Buckminster
Well-Known Member
Yup, but how do you know that neroden hasn't changed?
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
Buckminster
Well-Known Member
Bentley boss: "We're in a rush to build an EV" | Autocar
This is hilarious - do they really think that fashion conscious millionaires will be buying V12 Bentleys in 2024?
Greta has got this.
This is hilarious - do they really think that fashion conscious millionaires will be buying V12 Bentleys in 2024?
Greta has got this.
X Fan
Active Member
I've been thinking on Elon's comment of not selling any cars. This just shocked me. He knew MSM is shortsighted and not ready for this kind of vision talk, he backtracked his comment saying only selling cars at higher prices. But it makes perfect sense if you think about it.
If FSD becomes available (which is when, not if), and regulatory approval is given (which is also when, not if) and Tesla ridesharing network is imitated, a Tesla car would indeed be an appreciating asset (even though most ppl, including me, still lough at this bold claim).
Tesla robotaxi's would easily provide an annual return on investment of 30% per car (probably much much higher). Why would you sell an asset that has a super high ROI? It wouldn't make sense. I don't see this happening today or tomorrow, but say 2023-2025 is very likely that Tesla becomes a full-blown transportation company.
If FSD becomes available (which is when, not if), and regulatory approval is given (which is also when, not if) and Tesla ridesharing network is imitated, a Tesla car would indeed be an appreciating asset (even though most ppl, including me, still lough at this bold claim).
Tesla robotaxi's would easily provide an annual return on investment of 30% per car (probably much much higher). Why would you sell an asset that has a super high ROI? It wouldn't make sense. I don't see this happening today or tomorrow, but say 2023-2025 is very likely that Tesla becomes a full-blown transportation company.
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I’m mostly blown away that this surprised anyone. No car maker will sell cars once they have sufficient cash and can produce self driving cars. Same reason the telcos have been buying up content. Controlling as many parts of the service is the name of the game in this era.
Amazon does with warehouse and deliveries to aid their web store.
Google with server space.
Lowest volume day in nearly 3 months.
Fact Checking
Well-Known Member
Summer lull, it's a seasonal pattern plus not a lot of macro events (so far).
New Zealand Government proposes fee/rebate scheme for new & used vehicle sales. New EVs to receive $8000 rebate (over $5k USD). proposed Rebate will be capped, only Available for cars costing less than $80k NZD (so would apply to SR+ model 3 and SR model Y)
Rebate for used EVs will be $2.8k NZD (under $2k USD) - makes sense to include used vehicle sales given the high proportion of the vehicle fleet which are imported used cars from Japan.
Scheme will be fully funded by a new fee on lower efficiency ICE vehicles (hybrids & fuel efficient ICE cars will also get a rebate).
Government scheme could slash prices on cleaner cars, and make dirtier cars more expensive
Rebate for used EVs will be $2.8k NZD (under $2k USD) - makes sense to include used vehicle sales given the high proportion of the vehicle fleet which are imported used cars from Japan.
Scheme will be fully funded by a new fee on lower efficiency ICE vehicles (hybrids & fuel efficient ICE cars will also get a rebate).
Government scheme could slash prices on cleaner cars, and make dirtier cars more expensive
Krugerrand
Meow
Actually, the demographic I had in mind was mid/upper-income professional who uses it primarily as family vehicle (extended cab) with infrequent loads of plywood from Home Depot. I had an Explorer Sport Trac for 10 years and it was a great vehicle. An electric version of THAT I would have bought rather than a Model 3.
Maybe I just can’t envision what’s coming out of Musk’s head. Tesla has been successful by avoiding weirdmobiles, and my perception is the pickup crowd is pretty traditional.
Doesn’t describe me either.
Some of the pickup truck owners are traditional, some are not.
I know a 21 year old guy in Oklahoma. He’s saving for a Tesla. He has two older brothers, one of which owns Tesla stock. His ideal vehicle would be a pickup. He’s not anything like you’d imagine a 21 year old Oklahoma dude to be like despite knowing how to use a rifle.
