RobDickinson
Active Member
Ford screwed up invested in an EV startup that actually made some EVs, Mary can show them how to avoid that
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
This week TSLA has kept above its 200-day moving average which has been-long term support except for a brief but sharp dip below last week. The next target is the regaining of its 50-day moving average. Doing so should be quite bullish. 
BTW, within the hour I pulled my brand new Model 3 into my month-old home's garage. Both were fullly paid by shaving off a small about of TSLA profits.
BTW, within the hour I pulled my brand new Model 3 into my month-old home's garage. Both were fullly paid by shaving off a small about of TSLA profits.
Last edited:
Elon exchanging Starlink power suggestions with Vice Prime Minister of Ukraine.
RobDickinson
Active Member
I think Tesla should build an easy to setup power system
2-4 solar panels + cables + inverter + 2-4kwh battery (daisy chainable?)
Something enough to keep a starlink and a few laptops going 24/7
2-4 solar panels + cables + inverter + 2-4kwh battery (daisy chainable?)
Something enough to keep a starlink and a few laptops going 24/7
Gigapress
Trying to be less wrong
These surveys were not very scientific, so the reality for Rivian order cancellations is probably significantly less bad than the results would indicate, but it's hard to estimate by how much.
Polls show more than half of Rivian customers are cancelling their reservations
Rivian announced some major changes to their lineup yesterday, adding a Dual-Motor AWD variant and raising prices for new and existing customers by as much as $20,000 or more depending on the configuration. Reaction was […]driveteslacanada.ca
Well...well...well.....
Surveys with voluntary self-reporting usually have response bias, especially in favor of strongly negative opinions. The people most annoyed by Rivian's decision are going to be the most likely to respond to the poll.
This was also a sample of people who are in the Rivian forum and in the r/Rivian subreddit. They are probably not very representative of the overall population of Rivian customers because they are probably the minority with the most passionate opinions about Rivian.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
Until Tesla can't sell everything they make and has to scale back production because of it there is no competition.
If anything wouldn’t these be the people most likely to hang on to their reservation?
I get that the numbers aren’t scientific, but that’s 80% of their biggest fans either dumping reservations or seriously considering it.
They are basically dumping all of their biggest advocates.
Time will only tell....from what i gather...there are a lot of unhappy reservation holders out there. I am sure they had to do this to slow down the cash burn rate in hopes of higher margins.
TL;DR - Ford is restructuring to further delay the inevitable of showing how much money they are losing on every BEV sale. They should be selling/reducing their brands (Lincoln does better in China than the US) for cash now and by not doing that is a stupid move that will only further increase their path to insolvency. Ford will continue to hide their losses from their BEV sales until somewhere in 2023. They'll sell at most 100k BEVs in 2022 (Mach e and Lightning).
Longer version...
I don't see how $F is going to make any profit on the BEVs they sell and now that they've built and shipped the Mach e they know this. We just don't know how bad it is until they break out the costs. With their limited battery contracts, reliance on middle-men/companies for pre-made assemblies and huge need for talent that is currently unfulfilled, it is an impossible hill to summit for profitability with Tesla in the market. This year Tesla will push the Mach e into oblivion in the US with Model Y's out of Fremont and Austin, Shanghai building crazy numbers of Y's and next year will put a big dent into Ford trucks. But we'll find out when they actually start breaking out numbers. Which con call will that be exactly? From the PDF, it would appear Q1 or Q2 2023. I'd bet that they'll lose $5k to $10k for each car in 2022 on sales of less than 100k total. I also wonder if they will somehow put BEV spend into the ICE balance sheet. Like the cost of running ads with BEVs or battery development costs as the same batteries will be used in one ICE hybrid, ya know, totally legal stuff like that. And here's the line from the announcement PDF that makes me think that...
"Ford Blue and Ford Model e will operate as distinct businesses, but share relevant technology and best practices to leverage scale and drive operating improvements; along with Ford Pro, all three businesses are expected to have discrete P&Ls by 2023"
Shared best practices is code for, "We'll put in one mention of a gas car in our ads and accrue the lot to ICE."
Profit on BEV's? Please, they can't make money on their ICE cars, AT SCALE, only Ford credit is making money.
