Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[chronopublish]

I believe they did the photo opps because they know backing faster transition to EVs is going to harm autoworkers in states that the Democratic Party must hold. It was political theater, not a slight to Elon.

It was political theater and a slight to Elon. The administration miscalculated - they would not have lost the union vote if Tesla had been acknowledged. They certainly did not have to go so cartoonishly overboard in their union favoritism to the point where they had to tell public lies ("you led, Mary") that everyone could see through.

 

[jerry33]

See . . . it's this "framing" by the MSM of things in this manner that just plain bugs me. It has been intentionally divisive.

We all (here at least) agree we need to transition to EVs and electric infrastructure (vs. NG/oil for heating) as quickly as possible. But we all (most?) are aware that the transition, no matter how much we want, cannot occur in months, or even a few years. It will take a decade or longer to just extract enough Lithium out of the ground, build enough battery manuf facilities, and produce enough goods (EVs and stationary storage) to make the transition.

So understanding the above, AND understanding that we don't want to give the murderous dictator on the other side of the world more money to fund his killing machine (NOT hyperbolae), then what is the current administration supposed to do? Literally the only option available to them is that they have to ask companies to pump more oil, and oil-nations to pump more oil.

They can't go ask those companies to crank out more solar panels, EVs, and stationary storage and have them ready for use . . . next month. That's just not possible, not on the scale needed to put any kind of dent into oil prices.

Common sense . . . not common.

One of the problems is that some of the oil in the ground in the U.S. isn't refine-able by refineries in the U.S. The Permian Basin is an example. New refineries would have to be built to refine this oil.

 

[Nocturnal]

You know that thing that dogs do where they have an itch or injury and keep licking it until it's super sore? That's basically this thread right now.

 

[jerry33]

You know that thing that dogs do where they have an itch or injury and keep licking it until it's super sore? That's basically this thread right now.

It's what happens on a three day Wall Street holiday. Best news is that there is only one four day holiday.

 

[Maitri982]

Today, I'm bombarded on social media with:
- "crashing Tesla caught fire"
- "underpaid workers resign in Tesla Berlin"
- "Spain Model3 lemon owner gets car refunded after lawsuit"
- "Tesla Norway, Netherlands, Spain, ... Registrations drop
- "Musk trans son/daughter"
- "China region bans Teslas for 2 months"

....
Sighhh :/
...

I'm done for today. Signing off from any social media/forums/... for at least a week.

Usually a BUY sign...

 

[Ogre]

My goodness. This became my primary go to thread a while back. But man, talk about degradation. Seems like FB or Reddit in here lately.

Certified nut house. Skipped a bunch of pages to land here. Has it gotten any better? I’m afraid to look.

I think I’ll go elsewhere for a few days and see if some of the more vocal bullies go away or take a break. I think it’s time again for some pruning with the ignore button.

Dislike all you like….

You just gotta resist the urge to stick your head in here during the weekend, doubly so on long weekends.

Come in tomorrow morning and start reading on the most recent page. It'll be a bit better.

 

[oldTAVguy]

See . . . it's this "framing" by the MSM of things in this manner that just plain bugs me. It has been intentionally divisive.

We all (here at least) agree we need to transition to EVs and electric infrastructure (vs. NG/oil for heating) as quickly as possible. But we all (most?) are aware that the transition, no matter how much we want, cannot occur in months, or even a few years. It will take a decade or longer to just extract enough Lithium out of the ground, build enough battery manuf facilities, and produce enough goods (EVs and stationary storage) to make the transition.

So understanding the above, AND understanding that we don't want to give the murderous dictator on the other side of the world more money to fund his killing machine (NOT hyperbolae), then what is the current administration supposed to do? Literally the only option available to them is that they have to ask companies to pump more oil, and oil-nations to pump more oil.

They can't go ask those companies to crank out more solar panels, EVs, and stationary storage and have them ready for use . . . next month. That's just not possible, not on the scale needed to put any kind of dent into oil prices.

Common sense . . . not common.

I believe that a majority of oil companies will not invest in more production given existing politics. They will try to extract the maximum value from their current setup for their shareholders and vested stakeholders. This will not change and we are screwed.

 

[Beltsbear]

Everyone whining about Elons political views not aligning with yours: What the h*ll is wrong with you guys? You insist on the right to have your own opinion, but everyone that does not have the same as you doesn't have the very same right?

Maybe, just maybe, you should care more about what Elon actually does - we have the hottest heatwave in central Europe in ages, climate change is kicking in, population is falling apart because of more left- and right-wing extremism everywhere...?!

"goal is to have the furthest left and right 10% equally unhappy" - this is Elon.

Stop with your stupid cancel culture just because someone does what you also do: have his/her own opinion.

Supporting deDesantis, a man who is the antisis to free speech (using the government to punish the speech of others) and someone who uses power to prevent black people from voting in Florida in opposition to law and constitution is not making the “10% extremes “ unhappy. Elon is supporting someone who hates democracy.

 

[WADan]

But can't you disagree with people's opinions without hating that person?

Yes, only if this person still can think logically and willing to change their opinions subjected to reality.

 

[thx1139]

That was not about GM and Ford getting a "photo op". This was a slap at Tesla and Elon for not cow-towing to the administration and unions. Elon does not seek "photo ops". Do you feel he should hide in an office and quietly let events unfold?

You totally ignored my points. GM and Ford did indeed get photo ops. Tesla got a change to regulations that directly benefitted is profitability in Q1 and beyond.

