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I disagreed because you have posted completely incorrect information. Corporate compensation practices vary widely and often consider tax implication in compensation choices. To my knowledge some such seemingly bizarre choices as these exist for sound reasons:
1. Unlimited First class air travel for employee, spouse and dependents;
2. Unlimited personal use of corporate aircraft fro employee and family;
(Those two are not at all uncommon, usually for security reasons, but not exclusively so)
3. Company pay for all alcoholic beverages use in company-paid housing which also includes every single expense associated with the residence in question.
4. Providing company owned yacht for any purpose chose by employee.
5. this ignores some such benefits for lifetime upon retirement.
The list goes on. All these benefits and others like them can easily be described as profligate and outrageous. All of them are sometimes prudent choices. Some of us posting here have been beneficiaries of some of these benefits. Nearly all of us are likely to think they were either cheaper or less risky than would be alternatives. Some of those also are explicitly tax beneficial ways to provide compensation.
Obviously, you might want to think about what ids and is not "illegitimate" and why.
In conclusion, without a doubt it is common to abuse such benefits and/or use them in unwise ways.
Were such to be extended to Mr. Musk it would not necessarily be unwise, but I doubt he'd have the slightest interest in a yacht. I know of one such case in which the yacht in question (a really huge one >50 meters) is profit making for the corporate owner. If I know of one, surely there must be quite a few in similar financial status.
If I were the board, I would give a complete blank check for him to use Tesla resources and money anyway he likes including for his personal pursuits. And I will put that in the contract.
I'm highly doubtful it will play out this way for a number of reasons, not the least of which is the lack of environmental accountability or transparency in Saudi Arabia. You have no idea what's happening behind the scenes and what isn't reported, this goes way beyond emissions.I am not suggesting they'll do that, or are otherwise virtuous, but they are one I would not count out. They'll probably be the last oil and gas giant standing, for no other reason than that their extraction cost and environmental price are both the most favorable globally.
Right now with no effort to be complete there are at least 14 minor currencies with clear TSLA imbalance, plus Renminbi, Mexican Peso, US$, and Euro which have major consequence continuously. This year and next year several more will adds Tesla expands distribution and sourcing.Do you disagree with my assessment - and vociferous gasp in one of this thread's prior avatars around 2014 when...Deepak Ahuja, I believe it was....revealed that Tesla did not hedge its currency exposure? Already by then Tesla was no bit player of smaller transactions.
...
Gary has added point # 5 to his Tesla catalysts: Buyback in October.
I find Gary to be very conservative; so this prediction of a buyback in October is a bit out of character.
My thinking is that Tesla would not entertain a buyback for a few years. Perhaps in early 2025 when cash on hand exceeds $80b.
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I'm not caught up on recent posts and I sense there could be some jest with this comment that I'm missing, but I will give my opinion at face value:Does this mean it’s still possible we could be at a PE ratio of 150 by end of year?
I'd be surprised if Elon would abandon a market segment to allow other manufacturers to survive. Doing so would require his confidence they they could execute well enough and I doubt he has that. Also, I think he's probably not real pleased with most the other OEMs.Abandoning the S and X would allow breathing room to other high end
EVs to survive and adopt Tesla’s master plan 1 .
Some people like large luxury vehicles, anyhow what does Elon drive?
This post is a prime example of why I don't block people.Weekend OT:
Took the family from Virginia to Quebec (about an hour north of Ottawa). The range on the Plaid (with 19” wheels) has been a real boon, its 396 mile range is actually way more useful and flexible than my old P100D’s 310 mile range. It makes a huge difference. I can’t charge at the cabin (too far from the nearest electrical outlet) so I need the charge to last through 2 weeks of random errands to get drinking water from the well or supplies from the general store. There are some slow chargers around, but I haven’t had to waste my time at them yet.
Speaking of charging speeds, on the drive up, the car was maxing out over 1,000 miles per hour at times at the newer superchargers. With two kids and a dog, at no point during the entire trip were we waiting for the car to finish charging - it was ALWAYS ready to go before we were. Dog Mode has come in handy a few times as well.
A few interesting features have surfaced on the trip. For example, the dash display automatically converts KPH speed limit signs to mph for you, so the signs on the visualization say “Speed Limit 62 Mph” when it’s 100kph.
Oh yeah and there’s a dude with a crotch rocket somewhere in Quebec who has a newly-acquired awe for the literally unbeatable acceleration of the Plaid at any speed.
Anyway, just wanna say this is easily the best family sedan ever built and I hope Tesla never stops making them.
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His beating the drum for buybacks seems to me like financial engineering merely to boost the stock price, and doesn't seem to be in tune with the Tesla mission.
Gary Black is extremely motivated for the stock price to rise.
He is responsible for not just himself, but all his fund owners.
