of their size doesn't have this.
 

TheTalkingMule

Distributed Energy Enthusiast
Oct 20, 2012
7,215
27,586
Philadelphia, PA
Interesting to note that almost 50% of the gamma (increasing delta with price phenomenon) is from options expiring today (~35 percentage points) and next week (~14 percentage points). As holders of these options sell, that should provide some additional liquidity to the index buyers. I'd say these option holders are well positioned to profit off and provide liquidity at the same time. They represent anywhere from 21 to 36 million shares (net) in at prices ranging from here to 800 (raw numbers would be 35 to 60 million).
Wouldn't you expect almost a net increase in contracts today as SP and IV spike? Today in particular since most inclusion play options are 12/24, 12/31, 1/15?

I would think we'll see a tons of covered call writing on a SP spike today and also a ton of put buying from the post-inclusion decline crowd.
 
Last edited:

Nocturnal

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Aug 23, 2018
6,678
35,816
Deepening Crisis!
Do I need to be doing somethng with my Fidelity IRA account to make sure contracts aren't executed before I want? Keep hearing these posts about random executions by brokers.
I think you missed that those were sold contracts so the buyer can exercise them at will.
PM Preparty :cool:
Ok but I can't start drinking yet. I have to at least wait until market open which is 830AM for me.

Vanguard, surprisingly, does not. I called their representative this morning and they said their system was not equipped for it. I told the rep that I was going to transfer my shares pronto. Hard to believe that an institution of their size doesn't have this.
Same experience here. "oh, that's a thing? Oh, apparently Vanguard doesn't offer them.":rolleyes: I guess you can set a ladder of limit sells to do something similar?
 

bkp_duke

Well-Known Member
May 15, 2016
5,316
17,383
San Diego, CA
Legit question:

How do you put in a limit sale in Fidelity for a share price of like $2000? Fidelity restricts limit prices to 50% above current market price.

I'm a HODLer, but am willing to part with some shares if the price basically triples from where it is now.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: jerry33

15Peter20

Member
Oct 26, 2020
469
2,511
Norfolk
I think you missed that those were sold contracts so the buyer can exercise them at will.

Ok but I can't start drinking yet. I have to at least wait until market open which is 830AM for me.


Same experience here. "oh, that's a thing? Oh, apparently Vanguard doesn't offer them.":rolleyes: I guess you can set a ladder of limit sells to do something similar?
Lunchtime here in the UK. Drinking has begun.
 

generalenthu

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Jun 10, 2015
1,187
9,805
Vienna, VA
Can anyone who uses IBKR help me with this?

I have 2 options positions expiring today which, if they end up in the money, I do not have the ability to exercise.

However, I may want to hold these positions until minutes before market close, or even until after market close. Although I may sell them earlier during the day, I may want to sell them during the cross, or even short the stock in AH if the options are ITM, and then buy back the shares through exercising the options.

I just talked to the IBKR trading desk, and was informed that (as I suspected) these positions will be automatically closed by them, because I will be unable to exercise them. As early as 12:30 Chicago time... I asked them to not do so, but the best the person I talked to could do for me is put in a request to the risk department, which he informed me usually isn't granted.

I'm kind of at a loss, because it sounds like IBKR will close these positions automatically as early as 1:30PM if they are ITM. Does anybody know of anything else I can do? Worst thing that could happen is that I lose internet connection, the options expire ITM, and I don't have the margin to exercise them. I don't understand why IBKR would have a problem with this.
did you consider buying some cheap OTM puts for next week that will provide you the insurance to take delivery an hold till Monday? I dont think you can trade options on a cross, but worth double checking.
 
  • Like
Reactions: saniflash

jerry33

(S85-3/2/13 traded in) X LR: F2611##-3/27/20
Supporting Member
Mar 8, 2012
19,945
23,818
Texas
Legit question:

How do you put in a limit sale in Fidelity for a share price of like $2000? Fidelity restricts limit prices to 50% above current market price.

I'm a HODLer, but am willing to part with some shares if the price basically triples from where it is now.
I got out of Fidelity as soon as I was able. (e.g. wasn't required at work anymore).
 
  • Like
Reactions: Congo Line

FrankSG

Active Member
Jun 27, 2019
1,615
21,504
Singapore
did you consider buying some cheap OTM puts for next week that will provide you the insurance to take delivery an hold till Monday? I dont think you can trade options on a cross, but worth double checking.

I meant sell the options during the last 5 minutes of market hours, when the cross is taking shape.

I don't think that strategy could work. The farthest OTM position is probably too large a number of contracts.
 

mulder1231

Active Member
Jan 1, 2012
1,814
10,163
SF Bay Area
Legit question:

How do you put in a limit sale in Fidelity for a share price of like $2000? Fidelity restricts limit prices to 50% above current market price.

I'm a HODLer, but am willing to part with some shares if the price basically triples from where it is now.

Fast fingers. You enter the limit order when price is at $1333
 

Products we're discussing on TMC...

About Us

Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.

Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


SUPPORT TMC
Top