Tesla Turns Off AEB In New Cars Produced Since July

[bcsteeve]

Will the car deliberately ignore the threat it successfully identified?

I dunno, will it?

Tesla ignores brick walls in front of them if the driver chooses (if that's the right word) to use the wrong pedal from a standstill. Tesla defends it vigorously stating the driver is in control. That's insane - in my view - because anybody that wants to accelerate quickly into a solid object clearly isn't of sound mind and, therefore, is not "in control".

Point is... no car is perfect and I wouldn't make logical leaps - as sound as they may seem - and I'd like to know for sure.

 

[brianman]

I didn't realize the "Front Crash Prevention" main section was a result on its own.

Which brings up another point. You won't be the only one to do this. It highlights another point -- if ACC is not standard equipment on the Volt, then saying broadly "Volt scored 6 points" is incorrect.

 

[bcsteeve]

Thank you sir for coming to my defense. Yes he is name calling and being fairly rude and insulting. It reflects badly on him more than anything, but I understand that it's not really "him" posting here but more his online persona, as I'm sure he's actually not like this in person. Therefore I'm not offended.

I'm shaking my head a bit... flabbergasted that you feel I was rude and insulting or that you needed defending, especially for the post you quoted me in. I congratulated you! Sure, I offered you some unsolicited advice, but I wasn't rude about it.

Sorry if you felt otherwise.

 

[bonnie]

I'm shaking my head a bit... flabbergasted that you feel I was rude and insulting or that you needed defending, especially for the post you quoted me in. I congratulated you! Sure, I offered you some unsolicited advice, but I wasn't rude about it.

Good reply, didn't escalate things further . So congrats on being an adult. I wouldn't let it bother me (and it seems like you're just brushing it off, too). We have some forum members who like to stir the proverbial pot.

 

[bcsteeve]

Which brings up another point. You won't be the only one to do this. It highlights another point -- if ACC is not standard equipment on the Volt, then saying broadly "Volt scored 6 points" is incorrect.

Exactly right, but he did earlier say he was referring to a fully optioned car.

 

[McRat]

...
For the 25mph test, you get 3 pts if you reduce the speed by 22+mph -- meaning you're going at 3- mph afterwards.

...

High-speed autobrake
In the 25 mph IIHS test, this vehicle avoided a collision. 3 points (emphasis mine).

No impact speed is means impact was reduced to none. But you could get 3 points if your car hit at under 3 mph. Some cars will not even show damage at less than 3 mph.

 

[brianman]

High-speed autobrake
In the 25 mph IIHS test, this vehicle avoided a collision. 3 points (emphasis mine).

No impact speed is means impact was reduced to none. But you could get 3 points if your car hit at under 3 mph. Some cars will not even show damage at less than 3 mph.

I believe you're interpreting the "avoid a collision" as an assertion of fact rather than a conclusion. I'm reading it otherwise. The page with that quote doesn't look to me like a fact page but rather a conclusion page. Perhaps I'm misreading, but it gives me very little confidence that there is guesswork and interpretation required to identify facts vs. conclusions. /shrug

 

[oktane]

I'm shaking my head a bit... flabbergasted that you feel I was rude and insulting or that you needed defending, especially for the post you quoted me in. I congratulated you! Sure, I offered you some unsolicited advice, but I wasn't rude about it.

Sorry if you felt otherwise.

Apology accepted, I assumed you weren't purposefully being insulting. Facial expressions, tone of voice, non-verbal expressions all get lost in posts.

 

[Canuck]

There was no EAP-like bs in his [Steve Job's] playbook.

No but there were other things, many other things. We're all humans with faults. Human with faults running corporations with the primary motive being greed (aka profits) will lead to problems. Apple has many. No one has to install suicide nets at Tesla's factories.

I’d take Jobs any day to run Tesla.

I'm sure you would, and as a holder of TSLA I probably should too, but I don't, probably because of things like this that he did...

Among the first things Jobs did in his 1997 return to Apple (after he banished all styluses) was to end Apple's philanthropic giving programs. He said he wanted to bring Apple back to profitability, but he never reinstated the programs even after Apple posted some of the biggest profits ever recorded by a public company.

You'd never get this from Jobs:
Tesla signs letter promising to give $37.5 million for education
Yes, Tesla got tax breaks, but that's because they decided not to build their factories overseas like Jobs did.

Jobs wasn’t running 3 other companies and running around banging models.

You say that like it's a bad thing...

 

[Cloxxki]

Tesla probably figures all there software is there to add safety. So it's always better to upload to cars and wait for inevitable bfeedback if it'snot up to standards. Even if they have to read it in the headlines, they're still going to be 40% safer than without the software, right? And since the cage is safer, what the whole rish now anyway if things go sideways for a buyer? Very hard to get killed, and some of the time an accident will be averted all together.
Just let the "fleet" test the new release and recall as needed. Try some adjustments in the next release. We'll get there, we're on the cutting edge!

Just the way their lane keeping performance goes on and off from one version to the other alone shows that they have no clue what'll work for customers and what won't. If they even have a test fleet beyond the proverbial "Elon's car" with his daily fixed route commute, are those cars technically representative for the actual fleet with consumers at the wheel and in the jump seats?
I would not be too surprised if an otherwise terrible AP version works flawlessly on Elon's commute, morning and evening. Let's hope I'm gravely exaggerating.

