Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[willow_hiller]

IMO the big issue with Powerwalls is the price vs amount of storage. Each PW is modest in size to facilitate handling/installation and mounting. That means redundant power management hardware in each unit, redundant housings, wiring connections, etc, all adding to cost. One thing I wonder-if Tesla is considering building whole-house heat pump systems, I wonder if they won't integrate battery storage with the heat pump. May make since, given that you now have one unit to install, rather than multiple ones.

This is what I hope the large horizontal rectangle in the "Upcoming products in 2023" would be: https://i.redd.it/lvdwtympc9la1.jpg

Some sort of integrated large-household scale LFP battery pack that mounts to the ground instead of a wall. With or without the heat pump, as it sounded like that wouldn't be a product released this year. Even just a large household battery would be a massive savings on coolant lines and power electronics compared to installing something like 4 individual Powerwalls.

 

[Speedr117]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned here I think:

Elon not happy that there are three standards of MY:
1 gigacasting
2 gigacastings
Structural battery

All factories will be updated in sync for 3rd gen.

The last two are the same. You need structural battery packs to use 2 gigacastings.

But to your point, having 2 different assemblies based on battery type is definitely not optimal!

 

[JRP3]

Elon is right because his head is in the future.

Except we live in the now and need current solutions before we even make it to the future. We are a long way from batteries being so cheap that the ability to tap into a 50kWh+ EV pack is meaningless.

 

[JRP3]

You need structural battery packs to use 2 gigacastings

I don't think that's technically accurate.

 

[TN Mtn Man]

This is what I hope the large horizontal rectangle in the "Upcoming products in 2023" would be: https://i.redd.it/lvdwtympc9la1.jpg

Some sort of integrated large-household scale LFP battery pack that mounts to the ground instead of a wall. With or without the heat pump, as it sounded like that wouldn't be a product released this year. Even just a large household battery would be a massive savings on coolant lines and power electronics compared to installing something like 4 individual Powerwalls.

Agreed, and installation and wiring should be a fraction of the cost. And again, hopefully having all that hardware pre-wired, as well as incorporating your inverters/disconnects from a solar array might make permitting that much simpler.

 

[lafrisbee]

Why do you think I drink beer instead? That H2O stuff is disgusting!

I used to teach a biology class. And before Spring Break I would give a lecture on fermentation with the following information about the waste products (piss and poop on a unicellular level) of yeast in fermentation.
"However, from the yeast's point of view, alcohol and carbon dioxide are waste products, and as the yeast continues to grow and metabolize in the sugar solution, the accumulation of alcohol will become toxic when it reaches a concentration between 14-18%, thereby killing the yeast cells."
To make the above action more understandable on a human level..it is exactly as if we were locked in this classroom and given all the food and water we desired, but had no way of removing ourselves or the waste from our bodies from this room. And eventually our own piss and poop would kill us.... Try not to think about on Spring Break. Yeast poop will help you not think about it... just don't consume too much of it or you'll end up like the yeast.

 

[TN Mtn Man]

I used to teach a biology class. And before Spring Break I would give a lecture on fermentation with the following information about the waste products (piss and poop on a unicellular level) of yeast in fermentation.
"However, from the yeast's point of view, alcohol and carbon dioxide are waste products, and as the yeast continues to grow and metabolize in the sugar solution, the accumulation of alcohol will become toxic when it reaches a concentration between 14-18%, thereby killing the yeast cells."
To make the above action more understandable on a human level..it is exactly as if we were locked in this classroom and given all the food and water we desired, but had no way of removing ourselves or the waste from our bodies from this room. And eventually our own piss and poop would kill us.... Try not to think about on Spring Break. Yeast poop will help you not think about it... just don't consume too much of it or you'll end up like the yeast.

Blocked LOL, don't bother me with facts, let me live with my cognitive reinforcement!

 

[Speedr117]

I don't think that's technically accurate.

I've never seen one shown or reported.

There are major difference in the bodies of the 2 versions. On the 2 gigacastings version, the sides that hold the front and back gigacastings together are downright flimsy. They NEED that structural pack for rigidity and to resist twisting. What I'm surprised at is they haven't figured out a way to make a 2170 pack strong enough to use with both castings. If they did, I think they'd stop producing the 1 gigacast version in a heartbeat!

 

[traxila]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1631644874335199233

Twice the size of Austin.

With a planned assembly line that has the smallest footprint ever designed?

I would guess long term plans here are for a minimum capacity of 5M per year.

 

[lafrisbee]

Back2good ol boy fixin the whole V2H thingee.
I got me one of them big ol fat electric extension cords with the funny 3-prong plugs. Have elon have an outlet for one on them on the cyber(nota)truck SO I can run my HVAC directly. Of course the HVAC will have to have an electrician fix it so you can unplug the HVAC from the Circuit box, and plug it into the Cyber(nota)truck so there's another 150 bucks.
Then give me another/two normal outlet(s) on the Cyber(nota)truck that can handle some serious heat at 110. And I'll just buy a thick extension cord to run into the house and plug a couple of power strips into it to run whatever I need in the house.
Something along those lines. less than $500 total, and now I got a usable "back-up" for the house after hurricanes, or the plan to run the cabin back up in the woods.

 

[wipster]

Tidal is not cost-effective against current power generation solutions, let alone where solar and batteries are trending to.

Kinetic energy is a lot weaker than our intuition makes us believe imagines. If you lift a cubic meter of water (1 ton) 100 meters up, that's only 0.27 kWh of gravitational potential energy. Hydro only makes sense when damming river in great reservoir basins.

