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...how is that accurate?

- Paris Climate Accord: 128 countries
- Infrastructure Bill
- All the countries are moving over to cancelling out carbon emissions
- All the monies are transitioning to (clean) energy
- All the auto manufacturers are literally saying: "yes, EV plz - has batteriez?"
- All the energy companies, that help spur on this mess / progress, are transitioning to solar
- Utilities are like "yes plz, no blackouts + bling bling dolla dolla in t3h margins"

who's left? Bernie Sanders? Mitch McConnell?

There is a lot of talk and posturing by politicians ans corporations. Still very little actual action.

Exactly. It's about delaying the transition to preserve self-interests. OEMs talk about "by 2030" because they still want to be able to sell ICE cars for most of the decade...because that's what they calculate they need to do in order to survive financially. Utilities haven't figured out how to not get squashed by solar and customers having the ability to energy arbitrage, so they're trying to stop it/slow it down at the policy level. The dominant infrastructure companies don't yet have strategies in place to profit massively from the transition, so they ask politicians for a little more time behind closed doors. And fossils, well duh.

Of course these entities will do what's in their corporate best-interest, but the public needs to demand change NOW, not when it's financially convenient for the entities in question. It's this preservation of apathy...the lack of urgency to act quickly and in some cases make sacrifices...that OEMs, utilities, fossils, and others are depending on and what they are trying to maintain with their messaging. "We're going electric and it will be great...but it will take some time." Public needs to respond with "You're too late. We need this NOW, your bottom-line be damned."
 
If they were serious at this point, we would already see:
- end of fossil fuel subsidies
- implementation of a carbon tax
- subsidies for clean energy significantly expanded.
- an end to the "green hydrogen" lie.
- massive news coverage of man made global warming.

Maybe - in my life experiences, it's really easy to get things done quickly when you're 1 person (or a small team), less so with 7.8 billion potential voters (either by foot, proxy, or mouth). Once a decision is made in the former situation, it can be easily undone and/or have a higher probability of failure/learning because you can move on quicker. For the latter, decisions made via things as complex as the law can't and take forever if not ever (e.g. ACA here in the United States) to be changed/rescinded if wanted by people in power.

Again, climate change is a problem not against other people. It's against our own environment that may/may not be "alive" depending on your beliefs. For people, that touches on practically every aspect of civilization if you include belief structures. You need a spearhead like Tesla to make it happen that can work in isolation away from entities that require a lot of "talking heads" to get to a decision. To the entire clean energy community to get this far is incredible, this is a made win to me in terms of Tesla's investment viability. It's just a matter of what state the world is going to be in until it pushes through to succeed and get everyone back to normalcy.
 
Maybe this will help give some people some perspective. A list, in no particular order and just off the top of my head, of things more important than S & X:

Every Tesla Solar product
Every Tesla Energy product +++++
Model 3
Model Y
Model 2 - Asia version, European version, NA version and every other version
Semi
GigaBerlin
GigaTexas
GigaEverywhere else in the world
Cybertruck and not because it hits a new segment of the market but more so what its revolutionary engineering will become moving forward
All battery innovation including mining/material extraction processes
FSD
Tesla Network/robotaxis
 
Maybe this will help give some people some perspective. A list, in no particular order and just off the top of my head, of things more important than S & X:

Every Tesla Solar product
Every Tesla Energy product +++++
Model 3
Model Y
Model 2 - Asia version, European version, NA version and every other version
Semi
GigaBerlin
GigaTexas
GigaEverywhere else in the world
Cybertruck and not because it hits a new segment of the market but more so what its revolutionary engineering will become moving forward
All battery innovation including mining/material extraction processes
FSD
Tesla Network/robotaxis
No $$ to be made in any of those categories you have listed 😊
 
I think Recycling could be huge too once batteries area actually below ~80% (70%?) original capacity....which seems to take a really loong time so far.

I hear a lot about material mining for batteries from the anti EV / pro oil crowd. recycling removes most of that concern & would surely save cost on raw/material processing
Maybe this will help give some people some perspective. A list, in no particular order and just off the top of my head, of things more important than S & X:
that is a weird E ?
 
