Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Artful Dodger]

Do you have any link to the approval, or a link to an article reporting the approval of the water usage of the factory?

This article may be of interest:

Tesla Giga Berlin Water Supply Issue Clarified, Says Brandenburg's Environment Minister Axel Vogel

 

[Eugene Ash]

Am definitely a long I just graduated and bought 20 tesla shares to hold from my last paychecks but also put a small amount into weekly options to try and build capital to buy more shares hence the nervousness

Unless you plan to divert your mental energy from your career, skip the options rollercoaster. Time and compounding is on your side. Dollar cost averaging and slow accumulation is low risk and given timeframe, will be more than enough. Since you might still be eligible: take full advantage of Roth IRA.
Not and advice
Edit:spelling

 

[Krugerrand]

Given the location (on edge outside foundation footprint), could it be for unloading heavy shipments from semis?

View attachment 511829

Die cranes are typically located near the bay doors so that trucks can back in and the die sets and material rolls can be taken off the trucks.

 

[hobbes]

How good of an indicator is tesla trading on German exchange tommorow to how tesla will open on NYSE Tuesday.

IMHO as we have seen not so long ago the European TSLA market is easily manipulated due to low volume (there was a bear attack I think last week which started that way). In the absence of manipulation, I think most of the time you can somewhat judge the general mood of small players (like myself and most of us here) by looking how TSLA trades. However, due to the large volume once the US market opens whatever forces are at play there take over and can reverse anything that happened in Europe before in a matter of minutes.

 

[hobbes]

Are there resources to find out who is paying the "Green League" bills for this blockage?

Not that I know of. While we don´t have any evidence, I´d assume it is just mislead environmentalists.

 

[TheTalkingMule]

Not that I know of. While we don´t have any evidence, I´d assume it is just mislead environmentalists.

More likely a combination of labor unions and domestic carmaker interests.

 

[KarenRei]

Ongoing non-clearing work:

 

[StealthP3D]

Not that I know of. While we don´t have any evidence, I´d assume it is just mislead environmentalists.

You would have to be a pretty dumb "environmentalist" to not realize that slowing down the transition to EV's is more harmful to the environment than harvesting the tree crop. And this is coming from someone who has spent tens of thousands of dollars on real environmental action (protecting unique and irreplaceable forests and habitats).

 

[KarenRei]

You would have to be a pretty dumb "environmentalist" to not realize that slowing down the transition to EV's is more harmful to the environment than harvesting the tree crop. And this is coming from someone who has spent tens of thousands of dollars on real environmental action.

Delay the project for 1 year = 500k fewer EVs in the world, 500k more ICEs. Each potentially lasting for decades. Each averaging 10-20k km per year.

Delaying the EV transition is a devastating environmental impact.

 

[MarcusMaximus]

And I've done it twice in over 60K miles of road tripping. Anecdotes are not data.

Sure, but the post I was responding to was referring to a single person’s experience with the Taycan, on one trip.

 

[UnknownSoldier]

So frustrating of unfair reporting... First Bloomberg now Reuters making this seem like the end of the world for tesla

The mainstream media has driven itself into near irrelevance in recent years because of their blatant agenda pushing and trying to create and control narratives. This is their choice and they will be living with their choices for generations to come. So I wouldn't worry about whatever new (old) garbage they are peddling this week. Stay the course, this is just the beginning of the journey for Tesla.

 

[Andy O]

You would have to be a pretty dumb "environmentalist" to not realize that slowing down the transition to EV's is more harmful to the environment than harvesting the tree crop.

According to the spokesman for the Green League they have no objection to the Tesla factory per se. Their objection is that the permitting and clearing process has been rushed and has not allowed the legislated amount of time for objections to be raised.

 

[Artful Dodger]

Delay the project for 1 year = 500k fewer EVs in the world, 500k more ICEs. Each potentially lasting for decades. Each averaging 10-20k km per year.

Delaying the EV transition is a devastating environmental impact.

With 1 Billion ICE vehicles on the roads today, +/-0.0005B more or less ICEv is measurable, but not 'devastating'. The point is to move forward.

All this does is move jobs from Europe to China in 2024 if there is a delay now. The number of EVs made over the next 20 years will be hardly affected, but less development friendly jurisdictions stand to lose out in the rapid transition.

That part seems up to the courts, not the citizens. Ironic, wot?

 

[AZRI11]

Reuters by way of The Guardian has another hit piece on Tesla German court orders Tesla to stop felling trees for Gigafactory

 

[KarenRei]

With 1 Billion ICE vehicles on the roads today, +/-0.0005B more or less ICEv is measurable, but not 'devastating'. The point is to move forward.

All this does is move jobs from Europe to China in 2024 if there is a delay now. The number of EVs made over the next 20 years will be hardly affected, but less development friendly jurisdictions stand to lose out in the rapid transition.