 

[dm28997]

Many happy Tesla employees at Giga Berlin

https://twitter.com/x/status/1537995967709884416

I like to compare this to the GM old Fremont Plant and government aid that did not stop GM from Bankruptcy.
That is a depressing picture for workers. NUMMI - Wikipedia

 

[Chunky Jr.]

You just gotta resist the urge to stick your head in here during the weekend, doubly so on long weekends.

I've tried, but that doesn't feed my addiction to this thread

 

[PeterJA]

...And I don’t have children and don’t like people and frankly think mankind needs to just disappear because we ruin everything we touch. Still, I understand as Elon does, what’s coming if things don’t change.

What's coming is AI is going to make paid human labor obsolete, sooner than most humans expect.

The obsoleted labor will include not only boring/dangerous jobs targeted first by Tesla Bot, and car/truck driving jobs targeted by Tesla FSD, but also creative jobs such as painting/illustration, copywriting, and software engineering. AI that does the latter three jobs, faster and better, already exists.

So I don't understand Elon's concern about declining birthrates. Why do we need more young humans to run the economy when AI/robots will do that soon? What will all the humans do with themselves to give their lives meaning? (Elon has also expressed concern about the meaning problem.)

However, I'm not gonna say his concern about birthrates is irrational or non-first-principles or a mistake. Just because I don't understand a genius's reasoning doesn't mean his reasoning doesn't exist. Maybe he foresees a possible human-labor shortage before AI is ready to take over. Or more likely, maybe he sees so many threats to civilization that he wants lots of humans around to increase the chance that some will survive the coming disruptions/catastrophes.

 

[OrthoSurg]

You guys are really in deep denial regarding the reasons for Elon Musk’s rapidly-plummeting popularity and respect.

Over the last 3 years, he has gone from “apolitical but quietly libertarian” to radical right wing conspiracy dingdong, parroting every low-intelligence white supremacist-adjacent talking point and boomer meme. It’s sad, and it’s doing real and lasting damage to the Tesla brand.

It’s not a media conspiracy. Its not bots. It’s actual huge swaths of the populace looking at Elon’s own words and actions and reacting with revulsion.

It’s 100% his own doing. The well-deserved hate is in response to his own choices of what subjects to sound off about.

Now, this is the perfect example of an extremist post.

No nuances

 

[MABMAB]

His overblown concern about population decrease which is not remotely close to happening nor would it be a negative if it did happen.

Ok, I want to parse this out.

1. Overblown is a value judgement, an opinion, a belief.

2. The birth rate is decreasing (World Birth Rate 1950-2022.)

3. You used the word population. Population is not the same as birth rate.

4. Musk expressed concern about birth rate:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1529097667858546689

5. And, you failed to relate any of this to the "first principals" mumbo jumbo you first used. After all, you did use the word "reasoning".

 

[ZachF]

BTW, that EIA source lists under construction & planned battery capacity as well, here’s what that looks like:

https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/xls/table_6_05.xlsx

(Annoyingly it’s listed in peak power in megawatts rather than storage capacity)

6,859 California
3,103 Texas
1,493 Nevada
1,327 New York
798 Arizona
350 Montana
310 Hawaii
250 Colorado
215 Massachusetts
200 Oklahoma
195 New Mexico
113 Virginia
107 Georgia
100 Mississippi
89 Tennessee
82 South Carolina
80 Wisconsin
61 North Carolina
40 Florida
20 Connecticut
15 Maine
13 Delaware
7 Illinois
5 Iowa
4 Minnesota

Cali is winning the battery race, but they need it by far the most.

6.9 GW is roughly 20% of their average demand, so hopefully that can put a large dent in the “duck curve”. Cali should see their grid get much more stable with that much battery.

 

[ABC2D]

Yes, only if this person still can think logically and willing to change their opinions subjected to reality.

But what if it's your opinion that was wrong subjected to reality and logical thinking? The other person wouldn't need to change their opinion nor need the willingness

 

[gene]

Ok, ok, I normally don't comment on this kind of stuff here. But, I belong to an EV group here in my town and the other members seem to send their friends my way so they can test drive my Model Y and I tell them all about the pleasure of EV ownership (I'm a good at this). I have given test drives to countless people and as you know, once a person has driven a Tesla, they just have to have one. Well, the last two people to have driven my Tesla and sat through my spiel, they ordered right away. I just learned recently that these same last two people have cancelled their Model Y's and are ordering some other brand of EV. Both report that they are not buying Tesla's due to Elon's comments.

Just sayin'

 

[jabloomf1230]

If there are so many bots on Twitter does Elon really have 100 million followers? Stay tuned.

 

[oldTAVguy]

Ok, ok, I normally don't comment on this kind of stuff here. But, I belong to an EV group here in my town and the other members seem to send their friends my way so they can test drive my Model Y and I tell them all about the pleasure of EV ownership (I'm a good at this). I have given test drives to countless people and as you know, once a person has driven a Tesla, they just have to have one. Well, the last two people to have driven my Tesla and sat through my spiel, they ordered right away. I just learned recently that these same last two people have cancelled their Model Y's and are ordering some other brand of EV. Both report that they are not buying Tesla's due to Elon's comments.

Just sayin'

They will suffer the consequences of their decisions. They will/may eventually see they made a bad decision and hopefully re-evaluate their belief system. Could you give your thoughts on why the believe what they do?