Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[UnknownSoldier]

Damn it's time to invest in SpaceX?!

 

[Curt Renz]

Those of you with high price GTC sell orders to stop the shares from being lent out:

1) What price did you choose? LIkes $5,000? More/less?
2) ETrade doesn't do forever GTC. 30 or 90 days are default, but I can set something a year or more out. Thoughts?
3) Is this really worth the bother?

TIA!

Some brokerages limit the percentage above the current price for a GTC. Mine doesn't, but automatically makes it good for for only 4 months. I set a GTC at nearly twice the current price, and adjust when necessary.

Obviously I feel it is worth the bother. What's really needed is for almost all shareholders to do this.

If a GTC is in place, my brokerage does not lend shares to short sellers, even if the client is into margin. Check with your brokerage for its policies.

 

[Zaxxon]

If it didn’t auger well I don’t think we’d find ourselves in the hole you’re thinking.

Quit digging, folks...

Damn it's time to invest in SpaceX?!

It's been time for years! Just never easy.

 

[SunCatcher]

Let's hope they don't strike oil, you know, "black gold", 'cause that could really slow down the amount of revenue this site could produce!

Especially since they're in Texas; might put a stop to site development, with some arguing that the oil should be protected under the Endangered Commodities Act.

 

[Off Shore]

View attachment 576365 My official retirement date from the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power will be 1 September 2020. Actually, I’m promoting to avocado farmer.

View attachment 576364

Thanks Elon

Of course, that old farm house will need a new roof...

Contratulations! I too am an avocado farmer, though we call them aguacate.

 

[MP3Mike]

In November 2016, each SCTY share of about $25 became 0.11 TSLA shares. In other words, 100 shares of SCTY became 11 shares of TSLA. At the time each TSLA share was about $230. I was one of those shareholders involved. Yippee!

Now each TSLA share is about $1650; that’s more than 7 times its price at the time of the SCTY acquisition. What could the plaintiffs possibly be complaining about?

Tesla needs to file a coutersuit against the plaintiffs for having filed a frivolous lawsuit.

I think that you have it backwards. Tesla shareholders sued because they thought acquiring Solar City hurt Tesla. Which it sort of did. Tesla gutted it and even used the engineers to help solve the Model 3 problems. It all worked out in the end but things might have worked out better had they been left separate. (And Elon even admitted that in hind sight he probably should have left Solar City alone.)

 

[traxila]

Yah but then Elon and board would get sued because some small group of morons would sell and the price would go up 10x what they could have made if they were not so stupid.... or what I am trying to say is I do not understand the Solar City merger lawsuit at all.

(WARNING RANT)
I still can't understand how the Solar City / Tesla case just doesn't/didn't get dismissed.

Plaintiff, "Hi your honor. Yah... uhhmm. So.... we feel we should have made more than 10x on our TSLA + SCTY and the reason we didn't is because Tesla bought SCTY. OK sure.... Technically we would be making more than 10x right now but we were STUPID and sold when the SP was low from people shorting the stock. We feel Elon and board should pay us for our stupidity."

The only other argument they have besides the above is, "We feel 10x return is not enough. All companies do better than that over 5 years."... except that one would get dismissed right away.

In reality since I am reading the settlement now I see...
Who?
Arkansas Teachers Retirement (probably UNION)
Roofers local 149 (UNION)
Oklahoma Firefighters Pension... (UNION)
I bet if you dig into all the plaintiffs unions will be in every one of them. I find it disgusting because I am a union member and this is embarrassing for all union members to have to dig up money this way.

I'll just stop the rant there... move along with your weekend.

Unions are a real disappointment in the 21st Century. Reactionary, Luddite and corrupt. AND opposed to a renewable future. Cannot find anything good to say about them in the end. They need to reinvent or go away.

 

[wipster]

Damn it's time to invest in SpaceX?!

Been time for a long time but you need to be an accredited investor and I seriously doubt if I'll ever be qualified. Wonder if ARK (or someone similar) would/could put it in a space fund? I'd put money in that if I could!

 

[UnknownSoldier]

Unions are a real disappointment in the 21st Century. Reactionary, Luddite and corrupt. AND opposed to a renewable future. Cannot find anything good to say about them in the end. They need to reinvent or go away.

I'm a union member and the majority of unions are dedicated to improving the livelihoods of working class people.

But the UAW just pisses me off. They give unions a bad name and make it easy for the capital owning classes to demonize unions and slowly destroy them. The US has the weakest social safety net in the developed world and the worst workers rights and also the least number of working class people unionized. This is NOT coincidence.

 

[mongo]

I'm now wondering if the process of establishing share owners on the 24th has the potential to "bell the cat" on naked short selling.

If Tesla has any official communication with "owners of record", or if "owners of record" have any way of checking the record, that potential exists.

To avoid errors and ensure a tidy process, some way of confirming the record is true and correct would not be a surprise.

Now consider 2 scenarios:-

1) Owner A has a share which is loaned to a short seller and sold to owner B. IMO owner B is the "owner of record"

2) Owner C buys a share which is a naked short and subject to fail to deliver - there is no "owner of record" but owner C thinks they are an "owner of record".

This all hinges on some ability for owner C to check the record on the 24th.

If this scenario exists, MM want to unwind all naked sorts before the 24th, or embarrassing questions might be asked, and lawsuits may even follow.

