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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
Favguy
Member
You do realise we will all be expecting you to undertake 2 & 3 when we do actually exceed $1700 now don't you?
Runarbt
Active Member
Todd Burch
14-Year Member
Now the entire forum knows you're looking forward to this.
ZachF
Active Member
"After hours 1,650.00 −0.71 (0.043%)"
lol
lol
tinm
2020 Model S LR+ Owner
The Texas videos aren't yet interesting in my opinion, unless you like watching dirt being moved on a massive basis. Berlin is taking shape, and that's great.
I love how somebody somewhere must have taken my suggestions to heart about annotating the videos, because I'm seeing that often and the value of the videos has gone up.
My general take on the two factory efforts, in terms of the drone videos, is, a 60-second-or-less summary would give me 97% of the same information. For Texas, a tweetbot that just spat out daily status like:
dirt.
and the next day:
still dirt.
and the next day:
mostly dirt and some steel beams arrive
etc would obviate the need for a video alltogether.
Don't get me wrong, these drone videos are a fantastic resource just like the ones from China. It's real information, nobody lying, no executives or Wall Street or media pundits spinning and speculating or shoving a not-quote-true narrative at the public and more importantly at investors. The drones give us great insight.
Twenty minutes a day of watching drone videos though, too much video and not enough insight.
That said, by all means keep it going! Don't stop because I'm impatient.
Sudre
Active Member
I don't think $1650 was what Mr MM had in mind. Way too many 1650 Calls today. I am sure most people took profits and a fair number won't actually buy the shares but still not the profits the MMs were hoping for (they still made good money today). They really wanted it just under. IF they could have got it under 1650 they would have had a bunch of shares to dump which were hedging. At least they still get the billions in option fees and cost.
Top is this mornings open interest. Bottom is the top of volume.
Top is this mornings open interest. Bottom is the top of volume.
Yes, it has happened on all of the 5 working days. Ref some tweet by Gary Black.
well .. this aged uh .... well
Is that whipped cream or Cool Whip on top?
woodisgood
Optimustic Pessimist
It was that last bit of FOMO that pushed them over the edge. I did my part by forcing another 100 shares worth of delta-hedge at 12:59.
smorgasbord
Active Member
I'm trying to explain the split mechanics to myself, which means explaining it to myself as if I were a child. (Not sure if that's Denzel's 2 year old or Groucho's 4 year old).
At any rate, Tesla Investor Relations says:
Each stockholder of record on August 21, 2020 will receive a dividend of four additional shares of common stock for each then-held share, to be distributed after close of trading on August 28, 2020. Trading will begin on a stock split-adjusted basis on August 31, 2020.
Tesla is literally giving every shareholder 4 additional shares for every 1 share they own. The par value of TSLA shares is, I believe $0.001 each. So, if you own 100 shares you get 400 more, worth $0.40 total, as a dividend from the company. But the company's worth hasn't materially changed.
If you own shares on Aug 21 (I assume at close of trading), you will get the additional shares a week later (after close Aug 28). Thus, the effective date for trading is the following market open, Aug 31 (after the weekend).
Of course, Tesla is not saying what these shares should be trading at. Mr. Market will continue to value these shares collectively. Since there is no capital raise associated with these new shares there is no dilution. Since the par value is so small, the cost to Tesla in issuing them is insignificant. The $0.001 par value is low and TSLA shares are not likely to be like pre-1982 pennies where the value of the copper in a penny is worth more than $0.01.
So, what happens is that at market open on Aug 31, Mr. Market will collectively divide Tesla's previous friday's market cap by the new number of shares and that's what shares will initially trade at - although in practice that won't exist for even a micro-second as this is a fully liquid market. But, ignoring standard market liquidity changes, what in practice happens is that Mr. Market will value 500 new shares on Monday the same as it valued 100 old shares last friday because those both represent the same ownership percentage of Tesla, the company.
Tesla is still not controlling the price of a share, whether pre- or post-split. In the US, Federal taxes are based on what you sell for minus the cost basis and timing of those transactions, so the split does not affect even short or long term considerations. I think now that Florida repealed its "intangible personal property" tax in 2007 there are no longer any US states that tax individuals based on what they own rather than what they transact (real estate is the obvious exception across the board), and even then the value of what you own doesn't change by having it in more pieces, because after all you still own the same percentage of Tesla as a company that you owned before.
The rest is all market mechanics based on the percentage of ownership in Tesla, the company. So, a single standard US option contract for 100 shares also gets split into five option contracts, with strike prices cut to 1/5, and thus Mr. Market will value those accordingly in terms of trading. I say "Mr Market will value those" because it's important to recognize that no-where in this action is any one person, company, or entity setting the price of TSLA shares nor the price of option contracts on TSLA shares.
At any rate, Tesla Investor Relations says:
Each stockholder of record on August 21, 2020 will receive a dividend of four additional shares of common stock for each then-held share, to be distributed after close of trading on August 28, 2020. Trading will begin on a stock split-adjusted basis on August 31, 2020.
Tesla is literally giving every shareholder 4 additional shares for every 1 share they own. The par value of TSLA shares is, I believe $0.001 each. So, if you own 100 shares you get 400 more, worth $0.40 total, as a dividend from the company. But the company's worth hasn't materially changed.
If you own shares on Aug 21 (I assume at close of trading), you will get the additional shares a week later (after close Aug 28). Thus, the effective date for trading is the following market open, Aug 31 (after the weekend).
Of course, Tesla is not saying what these shares should be trading at. Mr. Market will continue to value these shares collectively. Since there is no capital raise associated with these new shares there is no dilution. Since the par value is so small, the cost to Tesla in issuing them is insignificant. The $0.001 par value is low and TSLA shares are not likely to be like pre-1982 pennies where the value of the copper in a penny is worth more than $0.01.
So, what happens is that at market open on Aug 31, Mr. Market will collectively divide Tesla's previous friday's market cap by the new number of shares and that's what shares will initially trade at - although in practice that won't exist for even a micro-second as this is a fully liquid market. But, ignoring standard market liquidity changes, what in practice happens is that Mr. Market will value 500 new shares on Monday the same as it valued 100 old shares last friday because those both represent the same ownership percentage of Tesla, the company.
Tesla is still not controlling the price of a share, whether pre- or post-split. In the US, Federal taxes are based on what you sell for minus the cost basis and timing of those transactions, so the split does not affect even short or long term considerations. I think now that Florida repealed its "intangible personal property" tax in 2007 there are no longer any US states that tax individuals based on what they own rather than what they transact (real estate is the obvious exception across the board), and even then the value of what you own doesn't change by having it in more pieces, because after all you still own the same percentage of Tesla as a company that you owned before.
The rest is all market mechanics based on the percentage of ownership in Tesla, the company. So, a single standard US option contract for 100 shares also gets split into five option contracts, with strike prices cut to 1/5, and thus Mr. Market will value those accordingly in terms of trading. I say "Mr Market will value those" because it's important to recognize that no-where in this action is any one person, company, or entity setting the price of TSLA shares nor the price of option contracts on TSLA shares.
woodisgood
Optimustic Pessimist
Yes, when even the court jester is able to anticipate the advance of the opposing army, that's kind of bad.
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