He can hardly contain himself waiting to see Tesla’s truck. He will buy one. He will be the envy of all his friends, all of whom are also big Tesla and Elon Musk fans. He will show off that truck and he will beat the pants off every other pickup in the state of Oklahoma owned by your preconceived notion of what a dude, born and raised in Oklahoma, is actual like. And when that starts happening, all bets are off.
We have this in Sweden. The rebates are good but introducing penalty taxes is tricky. It's like the Tesla tax credits ending in US but in reverse. At the end of this year Swedes will linely be buying dirty ICE like crazy because of the penalty tax increasing next year. Morons.
Rivian’s "safe" design path will prove a mistake, IMHO, in part because the hidebound probably won’t buy an EV pickup regardless of design.To be honest, I think an electric cyberpunk pickup is going to be a bridge too far for many potential customers. Right now, an "amazing" pickup feature is a tailgate with a fold-out step
Another huge factor is going to be the date that Rivian trucks are available. If availability dates and costs of the Tesla and Rivian pickups are comparable, I think Rivian, with a more traditional appearance, wins.
As I’ve intimidated before, there’s a huge opportunity to differentiate an EV pickup on design and functionality due to the less onerous packaging requirements of the skateboard architecture. Again, compare diesel locomotives to steam engines.
There’s an opportunity to make the Tesla pickup look bad ass in a way that delivers instead of the larded up with cartoon tough guy flourishes on the same ol’ same ol’ design of most of the current crop of pickups. An F-you-back that will stick, if you will.
In any case, it will be "form follows function" that will as ever triumph. The Tesla pickup will break new ground in terms of design and performance where ICE trucks cannot follow.
Look also to the economic shifts, for example oil rig workers may be able to afford fewer pickups in time; wind turbine repair workers more.
Krugerrand
Meow
That’s one way to look at it. Someone else might see a successful business, meaning lots of happy customers allowing the business man to afford high quality equipment. Some might worry about workmanship when the professional shows up in a beater that burns more oil than its engine can hold. Perception, eh?
It is interesting that a software update is all it takes to change proficiency.
If it takes time to improve and implement broadly, it still doesn’t change the fact that potentially 1 million vehicles next year could get an update at any point and obtain the proficiency in a matter of minutes.
FSD is a software problem, not a hardware problem and that makes a significant difference in distribution of the product when ready. You don’t have to build a new fleet to get FSD out there when it’s ready. The car is *already* ready. It’s a matter of an update which can be done in minutes.
Likewise, enhanced summon is again a software update of which the car has the hardware already on board to make it work.
As the hardware installed vehicle fleet grows 50%+ year over year, and based on improvement history of autopilot and beyond, forecasting data gains support and gives confidence in FSD progress happening within the short term, even as challenges arise along the way.
Whenever I think about renting out our personal car, I think of the Seinfeld “The Smelly Car” episode, where Jerry’s car is contaminated by a valet having horrific BO.
Would consider adding buying a separate car to add to an autonomous fleet service of course if the numbers worked
As a large TSLA shareholder trying to protect my interest as well as those of other shareholders - I’d like to brainstorm a way to petition Morgan Stanley to require their star Tesla analyst take a drug test before he issues another “research” report or appears on the next earnings call as a representative of Morgan Stanley. Not suggesting he is definitely on drugs but a large number of concerned shareholders have a right to know that he is definitively not on drugs based on his recent antics and thoughts.
Who is is with me here?
Who is is with me here?
On drugs? The guy who was very concerned about Tesla’s gaining sentience and becoming robot overlords? Surely not.
JusRelax
Active Member
Motortrend has nominated the 2013 Tesla Model S as one of it's "Ultimate Car of the Year Finalists"
https://www.motortrend.com/news/finalist-2010s-2013-tesla-model-s-redefining-modern-transportation/
https://www.motortrend.com/news/finalist-2010s-2013-tesla-model-s-redefining-modern-transportation/
For context - this is kind of like a “Car of the decade” by impact level award by the looks of it. One would think the model 3 is actually the car history will judge as the real meteor strike for the auto industry, with the S being the harbinger mostly ignored until it was too late.
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