The cost common use of Naked Shorts by MM would be to manipulate the market on options expiry normally the would want to unwind that position in the next few days to reload before the next options expiry. But if the Tesla share price remains high, MM being stuck with more Naked Shorts on the books than they would ideally like, is possible.

All along I've had hunch Dodger is right, and the market action seems to be confirming it, if my assumption about owner C being able to check the record is correct, this is a plausible explanation..

Side thought
From Aug 24-Aug 28 all real shares will have 4 post-event share due bills attached. In this time period, it would seem to be very unwise to undertake any shorting without borrowing real shares. This might reduce the tendency toward shenanigans. Placing another SP impactful event in this time block could lead to interesting results.

Or I'm being silly, shrugg.

 

[Thekiwi]

There's one thing they can do with 30 bil. Buy spacex.

Elon will never ever ever ever allow the core of SpaceX operations (the part that operates and builds the system needed for Mars colonisation) to be listed publicly. Doing so immediately puts his control of Mars colonisation operations in jeopardy, as listed companies then are at the whims of stock market participants and the SEC.

 

[Curt Renz]

Been time for a long time but you need to be an accredited investor and I seriously doubt if I'll ever be qualified. Wonder if ARK (or someone similar) would/could put it in a space fund? I'd put money in that if I could!

The Baron Partners Fund and Baron Focused Growth Fund own some SpaceX shares. Those are funds in the group headed by Ron Baron who is a big fan and investor of Tesla.

Also some Fidelity funds own some SpaceX.

 

[Beezer_9]

Not sure if anyone has mentioned or noticed this yet but Elon changed his Twitter picture. Could this possibly be a sign of things to come...battery day??

 

[Bet TSLA]

I'm now wondering if the process of establishing share owners on the 24th has the potential to "bell the cat" on naked short selling.

If Tesla has any official communication with "owners of record", or if "owners of record" have any way of checking the record, that potential exists.

To avoid errors and ensure a tidy process, some way of confirming the record is true and correct would not be a surprise.

Now consider 2 scenarios:-

1) Owner A has a share which is loaned to a short seller and sold to owner B. IMO owner B is the "owner of record"

2) Owner C buys a share which is a naked short and subject to fail to deliver - there is no "owner of record" but owner C thinks they are an "owner of record".

This all hinges on some ability for owner C to check the record on the 24th.

If this scenario exists, MM want to unwind all naked sorts before the 24th, or embarrassing questions might be asked, and lawsuits may even follow.

The cost common use of Naked Shorts by MM would be to manipulate the market on options expiry normally the would want to unwind that position in the next few days to reload before the next options expiry. But if the Tesla share price remains high, MM being stuck with more Naked Shorts on the books than they would ideally like, is possible.

All along I've had hunch Dodger is right, and the market action seems to be confirming it, if my assumption about owner C being able to check the record is correct, this is a plausible explanation..

You mean kind of like I said right at the beginning?

About the only effect I can see it might have is that if all stockholders have to engage in some moderate paperwork (by way of their brokers) then it could leave shorts in a tricky position. I have no idea what that might be. Worth considering, but probably meaningless.

 

[EV forever]

The Baron Partners Fund and Baron Focused Growth Fund own some SpaceX shares. Those are funds in the group headed by Ron Baron who is a big fan and investor of Tesla.

Also some Fidelity funds own some SpaceX.

The Fidelity funds own very low percentages - I couldn't find one with >1% investment in SpaceX, so not worth investing as far as I am concerned.
The two Baron funds that own SpaceX also own Tesla - just looked at their current holdings - Didn't realize their TSLA investments are >30% These were only around 10% a few months back.

If you guys know of any other funds with high SpaceX investments, please post. I am only allowed mutual funds in my 401K - these are the only two that I have found to date with reasonable investment in SpaceX and that is only 3.5%.

 

[floydboy]

He is not comparing Tesla to an ICE car but another BEV.

Uh well, that kinda was NOT the point?

 

[MikeQ]

For all the fun talk here about purchasing islands, I have high expectations that the new cohort of early retirees made possible by TSLA will stand on the shoulders of Musk, et al, and make this world — or Mars — a better place.

It would be nice to say I have plans to better the planet but I've raised two kids who are on their ways to being a Biochemist and a Mechanical/Aerospace Engineer. They are the future and much better equipped to solve the problems we have today. I've contributed my share through my military service and as a Software Engineer. My wife served in the military as well and nurtured many minds as a teacher.

It is our time to relax and enjoy some time for ourselves. Life is short. My father died before ever collecting social security and my mom lost her sight shortly after social security. Might sound selfish but while we have our health and mental faculties, we are going to live for us. We'll travel and enjoy watching our children start out on their life journey.

 

[Jack6591]

Contratulations! I too am an avocado farmer, though we call them aguacate.

Fifty years in So Cal, I had to check on the pronunciation. I’m ashamed of myself.

 

[Causalien]

Dear Elon.

Raise fund and buy SpaceX

Please.

 

[Causalien]

Elon will never ever ever ever allow the core of SpaceX operations (the part that operates and builds the system needed for Mars colonisation) to be listed publicly. Doing so immediately puts his control of Mars colonisation operations in jeopardy, as listed companies then are at the whims of stock market participants and the SEC.

Time to create Musk Future Industries Ltd.
Use the proceeds to buy an island resort near the equator as its own country and use that for launching.