VPP as peaker plant replacement is certainly the pitch to PoCo's but as a ratepayer I get bombarded by ads from VPP players like OhmConnect that only talk about preventing blackout and get paid doing it. When I look into it there are many complaints about OhmConnect. So, VPP still sounds like a theoretical idea that looks great on paper but not so much in practice so far.
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Tesla Virtual Power Plant in CA
- Thread starter power.saver
- Start date
VPP as peaker plant replacement is certainly the pitch to PoCo's but as a ratepayer I get bombarded by ads from VPP players like OhmConnect that only talk about preventing blackout and get paid doing it. When I look into it there are many complaints about OhmConnect. So, VPP still sounds like a theoretical idea that looks great on paper but not so much in practice so far.
Tesla is the Power Plant. All of our batteries comprise the Virtual Power Plant.
In Massachusetts it seems that the end user can reap substantial monetary rewards. I saw one video that claimed he had received $2000 in one year, and that wasn't even the point of the video.
In California, Elon Musk says "the Tesla Virtual Power Plant is a public good program to support the California grid, and there is no compensation for Tesla or customers." That is for the higher Demand Response reimbursement. "Tesla expects most events this summer to occur during typical peak hours for many time-of-use rate plans. Participating in the event will shift energy exports to periods that are later in the day compared to typical exports. If you are eligible for compensation under a NEM program, you may earn different credit for exporting at different times."
To answer your question, in California, I don't think you will see the "$2/kWh" rate, but you will see the NEM credit.
I currently push energy back to the grid when solar PV is producing while using my battery to power the house during Peak times. The VPP would let me push energy to the grid, probably later in peak time when my PV is not generating, and collect Peak NEM rates.
I think OhmConnect is collecting the Demand Response dollars and giving you nothing but the thermostat that they need to control your AC.
They aren't a VPP. They are a consumer able to shift demand, just like JuiceNet.
OhmConnect not VPP? You should tell them that:
This energy company makes a ‘virtual power plant’ by using smart devices to shrink demand
When electricity use spikes, utilities usually fire up more polluting power plants. OhmConnect’s Resi-Station—a winner of Fast Company’s 2021 World Changing Ideas Awards—uses smart devices and cash incentives to push down demand instead.
A little buzzword marketing fluff.OhmConnect not VPP? You should tell them that:
This energy company makes a ‘virtual power plant’ by using smart devices to shrink demand
When electricity use spikes, utilities usually fire up more polluting power plants. OhmConnect’s Resi-Station—a winner of Fast Company’s 2021 World Changing Ideas Awards—uses smart devices and cash incentives to push down demand instead.www.fastcompany.com
They don't produce any energy. They are not a Power Plant. They are a proxy to a large consumer base, able to shift their load.
I would say that in California, they would be a "Proxy demand resource - load shift resource (PDR-LSR)".
They are trying to raise funds.
"We’re just a peaker power plant, except instead of being a physical thing, we’re a network of homes and their devices," DeVries told GTM. "This is the cheapest, fastest and most environmentally conscious way to get that supply."
followed by
"Companies including Sunrun have pioneered a similar concept, linking up homes with solar and batteries into a virtual power plant that can respond to grid-capacity needs. "
One of them is producing energy that can be applied to the grid, the other is shifting load, and calling it supplying.
"OhmConnect will dispatch the fleet of connected devices to deliver capacity to the grid." I'm at a loss what capacity they are delivering. if I wanted to word that more cleverly I might say "return capacity to the grid", and that would even be a stretch.
OhmConnect are a DRP (Demand Response Participant). They're basically a virtual power plant but they do pay participants. Over the last 4 years I've received 1099s from them in total amount > $12,000. Virtually all of that was from reducing my use during OhmHours. Although the model has changed it's still to earn decent cash and the program is 100% free.
We've been signed up for the California VPP beta since July. After upgrading to app version 4.0.1, we were asked to reconfirm our enrollment in the program, which has since been rebranded "Tesla & PG&E Virtual Power Plant Beta." There is new info in the app regarding the program and an updated support page. The biggest updates are that we will receive $1 for every additional kWh we provide during an "event," and that there will at least 20 hours of events in 2021.