Maybe this will help give some people some perspective. A list, in no particular order and just off the top of my head, of things more important than S & X:

Every Tesla Solar product
Every Tesla Energy product +++++
Model 3
Model Y
Model 2 - Asia version, European version, NA version and every other version
Semi
GigaBerlin
GigaTexas
GigaEverywhere else in the world
Cybertruck and not because it hits a new segment of the market but more so what its revolutionary engineering will become moving forward
All battery innovation including mining/material extraction processes
FSD
Tesla Network/robotaxis

Agreed, those will be higher priorities than yet-another-refresh for S/X. It will also depend on the competition: when there's ANY mass produced EV that can rival the price/performance bargain of the Palladium S/X then Tesla will have external pressure to update. Lucid Air is aptly named vapourware, and don't even get me started on the Mercedes EIEIQ... ( ♫ ol' Mercedes had a fahren, EI-EI-Q ♫)

I do expect the 18650s to be replaced by Kato Rd 4680s within about 3 years (unless Panasonic is willing to dramatically drop the prices on their existing cells). Even then, the tighter logistics of the 1-mile bty supply chain may be irresistible.

I think it will make the most sense for Roadster and Palladium to share the same bty pack/power train. To me, that implies either "don't expect the Roadster too soon", or "expect the Roadster to arrive with a Palladium pack". Either way, these high-end 'Halo' cars will be the best-of-breed, and kept in a position of technological leadership.

I expect the current assembly line for Palladium (buildout and ramped this year), will be used for the typical +/-7 yr production run. Another consideration may be how California treats Tesla Fremont, and if that coincides with the need to build a new $billion paint shop. Still, the West Coast will remain the world's hottest market for EVs for some decades, and Tesla will position themselves to supply that demand.

Giga Texas will become the center of the Teslaverse over time, but Fremont will always be home. (remains to be seen if we can ever go home again...) :p

Cheers!
 
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There is a lot of talk and posturing by politicians ans corporations. Still very little actual action.
Exactly this. And IMO the Infrastructure Bill and the entire process that started with a Green New Deal that was designed to invest orders of magnitude more money into accelerating sustainable energy and transportation - and that has arrived at a place where corporate-owned politicians are smiling for photo ops while they water down the Green New Deal to include benefits for Big Pharma, Insurance companies and existing grid operators while it moves the needle from 2030 to at least 2035 and removes significant opportunities for the middle and lower class is very disappointing. And yet because it has now literally been years since AOC had to stage a sit-in in Pelosi's office because Pelosi refused to even read the Green New Deal or bring it up for discussion, and it has now been years since Mark Jacobson of Stanford - perhaps one of our greatest minds available regarding transitioning the planet effectively and efficiently towards a net-zero future had not only fully embraced and endorsed the Green New Deal in its original form while encouraging world-wide adoption of a similar plan................many of us have allowed ourselves to be more accepting of the thin piece of cake about to be served, instead of the whole cake - because of course 'its the best we can do, and because we need to be pragmatic, and because we might not be able to get more than this passed with all the opposition.......even though we are the majority in all three branches now (Ssshhhh - don't tell anyone.........especially when the whole Western 1/2 of the United States is on fire, and Europe and China are living through record flooding events).....

And for all of us that believe that it is Climate Change that is the most important challenge we face today, the watering-down of the original Green New Deal to a fraction of it’s original form by House Dems has also been a bit of test to not succumb to cognitive dissonance simply because we are hoping for Tesla to qualify for new EV tax credits and TSLA shares to increase in value, and because 'it's my team that is watering it down so it must be necessary.' Another summer living in horrible air quality and poor visibility from the fires that surround us here in the Pacific NW is a great reminder to recall the details of the original Green New Deal that included some of the following promises:

