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Wiki Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

willow_hiller

Active Member
Apr 3, 2019
3,210
15,829
Maryland
Until the past 24 hours, I was not aware of the availability of 'Market Close' orders, which could be useful to trade the closing cross.

Asked this in the trading thread as well, but it may receive a bit more bandwidth here...

Does anyone know if there's any functional difference between a Limit on Close and a Limit Day order in so far as participating in the closing cross is concerned? I would assume both would be considered equally (with the only difference being the Limit Day could fill anytime between 9:30 AM and 4:00 PM, and the Limit on Close could only fill exactly at 4 PM), but I don't know if there's any special consideration for the Limit on Close in that closing cross auction.
 

larmor

Active Member
Oct 27, 2014
2,252
5,881
Westlake, TX
Yeah I heard something similar. And when they all show up at 15.55 and get offered $800 for their shares they'll of course do the responsible thing and say "Oh no sir, I couldn't accept that kind of premium, I'm here to supply the market with ample liquidity, my job is not to make money but to make sure the index funds can buy all the shares they need at a stable price point".

7:38 AM and almost 0,5 million shares tradet pre-market up $3 from yesterday's ATH close.
I also heard that they are whispering to each other at arms length and still holding hands per their anti-tryst agreement, at least that's what Mr Sherman told me...
 
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traxila

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Nov 25, 2012
1,880
11,327
NYC
Can anyone who uses IBKR help me with this?

I have 2 options positions expiring today which, if they end up in the money, I do not have the ability to exercise.

However, I may want to hold these positions until minutes before market close, or even until after market close. Although I may sell them earlier during the day, I may want to sell them during the cross, or even short the stock in AH if the options are ITM, and then buy back the shares through exercising the options.

I just talked to the IBKR trading desk, and was informed that (as I suspected) these positions will be automatically closed by them, because I will be unable to exercise them. As early as 12:30 Chicago time... I asked them to not do so, but the best the person I talked to could do for me is put in a request to the risk department, which he informed me usually isn't granted.

I'm kind of at a loss, because it sounds like IBKR will close these positions automatically as early as 1:30PM if they are ITM. Does anybody know of anything else I can do? Worst thing that could happen is that I lose internet connection, the options expire ITM, and I don't have the margin to exercise them. I don't understand why IBKR would have a problem with this.

An MOC trade is an option on IBKR for options.

Never used it but perhaps this will be something IBKR allows you to do that guarantees it will sell at the close?

I think you would have to speak to them again and get details.
 

vikings123

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
May 27, 2019
1,129
8,485
MN
Can anyone who uses IBKR help me with this?

I have 2 options positions expiring today which, if they end up in the money, I do not have the ability to exercise.

However, I may want to hold these positions until minutes before market close, or even until after market close. Although I may sell them earlier during the day, I may want to sell them during the cross, or even short the stock in AH if the options are ITM, and then buy back the shares through exercising the options.

I just talked to the IBKR trading desk, and was informed that (as I suspected) these positions will be automatically closed by them, because I will be unable to exercise them. As early as 12:30 Chicago time... I asked them to not do so, but the best the person I talked to could do for me is put in a request to the risk department, which he informed me usually isn't granted.

I'm kind of at a loss, because it sounds like IBKR will close these positions automatically as early as 1:30PM if they are ITM. Does anybody know of anything else I can do? Worst thing that could happen is that I lose internet connection, the options expire ITM, and I don't have the margin to exercise them. I don't understand why IBKR would have a problem with this.

Is this on a margin account? If so IB will automatically exercise them for you if they are ITM. On a cash account they usually wait until 3:55 EST to liquidate them.
 

TheTalkingMule

Distributed Energy Enthusiast
Oct 20, 2012
7,259
27,999
Philadelphia, PA
Legit question:

How do you put in a limit sale in Fidelity for a share price of like $2000? Fidelity restricts limit prices to 50% above current market price.

I'm a HODLer, but am willing to part with some shares if the price basically triples from where it is now.
Best you can do is put in contingent orders with a trigger that is also +50%. It's in the 'order type' dropdown.

i.e. If SP is $600, you set the trigger at $900 and the sell order at $1350.

There may be a multi-trigger way to do it, but I didn't see an obvious route.
 

Dan Detweiler

Active Member
Apr 21, 2016
3,064
12,924
Canton, Georgia
popcornHOR-11.png
No money to buy more...no need to sell. Just gonna sit at the computer with a lot of this and watch the fireworks today. HODL for the win!



Dan
 

FS_FRA

Member
Sep 4, 2018
445
3,401
Frankfurt, Germany
Yeah, the $ is so weak right now against the € - I thought that with Biden getting in and some political stability coming it would strengthen.

