Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Buckminster]

There are guilty pleasures and then there are guilty pleasures. Watching Eurovision is not in the good category.

We were robbed last night:

Not voting for us at Eurovision was the main reason we all voted for Brexit. If they don't start voting for us post Brexit we will be forced to keep all Giga London vehicles for ourselves...

 

[jkirkwood001]

Model 3 wins Consumer Reports best "$45,000-$55,000-Electric Vehicle"

Tesla Model 3 Electrifies Consumer Reports in Top 10 of 2021 --'Otherworldly'

While there are plenty of rivals vying for the throne, the American automaker continues to prove its worth. Consumer Reports has just given Tesla another major win by naming the Model 3 as the best electric car.

www.motorbiscuit.com

 

[jbcarioca]

So roughly half are responsible for doing pinstriping and door edge guard addons to upcharge $1-2,000 on the dealer price, right?

Yes, F&I income typically is more than half new car profits and for typical US dealerships T&T (trash and trinkets-the technical term for pinstripes, moldings, undercoating, etc) is 35% or so. Factually the poorer credit and education the highest the total F&I take. A closely related category of aftermarket wheels, protective coatings, wraps, radar detectors, etc can add another very large margin to the take. That stuff tends to be separately incorporated but still keep the initial loan to MSRP comfortably above 100%.

For most US dealerships new car sales would not be profitable without those things. The one great exception: a hot new model and ‘additional dealer markup’. Many ‘clever’ dealers just load the hot cars with more T&T.

Lest I forget get there of the all time greats, extended warranty and service contracts. The average margin on those two is 100% of dealer cost. Alone in F&I ripoffs those two shift high in FICO scores and ‘sophistication’. The third is the holy grail, leasing.

Tesla does none of that, by design. Few of us actually consider the incredibly large financial benefits come from eliminating traditional dealerships. Captive finance companies are designed to facilitate many of those ripoffs, but non-captive dealer arranged financing has become just about as abusive.

FWIW: I should disclose that I designed such products for a large captive finance company several decades ago. Bizarrely, nothing has changed. Dealer/OEM lobby’s are very efficient in maintaining the abuses. Prohibiting direct sales is only the visible part.

 

[2daMoon]

The latest from Lars at Best in Tesla.

Looking through his merch store I discovered some background on his "Be Nice" slogan.

Buy Ev
No Internal Combustion Engine​

 

[Right_Said_Fred]

Something I haven't seen discussed yet about the EV credit. The planned cap for expensive EVs will only hurt Tesla's (wannabe) competitors. Rivian, Lucid and Faraday all had the prospect of being able to sell cars with a $7500 'discount' for many years. It seems they will now lose that opportunity, having never been able to profit from it. Model S and X have already been without credit for years, so for Tesla nothing will change.

 

[Artful Dodger]

#321 Lost land / Southeast Land/East Extension Road/charging station/South bank | Wu Wa

"We are still observing the parts that have been built and those that are unknown. The grass grows more vigorously on the lost land, and we can still see the divided plots on the land. The land in the southeast area is not in the reserved land plan given to #Tesla by the government, so this land is considered temporary land acquisition, but we still see a construction site, and a rectangular concrete land is being laid. The river course near the southeast corner is being rebuilt. The construction of the East Side Road has been completed. It was estimated that the construction will be completed before June, but it has not been officially delivered to the #Tesla Shanghai #gigafactory3. From the aerial images, we can see that the road after opening to traffic: Jiangshan Road East can reach Luchao Port directly. The third phase of the charging station in the Shanghai plant has beeniangshan Road East can reach Luchao Port directly completed and is currently being adjusted. Unlike the vehicles produced in the Shanghai plant, all construction projects in the plant are proceeding smoothly as planned."​

Important point to note for shipping logistics: direct road access to the Port will speed overseas deliveries of Giga Shanghai products.

Cheers!

 

[dm28997]

I'm excited .
Megachargers and Tesla semis for Pepsi in the works

https://www.reddit.com/r/elonmusk/comments/niynno

 

[juanmedina]

At what price will Tesla dump Bitcoin? It is already down to $32,800. I assume it will be a down day tomorrow

 

[reardencode]

At what price will Tesla dump Bitcoin? It is already down to $32,800. I assume it will be a down day tomorrow

Hopefully they will intelligently buy the dip. Master of Coin is a cool character, and knows not to sell low.

 

[traxila]

At what price will Tesla dump Bitcoin? It is already down to $32,800. I assume it will be a down day tomorrow

Can’t stand that the TSLA SP is being driven by the price of BTC right now. This is ridiculous.

Wonder if Elon considered that a purchase of any size of BTC would allow the markets to act as if the fate of TSLA and BTC are inextricably intertwined.

Because that is the nonsense we are dealing with short term.

I would like for this crypto TSLA connection to go away.