Aside from that I have to say that for me, it was refreshing to have him say, "maybe some are maxxed out on buying and don't have an income stream to be buying at this time."
There has been very good discussion here on both buybacks, and buying more stock when it dips below all time highs.
Thank-you to all those of you who provide intelligent and informative information/discussion on this board.
And also thank you to the moderators.
That's sorted by market cap. Isn't someone going to mansplain to her that Market Cap isn't Enterprise Value?On a mission ..
THAT is the classic and appropriate use of - gasp! - derivatives. In these cases, a company will buy forward or sell forward one of the currencies in question: either its home unit or the overseas one. The duration will be the time for the transaction to be effected. So if a US-based company is buying an engineered product from Europe, to be delivered (or, more specifically, to be paid for) in 12 months, the way you ==>hedge!<== against the uncertainty of what the $/Euro exchange rate will be at that time is to buy forward Euros, or conceivably sell forward $s, also for that 12-month period. The corresponding action occurs if one expects to be selling one’s own product in a non-home currency location.
Very straightforward, very efficient, very safe, very inexpensive, very responsible. The Medicis did it, the Hanseatic League did it, the Lombards did it, and I have a vague recollection the Akkadians and Sumerians did it but I was a kid then and not paying close attention.
Their extraction costs are low because they have a pool of essentially slave laborers and a fully compliant society. But you gotta remember that compliance comes at a steep cost.
Next time Brent goes below $50 for a 6-9 month period, that may well unravel. People dramatically underestimate how tenuous the royal family's hold is on power there. Today it is absolute and it seems MBS can do anything he likes. The moment society wakes up to crude demand having peaked....the clock starts ticking.
I don't see any scenario where the Saudis are casually and efficiently pumping crude in 2030. Why and how would OPEC even exist by then? Without OPEC, it's every gal for herself. The market will certainly be flooded with supply for a multi-year period at some point between 2024 and 2029. And that's all she wrote IMO.
Gonna be ugly.
This is the large question for valuation and will likely be market dependent....
This thought process [predicted P/E] is entirely reliant on the macro environment....
competition has been trying to hurt tesla since inception, I would not give themNo, it wouldn’t. All it would do is put more ICE vehicles on the road for longer and slow BEV adoption.
Google already generates 70 billion Fcf while Amazon practically nothing.View attachment 831926
I just saw a Barron's segment with Jack Hough where he stated that he expects by the end of this decade, 4 companies will be delivering free cash flow of over $100B annually:
My forecast has Tesla achieving annual free cash flow of over $100B in 2028.
- Aramco (Saudi oil company)
- Apple
- Microsoft
- Amazon
I don't blame Mr. Hough for leaving out Tesla. Tesla has a short track record when it comes to its financial success . . .only 3 years. Unless you follow Tesla to the level many of us do on this site, it is difficult to believe that this success is sustainable throughout the decade.
Today, Tesla does not get the respect it deserves but I think this will change by the time we get to the back half of 2023 when Tesla's profits and free cash flow are too huge to ignore.
On a mission ..
The Decade Volcanoes are not imaginary and most people who live near one have learned to accept that at some point their entire city will be destroyed like Pompeii famously once was.Since it's the weekend...
Looks like Elon has identified a new risk for Tesla: volcano hell.
I wonder if we'll see it called out explicitly in the 2022Q2 10-Q, or just leave it lumped in with all the others.
The last 10-Q says:
Our operations could be adversely affected by events outside of our control, such as natural disasters, wars or health epidemics.
We may be impacted by natural disasters, wars, health epidemics, weather conditions, the long-term effects of climate change, power outages or other events outside of our control. For example, our Fremont Factory and Gigafactory Nevada are located in seismically active regions in Northern California and Nevada, and our Gigafactory Shanghai is located in a flood-prone area. Moreover, the area in which our Gigafactory Texas is located experienced severe winter storms in the first quarter of 2021 that had a widespread impact on utilities and transportation. If major disasters such as earthquakes, floods or other climate-related events occur, or our information system or communication breaks down or operates improperly, our headquarters and production facilities may be seriously damaged, or we may have to stop or delay production and shipment of our products. In addition, the global COVID-19 pandemic has impacted economic markets, manufacturing operations, supply chains, employment and consumer behavior in nearly every geographic region and industry across the world, and we have been, and may in the future be, adversely affected as a result. Also, the broader consequences in the current conflict between Russia and Ukraine, which may include further embargoes, regional instability and geopolitical shifts; airspace bans relating to certain routes, or strategic decisions to alter certain routes; and potential retaliatory action by the Russian government against companies, and the extent of the conflict on our business and operating results cannot be predicted. We may incur expenses or delays relating to such events outside of our control, which could have a material adverse impact on our business, operating results and financial condition.