 

[timvracer]

Me too... brutal.

But somnambule is making all my points for me.

Keep it up somnambule, you are saving me time, that's for sure! I am a techie too, maybe that is why.

Oh man that was painful.

I started reading this thread and I had a couple of points to make about some early comments. Then I figured I'd better read the whole thing to make sure my points weren't already made or refuted or whatever. So for some reason I exhaustively read through this entire mess, despite having important work to do.

Now I'm here and I can't even remember what the points were I was going to make.

But make no mistake. They were good points. It would have shut you all down.

Why am I posting? Because having read through all that BS, I feel entitled. Entitlement seems to be a common theme here, so why not?

 

[timvracer]

Now BCSTEEVE is making all my points for me!! You rock dude.

This thread has gotten easy for me, with some rational logical folks making the points I'd want to make. Thank you.

Since you are very prone to making leaps in logic and assumptions, you might want to check into that a bit before deciding... I'm pretty sure you're compensated for distress at the time the class is defined. Whether or not you sell subsequently shouldn't matter. Of course check into that first, but I think if you want out, you can get out and still be a full member of the class.

That's if you actually own the car. You seem to have a lot of time to spend complaining on a forum about a rich-man's car having rich-man's problems and about even richer-man's cars that you'd buy instead had you don't what most rich-men learned a long time ago... research. Maybe you were born stupidly rich or maybe you lucked into money... in either case, shrug your shoulders and hand the keys to some bum and move on. If you earned your money, you had to have gotten there somehow. If you made a mistake with your purchase then cut your losses and move one.

 

[timvracer]

Steve is my hero

Sure thing!

On this IIHS page it says only: and on the main report page for the Model S, it is even more subtle (you'd be forgiven to miss it) because all it says is: That's when you click on the Roof Strength tab and view the score.

Again, no "data" of any kind to make a proper evaluation on. Only that vague summary with zero opportunity to evaluate their methodology.

I'd *love* to see a more in-depth report! I couldn't find it.

 

[timvracer]

No, he is talking facts and presenting very clear arguments. Engage him with data and arguments back rather than finding the first excuse to disengage and label him as rude and insulting.

Thank you sir for coming to my defense. Yes he is name calling and being fairly rude and insulting. It reflects badly on him more than anything, but I understand that it's not really "him" posting here but more his online persona, as I'm sure he's actually not like this in person. Therefore I'm not offended.

 

[wdolson]

Would it?

Just from recent news:
1. Some Chevy Bolts apparently have faulty cells that can completely disable the car without warning (link)
2. Ford Explorers apparently allow carbon monoxide to enter the cabins (link)
3. Honda Accords are apparently catching fire due to faulty battery sensors (link)
4. Toyota Tacomas are apparently stalling (link)
5. Hyundais and Kias apparently have engines that can fail while driving (link)

I would argue these are all far more serious than a planned, temporary disabling of AEB and, yet, none are generating the sort of catastrophic customer reactions you seem to suggest would ensue.

The reality is that people realize that anyone's products can have faults and may, at times need to be fixed.

Some Jeeps can be hacked and taken over
How to hack a Jeep Cherokee – but don’t try this at home, kids

 

[bcsteeve]

Steve is my hero

Holy crap, I think that's a first! lol

So long as I didn't miss the sarcasm bus.... tyvm

 

[Swift]

Are you suggesting poor people's lives matter less?

What are you smoking? Where did that come from?

A list was provided of relatively inexpensive vehicles with AEB and other safety systems. I noted that the Tesla’s in question cost far more and yet have problems with AEB among many other things.

 

[Swift]

Agreed. If companies shipped product before they were 100% ready for prime time with no major issues, we wouldn't have hardly any products. We certainly wouldn't have computers or software. Besides, even thorough testing cannot simply be done ahead of time. You can only hope to get most obvious issues fixed ahead of time. Once again, several people are not thinking logically. Do I want it tested as much as possible? Sure. But do I want to wait 100 years to get it? No. So do reasonable amounts of testing.

Thankfully the aircraft manufacturers don’t take that approach. Since our kids ride in these cars, I expect vehicle manufacturers to hold themselves to a similar standard.

 

[Swift]

This statement is clearly not correct.

Tell the airplane manufacturers and automakers to not release a product until they got it right. There are still crashes due to hardware/design failures. Everyone accepts some level of risk when using a man made vehicle.

I’d reread the statement as it relates to the manufacturing of aircraft. Here it is again, note the emphasis on major issues and obvious issues.

Agreed. If companies shipped product before they were 100% ready for prime time with no major issues, we wouldn't have hardly any products. We certainly wouldn't have computers or software. Besides, even thorough testing cannot simply be done ahead of time. You can only hope to get most obvious issues fixed ahead of time.

Yeah right. Remind me not to fly your airline.

 

[somnambule]

What are you smoking? Where did that come from?

A list was provided of relatively inexpensive vehicles with AEB and other safety systems. I noted that the Tesla’s in question cost far more and yet have problems with AEB among many other things.

The list of vehicles were about important safety issues in the news recently to point out that the claim that these sorts of things only happen with Tesla is false. Those issues are not related to AEB in those vehicles (they are far more basic and serious).

Perhaps I read too much into your response, and for that I apologize. It appears the matter is much simpler -- you didn't even understand my post to begin with.