 

[Knightshade]

Something I haven't seen discussed yet about the EV credit. The planned cap for expensive EVs will only hurt Tesla's (wannabe) competitors. Rivian, Lucid and Faraday all had the prospect of being able to sell cars with a $7500 'discount' for many years. It seems they will now lose that opportunity, having never been able to profit from it. Model S and X have already been without credit for years, so for Tesla nothing will change.

I think the only place there might be impact will depend where the cap is.

I don't think it'll at all impact cars sold, demand will remain higher than supply for years... but I could see situations where a buyer was already happy to about ~50k for an LR AWD Model 3 for example with or without the credit.... and would have ALSO added 10k FSD if they were getting a $7500 refund on it, but decide not to because it puts it over the "cap" for the credit.

Obviously this will also be impacted by what the eventual subscription option looks like, and when more obvious FSD advancements go wide release- and ultimately what cap they set..... Most talk has been a cap based on vehicle price, but they could always decide to set it based on income too (perhaps even with a phaseout)- many tax credits work that way.

The upside to the income phaseout would be you won't have car makers gaming the system by adjusting the price on the invoice (IIRC VW or someone got caught doing exactly that to manipulate capturing EU credits a few months back? And Tesla famously did something like this, though far more transparently, in Canada due to cost cap limits)--- the downside would be making it POS would be harder (though I suppose you can just base it on previous year income, and then they just need to bring last years 1040)

OMG. I am considering getting this but not sure if I can handle the G force at my age. But I want one.

2.5G forward is not a problem unless you've got serious health issues... Gs are better tolerated laterally (across the body) than when applied longitudinally (along the length of the body).

 

[JoRoMo]

Hopefully they will intelligently buy the dip. Master of Coin is a cool character, and knows not to sell low.

For BC they will just HODL until coal (etc.) is out of the equation - then back to business as usual (/previously planned).

 

[ZeApelido]

So from what I've seen, Ford's reservations for the electric F150 don't actually guarantee your place "in line". (according to the fine print)

Therefore, this is obligatory:

 

[Prunesquallor]

Model 3 wins Consumer Reports best "$45,000-$55,000-Electric Vehicle"

Tesla Model 3 Electrifies Consumer Reports in Top 10 of 2021 --'Otherworldly'

While there are plenty of rivals vying for the throne, the American automaker continues to prove its worth. Consumer Reports has just given Tesla another major win by naming the Model 3 as the best electric car.

www.motorbiscuit.com

Even with that faulty Autopilot?

 

[Discoducky]

So from what I've seen, Ford's reservations for the electric F150 don't actually guarantee your place "in line". (according to the fine print)

Therefore, this is obligatory:

Found it...good'ol 177!

Reservation does not guarantee vehicle delivery nor priority for ordering a vehicle.

 

[Beltsbear]

Something I haven't seen discussed yet about the EV credit. The planned cap for expensive EVs will only hurt Tesla's (wannabe) competitors. Rivian, Lucid and Faraday all had the prospect of being able to sell cars with a $7500 'discount' for many years. It seems they will now lose that opportunity, having never been able to profit from it. Model S and X have already been without credit for years, so for Tesla nothing will change.

The stupidity of politics. I would far rather pay $7500 to take a range rover or Mercedes X/G series off the road and replace it with a Rivian or Model X than pay $7500 to replace in econobox box with a Chevy bolt. Taking the rich mans car and making it electric gives me the MOST pollution reduction for my money not the least.

 

[j6Lpi429@3j]

I would like for this crypto TSLA connection to go away.

I cannot possibly agree more. FFS why hitch the brand to something most loved by wealthy tech bros. As if the brand needed more anchorage in that area...
If you are so fussed about inflation in the US, buy some nickel/lithium mining companies with the cash, or build out more of the charger network. This was a dumb, dumb decision.

 

[lafrisbee]

someone needs to tell them they are called Megachargers not semichargers.

yeah, wouldn't a Semi-charger be the little blue pill. (Not the political blue)

 

[AudubonB]

The stupidity of politics. I would far rather pay $7500 to take a range rover or Mercedes X/G series off the road and replace it with a Rivian or Model X than pay $7500 to replace in econobox box with a Chevy bolt. Taking the rich mans car and making it electric gives me the MOST pollution reduction for my money not the least.

That’s an interesting and productive point; one can also argue, however, that the $7500 might be taking out of circulation an oil-dripping, black smoke-belching death trap.
Objectively, I’ll suspect there are more of your former than my latter but probably a good amount of both.

 

[ChefBoyardee]

What are everyone's thoughts on hedging a TSLA position using puts on competitors (lucid, nio, etc.)? They've all been correlated w/ TSLA during this selloff (but also have worse technicals) - I wonder if that's a good way to add some protection from macro trends while still staying fully invested in Tesla.

Although, the fact that I'm thinking about hedging at this point probably means we're at the bottom