Not cost-effective yet. Appreciate your input, but there are a number of potential solutions being worked upon, especially in Scotland. Here's a nice write up by the Sequim branch of my favorite lab, PNNL (operated by Battelle Memorial Institute for 70 years):

Tidal Energy | PNNL

www.pnnl.gov

 

[aubreymcfato]

Re Europe demand, without UK numbers we are already over 20k cars sold. Germany alone is 7711.
I believe it's already the second best second month of a quarter (first one is November 22, with 31k).

Wiki - Tesla Europe Registration Stats

This wiki belongs to the thread EU Market situation and outlook. Click HERE (CTRL-click to open in new tab) to add new data using a Google form. Any forum member can contribute. We encourage you to do so! Your entry will appear after the data is double-checked by other volunteers. If the data...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[JusRelax]

This video from Dave Lee explains a lot of things.

Coupled with some comments from Dave in another video that Gen3 seems to be "designed to be built by Optimus".

[snip]

I think both you and Dave are exactly on point with this. I'm pretty sure that Tesla was trying to get across that the 'Gen 3' platform is more specifically the philosophy of 'designing for automation'.

Early on in the presentation, when Lars and Franz were presenting, this was what got me to really perk my ears and listen carefully to the rest of the presentations. I remember later on checking on twitter really quickly to see what people were saying and was baffled that people were saying it was a snoozefest. I'm actually surprised this hasn't been discussed more anywhere, and I'm beginning to wonder if it's because it's just completely obvious to everyone else and I'm just a dolt for realizing that just now, for the first time, that Tesla would be designing a car with automation in mind. Go back and listen to Franz's part of the presentation near the beginning, starting at 58 minutes in.

Gen 1 (S+X) = 'Design first, then engineer the vehicle, then figure out how to manufacture it'

Gen 2 (3+Y) = 'Design with engineering and manufacturing in mind' (actually, not just in mind, but literally in the meetings/discusssions when designing the vehicle), then try for automation, leading to production hell

Gen 3 = 'Design with engineering, manufacturing, and automation in mind'

 

[Speedr117]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1631644874335199233

Twice the size of Austin.

With a planned assembly line that has the smallest footprint ever designed?

I would guess long term plans here are for a minimum capacity of 5M per year.

Lost in translation is my bet. The LAND SIZE is twice that of Giga Texas.

 

[GOVA]

Tom Zhu is aiming to build GigaMexico in under 9 months time, breaking the Shanghai record according to government officials.

I am sure there is more to it, but Mr. Samuel Garcia, The Governor of Nuevo Leon is 35 years old.

I really think that the 'talk' at any level is MUCH smoother to get stuff done. Also and obviously they aren't associated with any US parties and unions.

Samuel Garcia

 

[Unpilot]

TSLA investors may be interested in this petition...

This petition is submitted on behalf of retail stockholders who are actively seeking answers and corrective measures regarding the unfair and tyrannical actions that are being seen within the United States stock markets. For far too long, multiple startup companies and veteran companies alike have had their stock price manipulated through the exploitation of certain loopholes in regulations surrounding the practices of naked short-selling, FTDs, phantom shares, and dark pool abuses. While these issues may not seem important to you all, we the army of retail shareholders represented by this petition, are beyond frustrated by the destruction of our investment value due to these manipulative practices at the hands of wall street insiders.

We the retail investors understand that there is an inherent risk with any investments we make. Losing money is a common occurrence in the stock market. However, the exploitation of the naked short-selling regulations undermines the integrity of the US stock markets and jeopardizes investors' trust in market fairness. After the financial crisis in 2008, naked shorting became illegal. The SEC is charged with the responsibility of keeping markets fair for all and delivering oversight of its own policies and regulations.

Sign the Petition

Stop Illegal Naked Shorting

www.change.org

Signed

 

[wipster]

Tidal streams are the best source of tidal energy, not tidal rise/fall, and should be competitive with wind power once scaled.

Downside compared to wind is maintenance needed in order to clean marine growth. Upside is greater power/area and totally predictable intermittency.

Agreed. Not to belabor this on a day when the SP is rising, but it's the rise/fall that creates the tidal streams to a large part, especially in inlets and bays. While I've seen buoys that take advantage of wave power, they're not the big solution that tidal streams afford.

 

[CHGolferJim]

I am sure there is more to it, but Mr. Samuel Garcia, The Governor of Nuevo Leon is 35 years old.

I really think that the 'talk' at any level is MUCH smoother to get stuff done. Also and obviously they aren't associated with any US parties and unions.

Samuel Garcia

Like most places, there is strong inter-regional competition in Mexico (with a relatively weak national government). A Mexican friend wrote me a few days ago “…….our president almost blew it.”

 

[JoRoMo]

?

Doesn’t matter if it turns out to be harder than anticipated; it’ll get done. So being nervous about something that eventually gets done seems silly at best.

That’s just my kind of patience - HODL.

 

[Cosmacelf]

48 VDC actuators also make sense for Optimus; gotta wonder if the commonality there doesn't have some effect on the 48V decision. I don't remember what code it is (UL?) but under 50 VDC is considered less of a health and safety issue than higher voltages. Been standard in telcom for a long time from what I understand.

Many of us have Power over Ethernet (PoE) in our homes which delivers 48V at up to 70 watts or so depending on the specific variant over twisted pair cabling (cat 5). There are special variants for automotive use. So I wonder if Tesla is using some variant of this standard for combined communications and power cabling?

Anyone know the power draw for various 12V components in a modern car? 70W may very well be way too little.

Ive also heard rumors that in the future Tesla may use wireless communications for some of the internal car module communications. Afterall, the tire pressure sensors are already wireless…