  • Build enough renewable energy generation capacity for the nation’s growing needs. Currently, four federal Power Marketing Administrations (PMAs) and the Tennessee Valley Authority generate and transmit power to distribution utilities in 33 states. We will create one more PMA to cover the remaining states and territories and expand the existing PMAs to build more than enough wind, solar, energy storage and geothermal power plants. We will spend $1.52 trillion on renewable energy and $852 billion to build energy storage capacity. Together, with an EPA federal renewable energy standard, this will fully drive out non-sustainable generation sources.
  • The renewable energy generated by the Green New Deal will be publicly owned, managed by the Federal Power Marketing Administrations, the Bureau of Reclamation and the Tennessee Valley Authority and sold to distribution utilities with a preference for public power districts, municipally- and cooperatively-owned utilities with democratic, public ownership, and other existing utilities that demonstrate a commitment to the public interest. The Department of Energy will provide technical assistance to states and municipalities that would like to establish publicly owned distribution utilities or community choice aggregation programs in their communities. Electricity will be sold at current rates to keep the cost of electricity stable during this transition.
  • Build a modern smart grid. A smart grid means a resilient, secure, and intelligent electric grid system that is capable of managing high amounts of renewable energy, charging electric vehicles quickly, and maximizing efficiency. We will spend $526 billion on a modern, high-volt, underground, renewable, direct current, smart, electric transmission and distribution grid will ensure our transition to 100 percent sustainable energy is safe and smooth.
  • Fully electrify and decarbonize our transportation sector. We will create a federal grant and zero-emission vehicle program to create a 100 percent renewable transportation sector. Zero-emission vehicle programs are already having success all across the country. In order to transition to 100 percent electric vehicles powered with renewable energy instead of expensive fossil fuels, we will institute:
    • Grants to purchase a new EV. Provide $2.09 trillion in grants to low- and moderate-income families and small businesses to trade in their fossil fuel-dependent vehicles for new electric vehicles. Currently purchasers of electric vehicles are wealthier than buyers of conventional cars. As president, Bernie will make sure working families share the benefits of this transition and nobody is left behind.
  • Electric vehicle charging infrastructure. In order to ensure that no one is ever stranded without the ability to charge their vehicle, we will spend $85.6 billion building a national electric vehicle charging infrastructure network similar to the gas stations and rest stops we have today. We will also ensure that new EV stations are open access and interoperable between all payment systems. Under our plan, drivers will no longer need to worry about where to charge their car or if they can pay for it.
  • School and transit buses. Provide $407 billion in grants for states to help school districts and transit agencies replace all school and transit buses with electric buses. Once older buses are replaced with clean electric buses, school districts will save in fuel and maintenance costs over the life cycle of the bus.
  • Replace all shipping trucks. Because this nation depends heavily on goods that are shipped all over the country by truckers, we must ensure that they are able to keep up their pace while we meet our climate goals. That means we must spend $216 billion to replace all diesel tractor trailer trucks with fast-charging and long-range electric trucks. Truck drivers from the largest fleets to small owner-operators will be able to access this funding.
And of course much, much more. But hey, at least now we have a deal that benefits and protects current grid owner/operators by only including "$73 billion to upgrade the electric power grid, increasing its ability to carry much larger amounts of renewable energy", while efforts are ramped up to wipe out net metering programs and any efforts to build a more distributed and robust grid from the bottom up........as @gene has pointed out on numerous occasions recently. And none of us can yet figure out where the remaining budget is really destined to go, but know it isn't going into the places that would have made the much needed immediate impact, and only 'tens of Billions' are now going into a transition to renewables per Bernie's address to the nation last week.

Yep - I too hope the EV tax credits that 'might' be announced later in the year help the rate of increase of my TSLA stock keep up with the rate of increase of airborne particulates, the air quality index, and the summer temperatures here in the pacific northwest this year while we work to create some small tax credits and of course help Berkshire Hathaway and others transition their investments and holding from coal and natural gas to their own solar and wind farms while we invest a small amount of money into improving the grid for their continued use.

We can do better. Demographics of people like those here on TMC know this to be true. We need to speak up, and we need to be willing to criticize our own team from time to time............especially when the planet is on fire.
 
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Tesla's response to Mercedes-Benz:

1626977953195.png


Left out the direct link because we all love Fred here 🤣

And in other China related news:

1626978049546.png
 
This is all we need to know:

View attachment 686919
It's not as stupid as this.

What car company is dumb enough to take one of their ridiculously heavy gas guzzlers (G wagaon is one of the few vehicles to meet the weight requirements for the accelerated depreciation loophole) with no aerodynamics and turn it into an EV? Can you imagine?

Oh, well crap...
HoHumEV will be over 9k, and probably so will the EVG Wagon.
 
I am expecting that for combined Megacharger/Supercharger sites with lots of stalls.

I think they may be able to get at least 1 kW of solar panels on a typical parking spot.
A lot varies with location but I think 6 kwh per pay per spot is a fairly conservative number. it could be higher say 10 kWh.
But if we say 10 stalls, the site generates 60 kWh per day, while it is a low amount, it will pay for the solar panels.

Sites need to be Supercharger V3 and have batteries to install solar, as sites get larger, it makes more sense.
We're talking about solar at Superchargers. Limited space and need for significant storage is a challenge at most SC locations.

What no one is talking about, and what I cannot understand, is why there are not solar panels covering the Gigafactories. There is also plenty of land for storage systems. The factories seem like a perfect places for virtual power plants. What am I missing? It seems that we (Tesla) are not "walking the walk".
 