The only person at Ford that I know is Doug Field and he knows his BEV vehicle engineering stuff. Can he inspire the entire BEV company or even be allowed to that is uncertain as legacy is stuck in its ways? It was interesting to hear Farley sound like me when he said they didn't have the right talent. And I've gone as far to say that they don't even know who to hire that has the vision to comprehend the right talent to hire. Hint: Farley doesn't know, but Doug does for vehicle engineering, but finding the right folks for AI is less certain.
There's something to be said for honesty…
driveteslacanada.ca
In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits something they have before, namely that they “do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years.”
…
But they added three key words to the end of that statement that paints a bleak picture for the company’s future – “if at all.”
“We do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years, if at all.”
Lucid admits in regulatory filing they may never turn a profit
Lucid Group has issued a stark warning to investors and customers in its latest 10-K filing with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC). In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits [...]
driveteslacanada.ca
In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits something they have before, namely that they “do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years.”
…
But they added three key words to the end of that statement that paints a bleak picture for the company’s future – “if at all.”
“We do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years, if at all.”
bkp_duke
Well-Known Member
There's something to be said for honesty…
Lucid admits in regulatory filing they may never turn a profit
Lucid Group has issued a stark warning to investors and customers in its latest 10-K filing with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC). In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits [...]
In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits something they have before, namely that they “do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years.”
…
But they added three key words to the end of that statement that paints a bleak picture for the company’s future – “if at all.”
“We do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years, if at all.”
Abandon ship!
StealthP3D
Well-Known Member
FUD? You think we are spreading FUD about Ford?
I've been reading your comments on TMC for over 6 years, and I consider many of your doubts about Tesla's success to border on FUD, it really depends upon what your motives have been and, on that point, I'm still not clear.
What is clear to me is your negativity on Tesla has been wrong 6 years running. Now you are pumping Ford!
Luckily, that’s one ship I never boarded. Was briefly on the H.M.S. Workhorse, but swiped a lifeboat before most saw the iceberg.
Eh...let him and others pump....we just sit back knowing what the end game is....eventually its game over for all of legacy. Farley even knows this, he's just trying to prop the stock up as long as he can so investors don't run all at once.
There's something to be said for honesty…
Lucid admits in regulatory filing they may never turn a profit
Lucid Group has issued a stark warning to investors and customers in its latest 10-K filing with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC). In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits [...]
In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits something they have before, namely that they “do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years.”
…
But they added three key words to the end of that statement that paints a bleak picture for the company’s future – “if at all.”
“We do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years, if at all.”
is that what the prospectus said when going public
fleeced ... smells like a Nikola and them SPACs
Krugerrand
Meow
Uh, huh. And Doug Field knows vehicle stamping, production and mfging? You know, the part that’s really hard. Or, we’re going to assume that if Ford has the engineering talent, they’ll be able to compete with Tesla efficiencies and margins because they’re doing such a good job now sourcing most of that out?
Isn't 10Q designed to be doom and gloom spelling out all positive risks? Tesla's 10Q is not exactly flowers and roses either.There's something to be said for honesty…
Lucid admits in regulatory filing they may never turn a profit
Lucid Group has issued a stark warning to investors and customers in its latest 10-K filing with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC). In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits [...]
In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits something they have before, namely that they “do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years.”
…
But they added three key words to the end of that statement that paints a bleak picture for the company’s future – “if at all.”
“We do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years, if at all.”
I’m sure some analyst will use this as an excuse to downgrade Tesla, or perhaps a Barron’s headline:There's something to be said for honesty…
Lucid admits in regulatory filing they may never turn a profit
Lucid Group has issued a stark warning to investors and customers in its latest 10-K filing with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC). In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits [...]
In the regulatory filing published on February 28, 2022, Lucid admits something they have before, namely that they “do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years.”
…
But they added three key words to the end of that statement that paints a bleak picture for the company’s future – “if at all.”
“We do not expect to achieve positive cash flow from operations for several years, if at all.”
”Tesla investors selling on news Prominent EV company says EVs are not profitable”
StealthP3D
Well-Known Member
I had to fix that for you...
This is a tough situation for Rivian because it's going to be hard to get volume sales when the price is so high. It seems like it might have been better to raise more money, maintain the originally announced prices (which were by no means cheap), take the losses, and fight like hell to produce for less as they ramp to higher volumes. If they learn to produce at a high level of efficiency, they can become a real EV player. However, selling in low volume at a high price takes away some of the incentive to cut manufacturing costs as they ramp which leads to a crisis at some point in time.
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