Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Scuttlebutt]

Since we are going down the rabbit hole today, here is my speculative take: Elon's enemies are doing their best to push him into lashing out, a bit of a "psyops" if you will. All are aware he was bullied, all are aware of what Elon is likely to do when he perceives something "unjust" being done in the world. FF interests, big auto, politicians, and others can play a long game of chess, too. There is just too much money and power at stake for those interests not to try and slow Elon and Tesla down. When Elon gets upset and lashes out, it helps those who would destroy Tesla.

 

[StealthP3D]

I for one am still concerned. Elon represents Tesla, I put my money into Tesla, both by buying their vehicles, and their stock, as a vote for hopefully a better world. Often his tweets push against my idealism.

Every car Tesla sells displaces an ICE car at nearly a 1:1 ratio. My point here is simply that Elon and Team are not hopefully creating a better world - they are creating a better world. And for that we owe a huge shout-out to Elon and the crew he has assembled.

If you think the impact of the totality of Elon's actions is to have a negative impact on the world, you cannot call yourself an idealist if you continue to support him. You don't get to pick and choose a person's actions - every person is their own individual and you have to take the good with the bad. I'm sure Elon would disagree with things you say and do also. But he's not trying to enter your life and pick and choose the things he agrees with and those he doesn't. You have to decide whether you support the person and his mission judging by the totality of the facts.

We are all idealists at heart, we just have different ideals. I happen to support Elon's ideals over yours. Nobody is forcing you to own Tesla stock and buy Tesla products. Be your own individual but realize you don't get to pick and choose other's ideals.

 

[JRP3]

In the end, it only matters what Elon thinks of himself and what he does or does not want to do about it.

As CEO of a publicly traded company and as someone who has a mission to rapidly transition the world to sustainability he has to think beyond himself. Obviously he's done that in the past by risking his fortune and pushing himself so hard. A bit of reflection on the impact of his recent actions is warranted and should be expected of a rational individual.

 

[thesmokingman]

As CEO of a publicly traded company and as someone who has a mission to rapidly transition the world to sustainability he has to think beyond himself. Obviously he's done that in the past by risking his fortune and pushing himself so hard. A bit of reflection on the impact of his recent actions is warranted and should be expected of a rational individual.

A rational individual would have never tried to electrfy the world or go to Mars. You guys need to reconsider who you are putting your money behind.

 

[mars_or_bust]

As CEO of a publicly traded company and as someone who has a mission to rapidly transition the world to sustainability he has to think beyond himself. Obviously he's done that in the past by risking his fortune and pushing himself so hard. A bit of reflection on the impact of his recent actions is warranted and should be expected of a rational individual.

This is such rubish. If there is ONE man in the world today who thinks beyond himself, it is Elon.

 

[StealthP3D]

Since we are going down the rabbit hole today, here is my speculative take: Elon's enemies are doing their best to "push" him into lashing out, a bit of a "psyops" if you will. All are aware he was bullied, all are aware of what Elon is likely to do when he perceives something "unjust" being done in the world. FF interests, big auto, politicians, and others can play a long game of chess, too. There is just too much money and power at stake for those interests not to try and slow Elon and Tesla down. When Elon gets upset and lashes out, it helps those who would destroy Tesla.

Except Elon speaking his mind doesn't help those who want to destroy Tesla.

Elon hasn't gotten to where he is today without building incredible support and his public persona cannot be separated from that. Do you really think Tesla would have been as successful as they are today if Elon was a wallflower who bowed down to the woke movement and made sure he never offended anyone?

I don't. I like Elon's no-nonsense way of looking at the world and I think the world needs more diversity of thought, not more conformity. No two people are going to agree on all points and things are not always as they appear on the surface.

 

[Joe F]

While I don't understand the actions of those who seem to not have a social filter, and say things which seem so outlandish that just leaves me stunned, I also don't have an understanding of the underlying condition which can cause such behavior in others.

In trying to understand it, I found and offer this article from Psychology Today which is one of many in the medical community that explains such actions.

It states, in part: "Being diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome as an adult, I now realize that I have inadvertently offended many, many people during the course of my life. It seems no one has been immune to the "accidental insults" that come quicker than I can think to stop them."

 

[SmokyPeat]

A simple and direct apology would go a long way in my book.

 

[EVMeister]

The signal to noise ratio is painful today. It's like the weekend has started early.

 

[Rarity]

Regarding the Liontown lithium deal, I notice that it is for spodumene rather than battery-grade lithium hydroxide. I assume that being able to take spodumene lithium opens Tesla up to more supply. Does anybody have a good sense/information on how much of a factor this is?

 

[Krugerrand]

As CEO of a publicly traded company and as someone who has a mission to rapidly transition the world to sustainability he has to think beyond himself. Obviously he's done that in the past by risking his fortune and pushing himself so hard. A bit of reflection on the impact of his recent actions is warranted and should be expected of a rational individual.

No, he doesn’t. He can think from second to second if he wants.

He has expressed on numerous occasions that Twitter is a PERSONAL space/outlet for him. Not his fault people want to ignore that and equate what he tweets of personal opinion with a company he happens to reluctantly be CEO.

This need you have for him to be a particular model of CEO because *gasp* publicly traded company is the lie you tell yourself. He’s not you, or any other CEO, and he doesn’t care what you expect of him. He’ll reflect on his behavior if he wants to or not and it’s not for you to judge no matter how much you think it’s your right because you bought some shares.

If you think he’s burning down the company he worked so hard to build, then you know what to do.

 

[Right_Said_Fred]

Discussing the impact of Elon's tweets and views is fine. Sharing personal opinions about Canadian politics is not. This is long-standing policy for this thread and common knowledge. For this reason 4 posts have been removed.