But the extra profit from those models isn’t necessary. That’s the whole point. The resources; engineering manpower at the top of the list, can be better spent accelerating the mission via other projects. S & X are now fluff. The mission is more important than the margins. That’s the whole point.

Around here it seems every other car is a Suburban or minivan or the like. Big, big SUVs. Some families have 4 kids and some just, I don’t know, go big. It’s pretty common for households here to have one midsize SUV and one three-row SUV, or even two three-row vehicles. So I don’t think it’s a winning strategy to eliminate the X until/unless the Cybertruck proves that it can cut into the SUV market not just the pickup market.

Even if people can’t afford the X, I think it’s crucial for Tesla to not be the small-car-and-smaller-car company, aerodynamics be damned.
 
When it comes to the S/X, it's important for them to keep those lines going because as battery prices fall for Tesla when the 4680's mature in volume and all the efficiencies are realized, along with other continually efficiencies in making the S/X, I see them potentially being able to lower the prices enough to where they would have enough demand for 200k S/X annually. Granted right now they're limited on production volume + strong demand which is why they're increasing prices........but long term when the volumes are higher and the battery cost reductions and efficiencies are realized, they would have the margin overhead to drop the prices pretty significantly which would open up the S/X to a much broader consumer pool.

200-250k annual volume wouldn't be anything to sneeze at in terms of revenue at a ASP of say 70-80k (between the P and LR)
 
Around here it seems every other car is a Suburban or minivan or the like. Big, big SUVs. Some families have 4 kids and some just, I don’t know, go big. It’s pretty common for households here to have one midsize SUV and one three-row SUV, or even two three-row vehicles. So I don’t think it’s a winning strategy to eliminate the X until/unless the Cybertruck proves that it can cut into the SUV market not just the pickup market.

Even if people can’t afford the X, I think it’s crucial for Tesla to not be the small-car-and-smaller-car company, aerodynamics be damned.
I'm hoping the refresh reduces some of the issues with the X and makes it easier to build and perhaps cheaper. People love big SUVs and the Cybertruck will probably not appeal to suburban moms.
 
Chinese automakers can now start trading their NEV credits, what does this mean for NIO, XPeng, and Li Auto? - CnEVPost

Car companies including NIO, XPeng Motors, Li Auto, Tesla China, and BYD have accumulated a lot of new energy credits last year, and now they can start trading them.

Chinese automakers can trade their credits now, with a centralized trading deadline of Aug. 31, according to a document released by the Ministry of Industry and Information Technology (MIIT) dated July 15.

...

Tesla received more than 860,000 new energy credits in China in 2020, the most of any car company, valued at RMB 2.58 billion.
 
numbers don't quite align
What part are you saying is no aligning?
The numbers from Moneyball's tweets are aligning with the total Q1 production number shared by @The Accountant.
This sum for Q1 for Shanghai seems to not be far off from the P&D numbers?
 
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Chinese automakers can now start trading their NEV credits, what does this mean for NIO, XPeng, and Li Auto? - CnEVPost

Car companies including NIO, XPeng Motors, Li Auto, Tesla China, and BYD have accumulated a lot of new energy credits last year, and now they can start trading them.

Chinese automakers can trade their credits now, with a centralized trading deadline of Aug. 31, according to a document released by the Ministry of Industry and Information Technology (MIIT) dated July 15.

...

Tesla received more than 860,000 new energy credits in China in 2020, the most of any car company, valued at RMB 2.58 billion.

If I'm reading/understanding this correctly, Tesla has until Aug 31st to sell these credits, upon which they'll receive roughly 400 million dollars which will go straight to Q3 profit numbers?
 
We're talking about solar at Superchargers. Limited space and need for significant storage is a challenge at most SC locations.

What no one is talking about, and what I cannot understand, is why there are not solar panels covering the Gigafactories. There is also plenty of land for storage systems. The factories seem like a perfect places for virtual power plants. What am I missing? It seems that we (Tesla) are not "walking the walk".

For example, the grid in Nevada is largely powered by renewables. And the State of NV has provided Tesla with a generous energy tariff for electricity at Giga Nevada, which extends over the next few years.

Tesla adding (more) solar at Sparks would NOT result in CO2 emissions reductions, and would simply increase Tesla's capital cost, to no benefit. When the time comes, Tesla will add a solar farm near GF1, and the Megapacks it will take to buffer that energy. Not cheap, but the time and economics is coming.

C.f. San Franciso. The whole city is now backed up by 3GWh of Tesla Megapacks at Moss Landing. This is a project who's time is now.

Cheers!