There are a lot more big European battery factories coming. Apart from the Northvolt factory in Sweden you mention VW is also planning to build a factory of similar size in Poland together with Northvolt. LG is doing one in Poland too with the aim of 70gwh within a couple of years. Catl are doing one in Germany. SK and Samsung in Hungary. Europe might soon be littered with giga factories. Really only Tesla left to reveal the location of their factory.
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
Krugerrand
Meow
Uh, huh. Heard that story before starring the Chevy Bolt when it beat the Model 3 to market. Heard it again when BMW was coming out with their carbon-fibre EV masterpiece they spent over 2B-b-billion on developing. Heard it again about the i-Pace and the Taycan.
Your suggestion that anything coming down the EV pipeline ‘in a couple years’ from a current OEM is a threat to Tesla is hysterical. Dude, it’s already been over 7 years since the Model S debut and nobody can even replicate the 2012 model, let alone today’s and certainly not tomorrow’s. And there already are cheaper EVs on the market. Problem is, they aren’t Teslas and never will be.
Seriously doubt there will be test drives, just being on display at the show will make it a show winner.
The importance of this Bloomberg data really can't be overstated. It's the first statistical survey covering everything, in detail, that we've gotten about the Model 3, from a reputable organization, and with a very large sample, over a long period of time. It's the perfect anecdote-debunking tool: statistics.
It's also good for Tesla, showing where they need to improve most. I'm sure they collect their own data, but having another external source with an independent methodology should be a nice supplement.
It's also good for Tesla, showing where they need to improve most. I'm sure they collect their own data, but having another external source with an independent methodology should be a nice supplement.
Lets not forget that CO2+methane is only half of the damage emissions do.
The other half is going straight into your lungs in the form of ground ozone and FPM and does plenty of damage there. We should not hesitate to bring this up to people insisting climate change is a hoax.
Lets also remind them that for EVs running on "100% coal", those emissions are not on your street and don't go directly into your lungs.
I have below articles bookmarked for ozone+FPM, will appreciate better candidates. I reference these from time to time to non-believers.
Air Pollution May Be As Harmful To Your Lungs As Smoking Cigarettes, Study Finds
Air Pollution Reduces Life Expectancy by Nearly 2 Years, Study Finds
Btw, quite often I get the reaction "hahaha, I'm planning to live 90 years, 2 years is nothing to me", which is amusing, at which point I ask them if they want this to happen to their loved ones as well and would they like to check their opinion on that, since your decision affects them as well.
Also, don't forget about this convincing right-winger:
(They may enjoy watching one of their own)
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Krugerrand
Meow
I had another suggestion but when typed out it didn’t seem like a good idea to post. And I suppose your suggestion might work. *shrug*
Even without that, instead of plugging in over night which takes me maybe 20 seconds a day on my model3, you have to drive the mirai to a refill station in oakland since the san ramon one is apparantly down according to Stations Map | California Fuel Cell Partnership, and then babysit the refuel process instead of just plugging in and walking away to do something I want to do.
I have wondered about hybrids though before, a hydrogen range extender similar to what the BMW i3 has with the gas range extender. This would help to only stop once supercharging while having just one of breakfast or lunch or dinner... but then again that may be not needed with the newer cars, our Model X is from 2016.
I was surprised when I saw this video
Even in July they managed only about 750kWh for solar for the whole month. For us - including charging and air conditioning - we go through that in about ten days. As we live much farther north, solar would even be less beneficial for us. For a lot of us I don't think solar is the answer.
They gave test rides in the Semi and Roadster 2.0 when they were first unveiled. I would put money on them doing test drives when it's first shown off, whether that's at Tesla's own event or the LA one.
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StealthP3D
Well-Known Member
Tesla is making as many EV's as they can and expanding as quickly as prudent and feasible. The rest are largely unprofitable and are made in small numbers. All of them get sold. There are no left-overs. How can you expect the consumer to buy more than 100% of production?
yes a Corrolla and Civic are rather bland, but the broader point is affordability. Folks should not be spending their annual income on a car; really bad financial planning. So even if they truly believed, that the oceans will flood the east coast in 10 years, they still cannot afford a BEV.
If battery prices continue to drop, and Elon could produce a basic car with 200+ miles for say, $25k, it'd sell like hot cakes.
Who's going to pay for the $2M per hydrogen station? What happens when the car reaches the "don't drive after" date? Hydrogen is a big loser.
StealthP3D
Well-Known Member
That's a very non-optimal install. The roof slope is about as low as it gets and the panels only face East and West. East/West panels do best with a steep pitch. Obviously. Not sure what they were thinking because software exists that can very precisely predict the production for any location and orientation.
This illustrates the problem with anecdotes.
Twice you have mentioned anecdotes debunked by statistics. There are a few problems with that logic. First anecdote, data and statistics are completely different topics. Second, statistical validity is related to data gathering methodology and sampling process as well as data source. Third, all data gathered through consumer responses is anecdotal. Data gathered through self-selection is highly prone to error. The Bloomberg survey was gathered only from people who had previously responded to Bloomberg online request. These, to begin with, were highly involved and motivated people and thus unlikely to be representative of a larger group. The only way to know what actual reliability and quality have been is to have direct access to warranty service and customer complaint records.
I did consumer research and service assessment for a number of years. Separately I taught market research at a university. During those activities as well as my own academic studies I found many examples of sampling problems, self-selection bias etc. In the Bloomberg case they have used the information source they had, prior respondents to their Model 3 sales survey. I was among them. Certainly this data may be worth something, but they have vastly overreached in the significance. Of course they would; they are journalists whose lifeblood is positive clicks. In the absence of better data we are all tempted to think this is authoritative, but it is not. Interesting? of course; authoritative? No!
The best information we have is the per-vehicle warranty reserves created. Actual warranty cost, if we had it, would be better. The next best thing would be the direct solicitation of experience from a random sample of Tesla owners. We have nothing like that because collecting direct owner data from which to base such a survey is quite expensive. What Bloomberg has is replicating the same reporting bias present in all Brand enthusiast groups. Such groups tend to be nearly binary with a large group that complains regularly about many things and another, typically much large group that refuses to see problems at all.
Bloomberg reflects huge selection bias so we really learn almost nothing, especially their alleged delivery time experience data. It is fun though.
We definitely need a model 1/0 OR equivalent from other makers.
I was thinking of folks in sunny California in that post.
Self reported data would typically exaggerate issues rather than happy customers though. Right? Indifferent or happy people are usually less motivated than those who are upset.
Doggydogworld
Active Member
If Robotaxis catch on legacy automakers will need huge bailouts to survive.
It's just math. 8 million cars/year is below their survival line. But even 4 million Robotaxis per year would create a surplus of used cars and destroy residuals on their leased cars.
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