Even though I'm in Europe, I keep my trading accounts in $ and just convert to € as-and-when I need it. Just that now I need some. Painful!

In Germany, the only way to trade US options is to keep the trading account in US$, as well as having the shares in US "custody". Thats why I switched to InteractiveBrokers from Comdirect.

Is this the same in Belgium, or why keep the account in $?

I'm not even thinking about currency loss right now, future FS_FRA problem :D
 
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ZeApelido

Active Member
Jun 1, 2016
3,272
28,390
The Peninsula, CA

UncaNed

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Apr 8, 2015
1,486
5,445
East coast
I got out of Fidelity as soon as I was able. (e.g. wasn't required at work anymore).
Can anyone help with a Fidelity related question?

A friend of mine -new to investing (edit- about 54 years old) has a Fidelity 401k and wants to invest in TSLA but they wont let him. How can he roll over into an IRA or something that will let him buy TSLA? He's still employed at the same place...

Does he have any good options (paths) to TSLA with that money other than waiting till he's 59-1/2?

(Thanks, @Zero CO2 ,@2daMoon and others!)
 
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generalenthu

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Jun 10, 2015
1,189
9,830
Vienna, VA
Wouldn't you expect almost a net increase in contracts today as SP and IV spike? Today in particular since most inclusion play options are 12/24, 12/31, 1/15?

I would think we'll see a tons of covered call writing on a SP spike today and also a ton of put buying from the post-inclusion decline crowd.
Anything is possible. this is such a unique situation.
 

FrankSG

Active Member
Jun 27, 2019
1,615
21,504
Singapore
Is this on a margin account? If so IB will automatically exercise them for you if they are ITM. On a cash account they usually wait until 3:55 EST to liquidate them.

Margin account yes, but I don't have any margin.

Person on phone told me they'll liquidate them as early as 12:30 Chicago time :eek:

I don't want them exercised. In total the options would cost ~4.5x my current account value to exercise.

I'd just like them to not automatically exercise and not liquidate them to protect from auto exercise.

The person on the phone seemed to tell me I couldn't stop the liquidation, but I'll try calling again around 10AM or 10:30AM to try to reason with them again. I'm guessing they'll be too busy around open to answer my call.
 

dakh

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Jun 14, 2015
1,140
2,494
Seattle, WA
Can anyone who uses IBKR help me with this?

I have 2 options positions expiring today which, if they end up in the money, I do not have the ability to exercise.

However, I may want to hold these positions until minutes before market close, or even until after market close. Although I may sell them earlier during the day, I may want to sell them during the cross, or even short the stock in AH if the options are ITM, and then buy back the shares through exercising the options.

I just talked to the IBKR trading desk, and was informed that (as I suspected) these positions will be automatically closed by them, because I will be unable to exercise them. As early as 12:30 Chicago time... I asked them to not do so, but the best the person I talked to could do for me is put in a request to the risk department, which he informed me usually isn't granted.

I'm kind of at a loss, because it sounds like IBKR will close these positions automatically as early as 1:30PM if they are ITM. Does anybody know of anything else I can do? Worst thing that could happen is that I lose internet connection, the options expire ITM, and I don't have the margin to exercise them. I don't understand why IBKR would have a problem with this.

Yeah same boat here, best I can think of is to roll them forward 1 week before they get forcefully liquidated.
 
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Zero CO2

a long term goal
Supporting Member
Apr 24, 2017
909
4,254
A Mountain
Friend of mine has a Fidelity 401k and wants to invest in TSLA but they wont let him. How can he roll over into an IRA or something that will let him. He's still employed there.
Fidelity has a trading option in many 401K plans called "brokerage link"... have him look into brokerage link first ...I don't think you can trade options(not positive about this) there are some restrictions on what funds can be moved to brokerage link directly ...
I have a brokerage link account tied to my 401k ... it has 100% TSLA shares:rolleyes:
 

2daMoon

Mostly Harmless
Nov 25, 2020
993
7,617
Terra
Friend of mine has a Fidelity 401k and wants to invest in TSLA but they wont let him. How can he roll over into an IRA or something that will let him. He's still employed there.

If the friend meets the 59 1/2 years old IRS threshhold, they can roll 401K into an IRA. But it probably wouldn't be done in time to do any trading today.
 

FrankSG

Active Member
Jun 27, 2019
1,615
21,504
Singapore
Yeah same boat here, best I can think of is to roll them forward 1 week before they get forcefully liquidated.

I was thinking this would be too costly, but I guess they'll only get liquidated if ITM, and if they're ITM, they should be cheaper to roll-over.

If there's absolutely no way to reason with IBKR, I'll probably do this. Thank you!
 
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