 

[JRP3]

A rational individual would have never tried to electrfy the world or go to Mars. You guys need to reconsider who you are putting your money behind.

It was rational, physics based, first principles thinking that drove Elon to take on these challenges.

 

[Artful Dodger]

Regarding the Liontown lithium deal, I notice that it is for spodumene rather than battery-grade lithium hydroxide. I assume that being able to take spodumene lithium opens Tesla up to more supply. Does anybody have a good sense/information on how much of a factor this is?

Rob Maurer covered this topic 2-3 days ago on Tesla Daily. One of his youtube commenters informed him its about 10:1 spodumen to Li-OH, so the contract provides enough Lithium for ~200K more cars per year. Unverified, but that's what was discussed.

This is also a topic I'd expect Jordan Giesige to cover. Perhaps somebody could ask him on twitter?

The Limiting Factor (@LimitingThe) / Twitter

Cheers!

 

[rk20]

Personally I think he'd 100% change his stance if the strike halted Tesla's production.

I love "Elon the Engineer" because we get a picture of how he is solving difficult problems. Other companies typically give no such visibility. "Elon the Social Influencer" is just strengthening the existing polarization that exists in our society.

 

[StealthP3D]

My personal opinion is that the main "narrative", repeated and driven by media and the like, about an "unhinged evil billionaire" is not helping the mission.
Do you think otherwise?
I'm actually interested to change my mind about this.

I think I don't know whether the narrative that Elon is an "unhinged evil billionaire" is helping or hurting the mission. And I would caution against you thinking you know the answer either.

Most likely it's so inconsequential in the totally of things it gets lost in the noise, but I don't know which way it moves the needle. Things are not always as they appear on the surface. It could actually help the mission but it's impossible to say one way of the other. The answer is not as simple as most think it is. Trust me on that.

I do get a kick out of investors who worry about such extraneous stuff. And, yes, from an investment perspective it is extraneous in the extreme. There is some good and some bad in everything, but an investor must focus on things that are clear enough to actually matter to the performance of the company. And any investor that has been around the block a few times knows this target is filled with noise that can distract from what really matters and that's exactly what this is (no matter how much it might push your own personal emotional buttons).

Investing is not about your personal emotions. Hot-button topics such as mandatory COVID vaccinations are filled with noise because they affect everyone differently. There is no right and wrong although any given individual may think there is.

Investors should focus on things that matter and I can assure you, this is not one of them! That's why I'm entertained watching people who think it is. No offense intended but people are quite blind to how the world works because they are so caught up in their own world of what they think is right and wrong. I'm not immune to it myself (but I do my best to avoid it).

 

[Tes La Ferrari]

Tesla Files 'Integrated Energy Absorbing Castings' Patent for Single-Piece Casting

Tesla has developed a unique for the automotive industry way to produce their cars. So, Model Y is produced using single-piece casting, which not only improves vehicle safety, but also provides significant savings, which allows for rapid scaling the production. Tesla filed a patent for...

www.tesmanian.com

TL: DR: Patent now published. “ On July 5, 2021, Tesla filed for the "Integrated energy absorbing castings" patent, which was published on February 10, 2022. The patent describes single-piece casting familiar in the Tesla community.”

“ Tesla has developed a unique for the automotive industry way to produce their cars. Model Y is produced using a single-piece casting, which not only improves vehicle safety, but also provides significant savings, which allows for rapid scaling of production. Tesla filed a patent for "Integrated energy absorbing castings" in which it describes the details of the invention.”

 

[ZeApelido]

I went to a highly reputable Silcon Valley psychologist to determine if I was on the spectrum (my wife wanted to know).

After a few sessions I ask her "So do I have Aspergers?"

Her: "No, you're just an engineer".

At least I don't think Elon's antics will negatively affect engineers from working for Tesla.

 

[Coolio2000]

Funny how if Elon tweets something leaning right on an issue, it’s starts becoming a problem.

 

[mrmage]

Every car Tesla sells displaces an ICE car at nearly a 1:1 ratio. My point here is simply that Elon and Team are not hopefully creating a better world - they are creating a better world. And for that we owe a huge shout-out to Elon and the crew he has assembled.

If you think the impact of the totality of Elon's actions is to have a negative impact on the world, you cannot call yourself an idealist if you continue to support him. You don't get to pick and choose a person's actions - every person is their own individual and you have to take the good with the bad. I'm sure Elon would disagree with things you say and do also. But he's not trying to enter your life and pick and choose the things he agrees with and those he doesn't. You have to decide whether you support the person and his mission judging by the totality of the facts.

We are all idealists at heart, we just have different ideals. I happen to support Elon's ideals over yours. Nobody is forcing you to own Tesla stock and buy Tesla products. Be your own individual but realize you don't get to pick and choose other's ideals.

I’ve disagreed with many of Elon’s tweets, but as you said, the totality of Elon’s actions far outweigh the negatives. I don’t believe there is anything Elon can do that will ever make him anything but a huge net positive to humanity.

However, I don’t invest in great humanitarians. As an investor I consider if what he says has crossed such a line that it will have a material impact to the company. I also try to determine whether his tweets are trending worse and if might affect Tesla for a sustained period or even permanently.

A terrible scenario would be for it to be a disaster for Elon to stay, because it would be a disaster for Elon to leave. If we are honest, the boards of most public companies, especially ones selling to retail, would force their CEOs to resign for making a tweet like that.

As you said, no one is forcing us to hold Tesla stock. The purpose of this forum is to discuss whether we should. When Elon crossed that line, it’s something I sadly (and I mean very distressfully and unhappily) need to ponder.