Something interesting is that the support page states that compensation depends on number of Powerwalls, Backup Reserve setting, size of the solar system, and "Your Powerwall's typical behavior, since the program only pays for incremental kWh excluding the energy that your Powerwall would have delivered in the absence of an event." Sounds like the Self-Powered mode will likely result in the greatest compensation. Also, during the reconfirmation process we had to choose to prioritize either the VPP program or Storm Watch.
Something interesting is that the support page states that compensation depends on number of Powerwalls, Backup Reserve setting, size of the solar system, and "Your Powerwall's typical behavior, since the program only pays for incremental kWh excluding the energy that your Powerwall would have delivered in the absence of an event." Sounds like the Self-Powered mode will likely result in the greatest compensation. Also, during the reconfirmation process we had to choose to prioritize either the VPP program or Storm Watch.
My Android is still at 21.20.6, and I don't see a change in my "VPP Beta", but I did notice a new "Pair Phone to Powerwall", part of testing "off-grid", which required toggling the Powerwall power switch.
I am served by PG&E, but billed through Sonoma Clean Power.
Weird. The help screen shows 21.12.2 -> 3.10.14 -> 4.0.0.
I don't see the 4.0.0 features, but I do see the 3.10.4 VPP.
Upon further review... the opening screen says 21.20.6, but Settings says 3.10.14.
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Interesting. I just upgraded to app version 4.0.1, and I still have the old Tesla Virtual Power Plant (beta) option. It sounds like the newer program is compensated relative to a baseline similar to demand reduction programs like OhmConnect. I'll be interested to hear how it works out.
I'm totally not clear how this program works. If I enable it in the app, who pays me the $1 for each kwh that gets put onto the grid from my system during an event. If it happens during peak time solar production, do I only get paid the extra for discharge from the powerwalls or from solar as well? Does Tesla's software make it so that during an event I'd self consume solar while my powerwall discharges to the grid or does it not count unless you're also sending all your solar to the grid first? What if your own usage is high at the time? Do you get paid $1kwh for each kwh or is there some cap or is the $1kwh a maximum and it could be a lot less?
Curious to hear more also. We opted in a few weeks back and turned off storm watch since we are on the same section as the fire Département and so don’t usually have long outages and don’t want to charge of the grid at non offpeak times. Firmware 21.20.6 and vpp says beta.
Have not seen any alerts / events.
Have not seen any alerts / events.
jhn_
Member
I don’t have a lot of answers, but can relay our experiences in the VPP here in New England with Tesla.
Tesla pays us the compensation, twice a year.
And we get credit for the kWh our house uses in the “event” as well as what is sent to the grid during the event. All solar being generated and full discharge from every battery during the event with your house load covered first then remainder (bulk) going to the grid.
This happened (is happening) today. I'm not sure why the Powerwalls aren't running my house as they normally would during peak (EV2-A with Marin Clean Energy). AFAICT my Powerwalls are just sitting in standby. This feature isn't working the way I thought it would (or else there's a bug), but I'm just curious enough to let it go for awhile...for science.
Bruce.
Bruce.
Did you recently use the app to select a utility and then applied the TOU settings to the Powerwall Time Based Control?
When I did this, my Powerwalls did not respond to the Peak period even though the settings were correct in the app display. I reentered them as a custom setting and then the PWs worked correctly the next day
Note: I am still on the 4.1.1 version of the app.
I'm seeing exactly the same behavior here in South Bay. Interestingly, the notification said a new VPP is scheduled for tomorrow from 6-9pm but the app shows it is running right now. My PW is on standby vs discharging at this peak rate time.
How did you get that notification? I don’t recall seeing one (app notifications do usually work for me).
I‘m on 4.2. The scheduling has been working fine except for today.
Bruce.
do they pay you via check sent in the mail? how much you were compensated each time? just curious on the potential of joining...
jhn_
Member
The VPP events take precedent over your scheduling. When an event is scheduled, for some point later but not more than 24 hours in the future the Powerwalls will try to fill up from any available solar, once filled then they will sit at 100% until the events starts and your house will run off of solar and grid.
For us in New England this makes sense since the compensation is way greater than the cost of electricity during the “prep” time. Not sure about the compensation in CA evening things out for you.
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