That part seems up to the courts, not the citizens. Ironic, wot?

I disagree with this view, for three reasons.

1) A brand new ICE is not equivalent to an arbitrary old ICE. A new ICE will remain on the road much longer than an old ICE, which may be nearing the end of its lifespan. 500k would be 0,7% of all global new vehicle production.

2) You can't just make new EVs spring forth from nowhere. If GF4 is delayed for a year, that's not going to make 500k more EVs [Mod: corrected ICEs in original] spring forth in some other location. They're just simply not going to exist. ICEs production, by contrast, will gladly make up that 500k slack in vehicle demand.

3) Everything is relative. In comparing to the environmental value of maintaining several dozen hectares of pine plantations, adding in half a million ICEs - 0,7% of all global vehicle production - which will last for up to a couple decades - most definitely is devastating.

 

[Late2theGame]

This article bei Zeit explains it quite well: Grünheide: Oberverwaltungsgericht stoppt Rodungsarbeiten für Tesla-Gelände

My assumption that they could still cut the rest of the trees if they have to wait until the public participation process is over in my post above was wrong: After submission ends on March 5, there is a two-week period during which the public input is considered. If I understand correctly, after mit March they would not be able to cut the remaining trees and would have to wait for fall.

I am reading the last few paragraphs which mention the March deadlines different. I think the dates relate to the approval for building the factory itself - not for the approval of tree removal which is separate! Your original assumption would still stand!

 

[dw4ngg]

I've been doing some research on Blackrock's oil and gas holdings. I'm not so sure BlackRock is divesting from oil as was recently announced. I see increases in oil and gas holdings as recently as 12/31/2019. Some here may have access to more recent data for Blackrock's holdings.

I own a BlackRock fund through my 401K and as a result, unfortunately, many of the oil and gas stocks listed below. I wonder how many TMC members, like me, own oil and gas stocks through their 401Ks. I'm considering taking a 10% hit for early withdrawal so that I can divest 100% from oil.

I see a lot more XOM than I do TSLA.

View attachment 511826

10% plus taxes.... so taking a wild as guess, at least 34-42% total cost.

 

[CorneliusXX]

You would have to be a pretty dumb "environmentalist" to not realize that slowing down the transition to EV's is more harmful to the environment than harvesting the tree crop. And this is coming from someone who has spent tens of thousands of dollars on real environmental action (protecting unique and irreplaceable forests and habitats).

Some people can't see the forest for the trees it seems.

 

[Artful Dodger]

0,7% of all global vehicle production - which will last for up to a couple decades - most definitely is devastating.

Yeah, we'll have to agree to disagree on what the word 'devastating' means. I think that's being overly-dramatic, but feel free to get wrapped around the axle if that helps...

The transition to EVs in inevitable. This is at worse a delay in the transition, since China (or Poland) will happily swallow any enduring slack in production capacity. The larger issue is risk to the future of clean energy jobs in Germany:

"FDP politician Michael Theurer warned of further lawsuits against the planned factory of the electric car manufacturer. "I appeal to everyone who is thinking about a lawsuit to go on again. Do not paralyze Germany as an industrial location," said the Vice-President of the FDP parliamentary group in the Handelsblatt.

"The exit from coal and nuclear power is already an enormous financial effort for the economy and consumers. But if there is an additional "lawsuit" against the construction of the Tesla plant, the industrial location will be paralyzed. Such lawsuits threaten jobs, value creation and thus the financial basis for the urgently needed climate protection."​

Wouldn't it be ironic if Houston gets a Gigafactory and Berlin doesn't?

Cheers!

 

[CanadaEV]

And this shocks you? It's par for the course when investing in Tesla.

Most news stories that come out about Tesla focus on the short term .... and by short we are talking delays of a week cause a major uproar .... don't sweat any of it as it's just NOISE.

Focus on the long term .... the factory in German will get built somewhere, if it's not the original planned site they will find another site. Sometimes it's much better to avoid clicking on nonsense and stressing yourself out. I encouraged my mother-in-law to invest in Tesla about 18 months ago .... just the other day, she told me she had some money moved out of her portfolio to pay for some upcoming expenses to which I asked "did you notice your tesla holdings?" .... she said NO. She's smarter than me as that's the right answer ... if I was that smart I'd check in on it sometime in 2023 to see how I'm doing.

Long .... don't sell a share. Tesla is going to reinvent the auto market across the globe .... traditional automakers are in big trouble and only the smartest of them will survive ... it should be fun to watch it unfold just as I did with the cell phone makers while holding Apple for the last 18 years.

Cheers to the longs ....

... and if you like cheap calls, FUD can be your friend... 'not advice!'